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A real-world Vista challenge: Can this Sony Vaio be saved?

By | March 2, 2008, 1:00pm PST

Summary: For nearly a year, Jeremy Toeman has been chronicling his experiences with Windows Vista running on a pricey high-end Sony Vaio. In a word, it has sucked. (He’s now replaced his Sony with a MacBook.) So we worked out a deal. Jeremy’s sending the infernal Vaio to me, and I’m sending him a Dell notebook that’s running Vista without issues. My goal is to restore the factory Vista install on that Sony and see its suckiness up close and personal. Can its problems be fixed, or are Sony’s engineers just clueless?

I’ve been reading Jeremy Toeman’s LIVEdigitally for ages. He’s got impressive digital media credentials (former VP of Sling Media, co-founder of Mediabolic) and geek cred (self-described “marketing guy” for Bug Labs, which won a CNET Best in Show award at CES this year).A real-world Vista challenge: Can this Sony Vaio be saved?

Jeremy has done an excellent job of chronicling his experiences with Windows Vista running on a pricey high-end Sony Vaio. In a word, it has sucked. In fact, his experience pegged out his suckiness meter and inspired him to (a) switch to a MacBook and (b) remind everyone who reads his blog, at least twice a week (I might be exaggerating a little, but not much) that Sony makes the world’s worst PCs and they should not under any circumstance consider buying one. Even now, nearly six months after setting the Sony aside, he is still nursing some wounds. (I’ll describe the entire history in just a minute.)

So when I saw another reference to the Vaio on Jeremy’s blog last week, I left a comment:

Jeremy, do you still have that Sony? If so, I’d love to take a look at it and figure out why it sucks so bad. (Maybe help some future Sony victi^H^H customers.)

After a brief exchange of e-mail, we worked out a deal. Jeremy’s sending the infernal Vaio to me, and in exchange I’m sending him a Dell notebook with a dual-boot installation of Windows Vista SP1 and Windows XP SP2. I’ve been using the Dell for more than a year, and it’s been a solid performer (ironically, it has a Vista Capable logo on it, plus an Intel Core Duo logo). My goal is to restore the factory Vista install on that Sony and see its suckiness up close and personal. Can its problems be fixed, or are Sony’s engineers just clueless? I’ll post my full results here, and Jeremy will document his experiences on his blog. (His first post is up now: Do Sony Vaios really suck, or is it just me?)

Now, this is not the first time I have heard Sony’s Vista-powered PCs described in less-than flattering terms. Walt Mossberg of the Wall Street Journal has a Sony Vaio as well, purchased a month or two earlier than Jeremy’s. He writes about its sluggish start-up times regularly, as I’ve noted before. (In fact, Apple was so happy with the comparison that they used a quote from Mossberg’s column in a recent “Hi, I’m a PC. And I’m a Mac.” ad.)

When Mossberg got his Vaio in April 2007, he described the experience of getting started as “irritating” and “a big hassle.” He called the machine “slow” and called out Sony for its “lack of respect for the consumer.” Six months later, in his review of OS X Leopard, Mossberg still had harsh words for the Vaio:

I compared a MacBook Pro laptop with Leopard preinstalled to a Sony Vaio laptop with Vista preinstalled. Even though I had cleared out all of the useless trial software Sony had placed on the Vaio, it still started up painfully slowly compared with the Leopard laptop.

It took the Vista machine nearly two minutes to perform a cold start and be ready to run, including connecting to my wireless network. The Leopard laptop was up, running and connected to the network in 38 seconds. In a test of restarting the two laptops after they had been running an email program, a Web browser and a word processor, the Sony with Vista took three minutes and 29 seconds, while the Apple running Leopard took one minute and five seconds.

Mossberg’s odyssey parallels Jeremy’s, which started innocently enough, in May 2007, when he replaced a stolen notebook with the Sony Vaio. After two hours of copying data files and installing and uninstalling software:

Overall experience was pretty good. I have no real complaints about Vista other than it is a lot clunkier than it should be - what I mean is there’s no good reason for the clunkiness.

Three weeks later, the honeymoon had definitely ended:

My brand new laptop, as in the one that came with Vista pre-installed, shipped with out-of-date drivers. Let me see if that point is clear enough here. I bought a laptop, in the store, took it home, turned it on. Wrong drivers. Imagine buying a car, at a dealer, and they left the wrong tires on it.

It’s taken me a couple of weeks, but now I can proudly say that my brand-spanking-new laptop no longer crashes when I close the lid, nor do I lose the right-mouse button for hours on end. Anymore.

Clearly my productivity is at an all-time high.

A system recovery at the end of June (full details here) resulted in at least one bizarre error message but seemed to make things “much, much better.”

But not for long.

By August 8, the Sony was toast and the Macbook was in the house. Jeremy’s report:

I couldn’t take it anymore.

Seriously, I started counting the amount of seconds-to-minutes of “waiting for Vista” I was spending every day. 30-120 seconds from sleeping to awake. 5+ minutes to dock/undock. 10-60 seconds to go to sleep. 5-10 minutes from hibernate. 2-3 minutes to connect to a new network. Utterly intolerable.

I don’t know if it’s Sony’s fault or Microsoft’s, but I don’t care.

Since then, Jeremy tells me, the Sony has gone mostly unused. I’m really looking forward to spending some hands-on time with this Vaio, and I’ll let you know what I find out.

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Topics

Ed Bott is an award-winning technology writer with more than two decades' experience writing for mainstream media outlets and online publications.

Disclosure

Ed Bott

Ed Bott is a freelance technical journalist and book author. All work that Ed does is on a contractual basis.

Since 1994, Ed has written more than 25 books about Microsoft Windows and Office. Along with various co-authors, Ed is completely responsible for the content of the books he writes. As a key part of his contractual relationship with publishers, he gives them permission to print and distribute the content he writes and to pay him a royalty based on the actual sales of those books. Ed's books written prior to fall 2011 have been distributed by Que Publishing (a division of Pearson Education) and by Microsoft Press. As of November 2011, Ed is a partner in the independent publishing company Fair Trade Digital Exchange, which exclusively publishes his books.

On occasion, Ed accepts consulting assignments. In recent years, he has worked as an expert witness in cases where his experience and knowledge of Microsoft and Microsoft Windows have been useful. In each such case, his compensation is on an hourly basis, and he is hired as a witness, not an advocate.

Ed does not own stock or have any other financial interest in Microsoft or any other software company. He owns 500 shares of stock in EMC Corporation, which was purchased before the company's acquisition of VMware. In addition, he owns 350 shares of stock in Intel Corporation, purchased more than two years ago. All stocks are held in retirement accounts for long-term growth.

Ed does not accept gifts from companies he covers. All hardware products he writes about are purchased with his own funds or are review units covered under formal loan agreements and are returned after the review is complete.

Biography

Ed Bott

Ed Bott is an award-winning technology writer with more than two decades' experience writing for mainstream media outlets and online publications. He's served as editor of the U.S. edition of PC Computing and managing editor of PC World; both publications had monthly paid circulation in excess of 1 million during his tenure. He is the author of more than 25 books on Microsoft Windows and Office, including the recently released Windows 7 Inside Out.

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Linux / Vista as a Dual Boot
cpt_slog@... 23rd Jul 2008
I agree with the comments above, try Linux, even as a live cd where you don't have to mess about with installation or partitions. I can almost guarantee within 30 minutes at the outside you'll see Vista in a different light, and not a favourable one.

My own story is that I bout a new Lenovo laptop (2GB Ram, dual core 1.7 GHZ) that came with Vista Home Premium. It sucked. After turning it on and watching the sidebar CPU applet I was horrified to see my system idling (doing nothing) at 40% CPU.

Naturally I tracked down and removed the crapware, and found the system responded better, but it was still a far cry from what I was expecting. This configuration with XP SP2 would fly; under Vista it was just painful. I don't know exactly what Vista is doing under the hood, but it is simply too slow for what it offers. And don't even get me started on the subject on incompatible software that runs just fine on XP SP2.

As a result I ran a Linux Live CD, and later installed it as a dual boot option. Now I know what an OS is supposed to respond like on a reasonably powerful machine. I still have the dual boot configuration, but that is temporary. I'll be yet another long time Windows user switching to Linux permanently.
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DDanster
ddanboyle@... 2nd Mar 2008
I also own a Vaio.

First order of business is to get rid of all the CRAPWARE sony installs on your PC. I'm talking about over a dozen different pieces of software that some vendor pays sony to install on your brand-spanking new Vaio.

After ganking all the crapware, it did perform better.
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Some smart vendor somewhere should start offering an option, or a line of PC's that ship purely with stock windows on them. No crapware. None.

No offers for dialup that no one wants.

No free trials of a dozen things you don't need.

No layers of oem-ware on top of stuff the OS already knows how to do.

I think iBuyPower can give you a PC loaded roughly like that, but one of the majors could still make major waves by offering it.

Setup would be easier, the computer would be more reliable and run faster... customers would be happier. You'd sell enough additional volume to more than make up for whatever pennies per unit they got from the crapware.
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The problem is...
JDThompson 3rd Mar 2008
spark555 wrote:

Some smart vendor somewhere should start offering an option, or a line of PC's that ship purely with stock windows on them. No crapware. None.

The margins on PC hardware are so small that the income derived from placing crapware on the desktop often comprises a significant fraction of the manufacturer's profit.
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Filling the niche...
Wolfie2K3 3rd Mar 2008
Some smart vendor somewhere should start offering an option, or a line of PC's that ship purely with stock windows on them. No crapware. None.

No offers for dialup that no one wants.

No free trials of a dozen things you don't need.

No layers of oem-ware on top of stuff the OS already knows how to do.


Dell already offers computers for this particular market - the Vostro line is aimed at small to medium business' that want a decent machine with little to no garbage to get rid of. Something you can plug in, install what you need and get on with life.

Their Vostro laptops are pretty decent for the money. They feel fairly solid, not cheap or flimsy. The OS is fairly clean - only comes with their Dell assistant program preloaded.
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Dell has a crapware free option
marks055@... 6th Mar 2008
I bought a Dell Inspiron 1420 last year off the Oulet store they have. Basic bare bones software install no anti-virus, no trial ware of any kind. It was great deal and the machine smokes with a few options dedicated graphics,2.2 ghz, 2gb ram and a 7200 rpm HD.
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Snap
Harry Bardal 2nd Mar 2008
That sound you hear is the sound of a new kind of
benchmark. It's one where the larger experience of
computer use forms the criteria for opinion, not a Windows
"self analysis" or a frame rate on Crysis.

Is this becoming clear? What's wrong with the Vaio? An
explosion in complexity? A hardware glitch? Open
architecture itself?

Who cares.

It's broken, it doesn't work, and the company(s) that sold it
will not get return business from thinking users.
Professional people are not interested in hobby kits. We
simply don't have time for endless troubleshooting.
Another attempt to blow smoke, shuffle blame, misdirect,
or mitigate is truly unhelpful. When it's coming from a
myopic and Windows centric source, it is conspicuously
self serving.

In 2008, a switch to Apple is effectively never reversed.
This particular benchmark has to be addressed before any
more intra-Windows slap fights go on. To have any
credibility in this year's dialogue around technology, there
is a new requirement. One must engage in some level of
peer review between competing commercial systems. Any
blog that presume to champion the user has to answer one
question before any other.

To switch, or not to switch, that is the question.
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I don't think you get it
Jhaks 2nd Mar 2008
Who cares? A lot of people do care about making correct decisions; knowing what is wrong is the first step in making informed decisions and being and intelligent person/consumer. That is the whole point of this experiment / analysis; to find out what is really wrong with this computer. If people unintelligently point fingers then they become part of the ignorant masses.

Recently my older cousin came to me saying his Vista laptop had a problem where Outlook 07 was performing very slowly, taking 2-3 seconds to load messages, open reply windows and open menus. Influenced by the negative press surrounding Vista he deduced that because Outlook worked for him on XP that Vista must just suck. This is the typical shallow minded assessment. I asked him what particularly he had heard about Vista and why specifically it "sucked". He just said he had read it sucked. I fixed the problem which turned out to be the integration of Google Desktop into Outlook. Google Desktop came pre-installed on the system and after un-installing it everything was working nearly instantaneously. I didn't say anything to him about his previous unwarranted finger pointing but I hope he learns not to make rash uninformed judgments anymore.

As for the the comparison of Macs and PCs, sometimes Macs are just not suited for certain situations and are not feasible for some people. I think all these different OSs are fine and have their own respective positives and negatives but this is obviously not that discussion.
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Google Desktop
itpro_z 2nd Mar 2008
I have yet to run into a machine with Google Desktop that did not run like a molasses in January (Vista and XP). After uninstalling the Google crapware, those systems ran fine. It is now my standard procedure to remove all Google crap from our PCs, other than perhaps the toolbar. Even the toolbar goes if the user can't give me a reason why they need it. Google is certainly not the only offender, but is definitely one of the worst.

I have asked the question many times on various Vista threads about why someone's particular PC runs so poorly with Vista. The invariable answer is that "Vista sucks", yet in my experience it is generally caused by something else, like the Google Desktop. I admit that it might take some modicum of skill to diagnose why a PC does not run well, but for many it is just easier to trash Vista, or perhaps serves some other political agenda.
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Self Promotion
Harry Bardal 3rd Mar 2008
I'm sorry, you misunderstood, my post was not meant as
an opportunity for you to display your prowess at fixing
computers. In the same way, our friend with the Vaio
didn't ask Ed for his help. I'm afraid you are the one who
doesn't get it.

I understand computers are complex and may need the
odd tweak, but for many this is not their hobby, nor is it
an opportunity for self aggrandizement. They have better
things to do, and if another platform offers a faster path to
that, it won't matter one little bit what you're able to do for
your cousin.

What's better, troubleshooting or being largely trouble
free? Macs have problems too? Well no kidding. If someone
switches, and does not switch back however, your skills are
bypassed. You can't talk these people back to PC usage.
You can't argue to a medical professional that their
computer working properly somehow denies them the
valuable knowledge they would gain from endless
troubleshooting. This person has quite enough education
thanks. When it comes time that you cousin needs his
appendix removed. Lets hope his doctor didn't spend
medical school futzing with his Windows box.

Is this sinking in?
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I agree, one should switch
GuidingLight 2nd Mar 2008
computer manufacturers, not platforms, as that in itself invites a new slew of problems that professionals should not have to endure.

A recent call from a relative started with ?My Apple Laptop [stinks] and I?m returning it because it can?t run any of my programs!? Turns out some of her higher priced Windows programs had no Mac alternatives, and those that did she was not going to run out and re-invest in them. I told her to hang on to it as I had a solution.

We installed Boot Camp and proceeded to load a copy of Windows XP Pro (she really likes Vista, but in keeping cost down we went this route as we acquired XP Pro at a discount thru her father?s work on a company deal they have.) and she is quite happy as she can continue to use her Widows programs without the added cost of repurchasing them, if that is even an option.

The bottom line is that if a manufacturer does not come thru with a good product, it is by no means that the format is bad, just their implantation of it, (something you seem to miss). Switching platforms in itself can be more disruptive then just switching to a different manufacturer.

She was going to return it and get a Dell as my wife?s laptop works great (she really likes it, and Vista, too) but we saved her the hassle of the return, repurchase, ect and gave her a working alterative, which she is comfortable with.

Though I did get a call on Thursday night from her: she wants to upgrade to Vista.

Go figure.
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I have Vista running...
msalzberg 3rd Mar 2008
on my Mac Mini using Boot Camp, and it runs well.
Performance is very good, and I, for one, like the new
interface, for the most part. The Start Menu is even worse
than the one in XP (hard to believe it could be worse, but it
is), but there are a lot of nice things that more than make up
for it.
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I agree
GuidingLight 3rd Mar 2008
I like the interface and have seen no issues with the performace of Vista.

My Brother-in-law runs Vista on his MacBook and has said it runs very nicely, also.

As for my relative who wants to upgrade to Vista, I think I will push for a full install vs upgrade as I have never really seen any OS "upgrade" as well as when compared to a clean install, though this could be a result of all the issue that are already there prior to the install, which means double the work.

Still, the XP install is fresh enough that it may not be an issue.
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Celebrations
Harry Bardal 3rd Mar 2008
I'm not going to join you in celebrating a lack of software
choice. I don't think the reduction of options in a market is
a good thing. Clearly you're ok with it.

Which OS do you get preinstalled with a Dell again? How
about HP, Levono, Sony, Asus etc? This kind of choice is
good enough for you? It seems it is.

Do you think your relative is the rule or the exception?

Seriously, what percentage do you think switches back?
Where do you see current trends going?
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Your take on the article is that since the Sony is not running well with Vista, jump to a Mac and totally ignore Dell, HP, and other companies offerings that run Vista quite well.

Who is celebrating a lack of software
choice on the Apple? I was merely giving a real world scenerio of the ills of jumping platforms that you tend to ignore or dismiss as trivial, something many do not consider so.

Not many people switch back from anything once the money is invested, so that is quite an irrelevant question. The question is how many switch in the first place?

You seem to have taken the response quite personally: was it the part where she wanted Vista, the part where the Apple could not deliver on her needs, or the part where she wanted to switch back?

And please fill me in where I was "OK with the reduction of options in a market"

Or was my post threatening enough that you had to spin it for others who would read it?
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0s and 1s
Harry Bardal 4th Mar 2008
A logic gate doesn't know which platform it's on. To be an
advocate on behalf of technology as a whole, is to speak
for the logic gate first and the platform second.

What you blithely speak of as choice, Dell HP etc. is little
more than different shapes of extruded plastic, different
logos, and different Chinese motherboards. Technology is
code, first and foremost. Real differentiation only happens
between competitors. Real competition in technology
comes in the form of OS competition, dev environment
competition, and app competition.

If you concede this, then you agree that there are not
dozens of competitors, there are only two. The switch from
one OEM to another means virtually nothing.

I'm not going to play "your annecdote vs my annecdote".
it's childish. Boot Camp and Parallels are a stop gap and a
transition tool, not a new Windows OEM. If this, and the
current switching trend isn't obvious, there's nothing I can
do for you.

I'm not the least bit threatened by folks so apathetic as to
endorse a feudal marketplace over an open one. I'm not
the least bit threatened by folks who look back on their
record of acquiescence and describe it as a study in free
will. To my mind, that "shining light" isn't very bright at all.
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Check the BIOS and RAM
itpro_z 2nd Mar 2008
Ed, I avoid Sony laptops like the plague because of experiences that I have had with themin the past, but there are some things that I would check beyond the obvious of decrapping the system. Download and install the latest BIOS, and then go through the BIOS setup thoroughly. It may very well be that Sony has set the defaults to maximize battery life over performance.

Next, check the RAM and make sure that it is the right spec for the machine. I would not put it past Sony to install some cheap RAM, or it could have possibly have been done by the vendor or end user. Add a stick of slow memory to boost the RAM and the system will slow down to match it.

After that, I would check every driver on the system. While at Sony's website to check for a new BIOS, check for new drivers for the chipset, video, etc. Start with those, and then check Windows Update for even newer versions.

I look forward to reading your findings. So far, I have only ran into a few slow Vista machines, but have found that in every case simple common sense tweaks have cured the problems.
Google desktop has always given me issues too, both on XP and Vista. I finally switched Microsoft's desktop search on XP and I guess Vista has its own version pre-installed. Helps a lot. Even though I might use Google for internet search, they don't do a good job on the desktop.
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I don't quite understand. You compare a VAIO with _Vista_ with a Mac with _Leopard_ on the OS boot times, and conclude that VAIO sucks? Miscrosoft will love you!
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Contributr
No, I didn't compare anything
Ed Bott 3rd Mar 2008
I haven't yet had my hands on this PC. The comparisons are from Jeremy Toeman and Walt Mossberg, both of whom purchased Sony machines. Jeremy says he doesn't care whether it's Sony's fault or Microsoft's, and Walt's comparison took aim at both.

So I'm not sure what your point is.
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So it's better believe yourself
pa2004 3rd Mar 2008
Don't trust the columns, believe in your own experiences.
Whenever I read some articles that bash Windows and related products, I wonder what the motivation behind these bashers? Why do they make stupid assumption that their experiences must be the same as their readers? I bought a VAIO in February 2007, short after Vista's official launch and have used it until now. I have to say that I have got a positive experience. For some solid reasons, Vista will rule sooner or later. If Mac or Linux want to beat Windows, they'd better work hard rather than mocking.
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Very, very, very good point
silent.griffin 3rd Mar 2008

If Mac or Linux want to beat Windows, they'd better work hard rather than mocking



Very, very, very good point.
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Given the context of this article...
JDThompson 3rd Mar 2008
pa2004 wrote:;

If Mac or Linux want to beat Windows, they'd better work hard rather than mocking.

It seems to me all they need to do is work. happy
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My experience with the Sony microPC
riredale 3rd Mar 2008
I bought a UX-380n Sony microPC last fall, and it was a joke. Sluggish, and full of crapware.

Now it's fantastic! The big change? I upgraded to XPpro. Sony intentionally refuses to make XP drivers available on their website, but a very supportive user community over at micropctalk.com has them in a neat little package. XP, combined with the removal of all crapware and the hidden recovery partition, results in a beautiful user experience, with performance as good as most any desktop--and you can carry this computer in your pocket!

This is my first Vaio, and I'd have to conclude based on just this limited experience that Sony makes brilliant hardware but then marketing screws things up. As for Vista, well, there's a giant leap forward for computerdom...
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Except now, Sony has XP Pro drivers on the website. They don't all work, but you can at least get the system up and running. It is about 30% faster and definately more stable.
I bought a Vaio SZ480N in April. I spent the next 6 months getting broken parts fixed, drivers updated and system restore DVDs. I attempted to perform a clean install to get rid of the hardware and software problems I was experiencing. Microsoft and Sony both refused to provide a DVD for the operating system I purchased with the laptop, Vista Business. After 2 visits from incompetent repairmen, 2 shipments back to the depot in San Diego, and 4 calls to the Office of the President at Sony in Florida, I finally have a laptop that works. But, now it works well. It boots quickly, runs Vista well, until you try to do more than one thing at a time, then it wants more memory. Apparently 2GB isn't enough.

But if you stick with it and get everything taken care of, it is a solid machine. It even runs Ubuntu well. For the money, it is hard to find another laptop with comparable hardware. Just expect to buy or aquire a Vista DVD to recover from errors.
You may recall my early correspondence with you after I first entered VAIO Vista hell, which I've recorded here:

http://thefutureofpublishing.com/blog/2007/05/
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Something to occupy my time
m.t.patton@... 3rd Mar 2008
It was good to run across this article, so that I'd have something to read (on my other computer) as I reformat my laptop to XP Pro. Of course, I should have just ordered it that way, but I paid too much attention to all the folks who claim that Vista's really not bad, and that all it takes is some careful tweaking and setup.

Hogwash, says me.

The performance flaws in Vista, widely reported, seem impervious to even the best suggestions for fixing them, and no, Google apps are not part of the equation for me.

Like Jeremy, I don't care what the problem is, but I'm quite comfortable that this waste of half a day in reverting will pay me back within 2 weeks' time just by eliminating the absurd and infuriating processing delays I experienced with Vista.

Which, long way 'round, really will seem to point to Vista as the problem, no?
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Which VAIO?
Adam.Leonard@... 3rd Mar 2008
Be nice to know the specs on the VAIO. Even the model would be helpful. I have had a new TZ191 for about 2 weeks and LOVE it. I found a company that will sell you a DVD for $30 has an image of the VISTA install that the system SHOULD have and it worked great. No crapware. No trials. Nothing but the OS and drivers associated with the notebook. It even allows you to wipe out the recovery partition (which you won't need with this DVD) to get more space for regular use.
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My exprience: I've always been a Sony Vaio fan - now on the TZ170 and love it. But what I do when I buy ANY NEW PC is I completely format the computer and install Vista from scratch (no add on software). This improves the performance on the system tremendously.

I bought a MacBook and Mac Mini - and in my opinion they are crap, they freeze, i've had to force quit, and have had many problems with software. Apple may beautify their GUI but they're still not as functional as a PC. My Windows experience (even Vista) is everything works - i can burn movies, cds, browse the web etc without problems - on an Apple I was not successful.

I'm a Sony VAIO fan for life!
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Try Linux on on the laptop!
anthonymeagher@... 3rd Mar 2008
Hi,

Have you tried either installing a Linux OS or ruuning a live Linux distro from the dvd drive (e.g. knoppix)> This might help you determine if it's the Vista-Vaio combo causing the problems!

anthony(ireland)
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RE: Try Linux on on the laptop!...
richdave 3rd Mar 2008
Alternatively, create a virtual machine with virtualbox and install a Linux distro. Check the boot time of the Linux Distro. If reasonable, then it is not a sony hardware issue(kinda obvious, that). Could be all of the crapware is not gone and you will have to spend an hour or so playing around in the registry.
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Linux / Vista as a Dual Boot
cpt_slog@... 23rd Jul 2008
I agree with the comments above, try Linux, even as a live cd where you don't have to mess about with installation or partitions. I can almost guarantee within 30 minutes at the outside you'll see Vista in a different light, and not a favourable one.

My own story is that I bout a new Lenovo laptop (2GB Ram, dual core 1.7 GHZ) that came with Vista Home Premium. It sucked. After turning it on and watching the sidebar CPU applet I was horrified to see my system idling (doing nothing) at 40% CPU.

Naturally I tracked down and removed the crapware, and found the system responded better, but it was still a far cry from what I was expecting. This configuration with XP SP2 would fly; under Vista it was just painful. I don't know exactly what Vista is doing under the hood, but it is simply too slow for what it offers. And don't even get me started on the subject on incompatible software that runs just fine on XP SP2.

As a result I ran a Linux Live CD, and later installed it as a dual boot option. Now I know what an OS is supposed to respond like on a reasonably powerful machine. I still have the dual boot configuration, but that is temporary. I'll be yet another long time Windows user switching to Linux permanently.
Sony Vaio sucks with any operating system. Unfortunately, the configuration I manager has 2 Vaio's in the mix (end users purchased the shiny new things) and they are consistently more problematic (and they are running on Windows XP Pro w/SP2 installed) than any of the other machines. And getting Sony to stand behind their service contract - they stand as far behind and away from it as possible. Best of luck as you take on the Vaio - invest in some extra strength headache medicine.
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Some PCs undermine Vista
Jim Johnson 3rd Mar 2008
Ed, I love my Vista Ultimate notebook running on a lower-end AMD X2 unit. Admittedly it took some tweaking to get there.

My son-in-law bought a new Lenovo notebook with Vista Home Premium pre-installed. He did a number of tweaks but never could get this unit to acceptible performance. He had set up a dual boot with Linux and found himself increasingly using Linux to be productive. Until... he had to reload the notebook to factory. This time he used the vlite tool to strip Vista (and ALL the crapware) and installed VirtualBox to run Linux. He is now happy and finds himself in Vista as often as Linux.

I don't think it is so much Vista that is at fault as it is sloppy factory pre-installs - either putting too much Vista on existing hardware or hobbling Vista with incompatible OEM loaded software.

Oh...as for the Linux, it's gone back to being a great tinkerer's toy. Lots of fun, but not as productive as Windows (HIS productivity needs I'll add before you Linux fanboyz jump in)
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It's mostly the added crapware
spark555 3rd Mar 2008
In my recent side by side XP and Vista new-laptop experience, it appears to be a combination of ever-increasing crapware being shipped by the laptop makers on top of Vista, and horrific memory management in the new OS.

Vista was initially an order of magnitude slower than the otherwise similar XP laptop.

I removed several dozen items of crapware, turned off unnecessary services (I need a SQL database running on this end-user laptop WHY?) and forced the thing to give up paging.

Yep. You heard me. No more paging file (the machine has plenty of ram).

This cured all the performance issues. Vista now runs quickly, quietly and efficiently - roughly as fast as the XP laptop, and with prettier graphics. Ooooo!

My advice for Vista is to buy the full 4 GB of ram (yes, a portion will be wasted), de-install all crapware, and turn off paging. Unless you edit huge chunks of high res video, you will never care that paging is off, and in the meanwhile your laptop will not leave you waiting for it dozens of times per day.
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Contributr
Turn off paging? SQL database?
Ed Bott 3rd Mar 2008
Want to tell us all exactly what steps you went through to "turn off paging"? Just curious, as I've tested this extensively and have never seen a performance improvement from disabling paging.

So maybe we're talking about two different things. It would help if you would provide more details.

And what SQL database are you talking about? I'm looking at two separate well-used installs of Windows Vista Ultimate edition with Office 2007 here and there's no SQL service installed.
If XP Drivers are not PROMINENTLY displayed on the vendors web site for the Computer you want to buy...

Don't buy it as you have no options if you don't like dISTA...

Having both driver sets available should mean that the computer has ACTUALLY been tested in both environments and is therefore a solid build...

I UP-graded my HP DV6609wm (cheapy) to WinXP...

And, I am decidedly _NOT_ sorry I did!

Mike Sr.
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Why do the reviewers...
cfischer83@... 3rd Mar 2008
Why do the reviewers of Vista always buy a Sony or HP laptop? Those are the two computers you should stay away from! If you're going to buy a desktop, buy a Dell. If your going to buy a laptop, buy Toshiba.
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I don't see any difference with Sony.
Joe.Smetona 5th Mar 2008
I have 3 Sony Vaio desktops that were originally installed with XP home. The computers were used for CAD work in an engineering company and the drives were wiped when it came to to replace them. They are 1.2 Ghz, 256 MB RAM, 60 GB HDD, 1-DVD, 1-CDR. I installed Ubuntu 7.10 on each. Compared to other computers of this caliber, there was no difference in performance. They all worked exceptionally well and there were no problems with installation. From a hardware point of view, I don't see any difference. Although older machines, they are exceptionally well built and have quality throughout. They boot up and run fast for their $40.00 each price tag.
I switched to mac they are quite nice. But I had so many hardware issues I just sold my last Mac and I'll never go back. Guess I'm a reverse switcher. 2 hard drives, 3 logic boards and the famous Mac Book Yellow, Oh and try throwing in a new hard drive sometime. I use notebooks primarily and the Mac's don't hold up, and they're difficult to work on. The new Air is a perfect example of this. I don't use Sony or Macs.
So, how's the Vaio doing?
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Contributr
It just arrived a couple days ago
Ed Bott 14th Mar 2008
I'm finishing off a big project this week and will get to tear into the Vaio next week.
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?
bmgoodman 26th Mar 2008
Is it "next week" yet??
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Contributr
You must have missed this...
Ed Bott 26th Mar 2008
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Yes, I did. Thanks. (NT)
bmgoodman 2nd Apr 2008
NT
It is rather strange to read that if the OS cannot be properly installed than the computer is wrong and no real proof to be shown.
The main purpose of an OS is to manage resources. If this same OS cannot manage Sony resources and some other OS manages these same resources than the OS is the most probable trouble maker.
Is Sony unmanageable by any OS?
Is Sony the only one unmanageable by MS Vita?
I bought an Acer Aspire 5720 in Nov. 2007 loaded with Vista Home Premium and a whole load of Acer crap. The system is slow, I get numerous ''not responding'' messages, I can have email in seconds or minutes, same with Firefox. What can I do? How much of the Acer bloat can I dump?

Thanks
Dave
Having bought a cheap low end VIAO Sony laptop yes it is slow - in comparison to a desktop - but not intolerably so and has given no problems.
Maybe it's not MS Vista! It could be the Sony PC thats holding back Vista performance. I have found that Sony is not the premier system builder that its fan base believes them to be... Using sub standard (and non MS approved components) and integrating thier DRM protection into the pc will kill any glimmer of performance.
My home built (tower) performs better unnder Vista than when I had XP Pro running on it. It's all about the quality of the build, not just the OS itself.

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