ie8 fix

Between the Lines

Larry Dignan, Andrew Nusca and Rachel King

Forget 2006, let's go back to '96

By | February 7, 2009, 9:37am PST

Summary: Like many of you, I have been waking up in the middle of the night wondering what’s going on with the global economies and how the world will look in a few months when we adjust to the new economic reality.  I started thinking about about the world when people lived within their means, took [...]

Like many of you, I have been waking up in the middle of the night wondering what’s going on with the global economies and how the world will look in a few months when we adjust to the new economic reality.  I started thinking about about the world when people lived within their means, took a job for a job’s sake, and could plan for the future.  It then hit me hard - things have simply fallen out of proportion. 

When I graduated in ‘94 there weren’t a lot of high-powered careers available to graduates - you took what you could get and worked at it until something better came along.  I actually started off in customer relations for a burglar alarm firm… doesn’t make my LinkedIn profile, but it actually started me off on a track that somehow got me here (and I did have some hilarious conversations with London celebs with their alarms wailing in the background).

Let’s talk about proportion and focus on the two staples in life - food and shelter.  By 1996, I was flying high as an analyst earning a whopping $30K a year (about the same as an Oracle developer in Bangalore today).  I also purchased an apartment for $100K.  In those days you could borrow 3 times your annual salary - that was it.  The cost of groceries was about $40 a week, and a good restaurant meal was never more than $35 a head.  I’ll stop there.  While my salary seems terrible by today’s standards, I didn’t build any debt and I had a mortgage that was manageable for a property that was fairly valued.  Life was good, and I slept well at night.

Take 2008.  The equivalent salary for a graduate-level analyst is about $50K.  The cost of that equivalent apartment is $300K (6 times the salary), weekly groceries $75 and a good meal $60 (if you’re lucky and the wine’s cheap).  There’s no feasible way you can enjoy the same quality of life without mortgaging yourself way beyond your means and delving deep into credit-card debt.  What’s worse is that debt has become part of life for so many people.  And that’s precisely what happened, and now everyone’s paying the price.

The optimum way out of this crisis is for these proportions to be redressed, however painful it may be. 

Guillotine

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Can I hear a big 'Duh!'?
Ginevra 9th Feb 2009
I am not an economist or a businessman and have never had the ability to express this in sophisticated terms, but it has been obvious to me for a very long time now that something was fundamentally wrong with the way our economy has been running. Everyone--businesses and consumers alike--seemed to forget for many years that money (or rather, the effort and value represented by money) is a finite thing, and that people are not bottomless wells of cash!

Clearly the individual consumers who overspent and overborrowed must take responsibility for their own actions, but I don't believe the lenders and sellers who went to so much trouble to convince everyone they could safely live beyond their means can be let off the hook entirely, either. They helped build this house of cards that's now collapsing around us. If we are going to rebuild a strong economy, the era of conspicuous consumption and the flawed economic principles that have driven it must end once and for all, no matter how painful that turns out to be for everyone.
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Stupid is as stupid does...
Wolfie2K3 Updated - 7th Feb 2009
I'll have to agree with your assessment. Things have gotten out of control. I'm starting to wonder if we've got any common sense.

Your blog link is missing a classic example of this sort of stupidity: The Dot Bomb era of the late 90's. At the time, I worked for a company that supplied CRM solutions to companies. We made plenty of money during that time. There were all manner of new start-ups that needed our services.

I often found myself scratching my head, wondering just how the heck these companies planned on surviving. Looking over their business plans (or whatever passed for one) and processes left me wondering how they planned on making money. Especially with the lavish way they spent what money they had. They had a product - which, of course, they were giving away for free. Some of them were good products. Some of them - eh...Not so much. Either way, they hadn't quite figured out how they were going to stay afloat.

Of course, when you brought up your concerns and such about this kinda thing - the person you were talking to shot back with the inevitable "It's the new economy, stupid!" usually in conjunction with "It's the Internet!"

Of course, I was quite sure something didn't make sense. In the real world, people need to eat. Food is not free. They go to work to earn the money it takes to buy the food. They repeat the process.

Companies need to bring in the money - in order to pay the employees and such. Therefore, they have to sell something - a product or a service - for real money. So when you get these dot bombers talking about "new economies" and such, and their business plan ultimately has no source of income (beyond the VC funding) defined, you gotta wonder what these guys were smoking... (hint: it's not tobacco...)

And of course, the inevitable happened. The Venture Capitalists started smelling something fishy. They decided not to cough up another round of money for these "new economy" idiots to burn through and the whole dot bomb era crashed and burned.

So yeah... I saw the dot bomb bubble burst - well before it did. There wasn't much I personally could do about it. There's not much you can do when someone willing goes through a round of self delusion that something will work when it clearly makes no sense. The best you can do is duck as the shrapnel flies by...
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This is an old game
frgough 7th Feb 2009
But let's play it anyway. Let's go pre-Obama I (that would
be prior to Jimmy Carter).

You could buy a 2400 square foot home for $33,000. A
new car cost $1400. Gasoline was $.18 a gallon, and you
could feed a family of five like kings for $400 a month in
groceries.

And then Nixon came along with price controls because
inflation hit a terrifying 3%. The economy staggered. Then
Jimmy Carter came along to "fix it." and we hit 21%
interest, 17% inflation and 8% unemployment for years and
years. Money was being printed so quickly that the imprint
on the paper was skewed. The Federal government had to
issue a statement to merchants, assuring them the
bills were not counterfeit.

Those were the days. The time when people would
excitedly refinance their home to lock into an 11.25%
interest rate. When there were odd-even days and fill limits
on gasoline after Carter nationalized the oil distribution
network in response to the OPEC embargo. And, of
course, the hostages in tehran as a bunch of Islamic
radical students thumbed their nose at us. You might
remember that one. The head of the student hostage
takers is now President of Iran.

Ah, those were the days. And guess, what? You're gonna
get to live through them. And maybe, just maybe your
generation will grow up a little bit.
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RE: Forget 2006, let
Linux User 147560 Updated - 7th Feb 2009
"There?s no feasible way you can enjoy the same quality of life without mortgaging yourself way beyond your means and delving deep into credit-card debt. What?s worse is that debt has become part of life for so many people. And that?s precisely what happened, and now everyone?s paying the price."

It depends on what you mean by quality of life. If by quality of life you mean the following:

1. A home you are paying for or own.
2. Good health.
3. Decent job.
4. Plenty of healthy food.
5. Fun activities on occasion
6. Solid family unit
7. Good friends that are real, not shallow

Then you are wrong, you can live without mortgaging your life away. It's called living within your means, not buying every toy or trinket out there to assuage your ego or to keep up with the Jones's.

7 P's have allowed the wife and I to not only pay off our home, but enjoy good healthy food, a solid family and excellent health. Sure the first 10 years were a pain and yes, we had to give up a lot of "fun" things, but we managed to keep our debt load to a single car payment and a house payment in the process. And save a small amount here and there.

Now we are watching house after house after house, go up for sale and because we have lived within our means we are without any debt and we have a fair chunk of money squirreled away. Enough that if the house prices keep dropping... we are talking about buy another home as another investment.

Thing is I learned how to live within my means from my Granny and the wife, she is Catalonian and not subject to the same levels of greed that Americans are. And greed coupled with the lie of credit and being in debt is a good thing has gotten millions of Americans in the fiscal pickle they are in now.

All I gotta say is one of the roots to the problem is staring back at you in the mirror. The idea that carrying debt is good, who the frak came up with that idiocy!? That is tantamount to indentured servitude. In essence you are allowing yourself to become a slave. This is the foundation for tearing Republics apart and instituting a Socialist regime.

Don't believe me? Look at all the socialist programs on the plate to start. Look at how the free market is NOT being allowed to work nor is capitalism with all the bailouts. Notice how the American people are now willing to give up their freedoms and rights, so the government can take care of them.

Oh wait, you can't see these things because you are like millions of other Americans, in debt up to your eyes, jobs on the line and no relief in sight. The perfect storm to undermine the Republic. And now that you have a democratic majority (read socialist party) in power... you wonder why the Republicans and Independents are up in arms. What a mess we are in for still.

Well at least I can say I am a truly free American and NOT an indentured servant. What a nice feeling that is!
devil

PS: Did I mention we are going to Spain and Scotland this year too!? And the trips are paid for in full with... wait for it... no interest or extra incurred debt! Oh the bitter irony... devil
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Forget 96, try 1930's
LBiege 7th Feb 2009
We just had Bush burning us 8 years with a massive national debt that no one knows how to pay off. Now here comes Obama with his promise of "change" trying to pour more gas on it. This is a shameless generational theft. He wants to saddle the future generations with staggering debt b/c of this generation's irresponsible behavior. Try 50% inflation and 25% unemployment rate all the way till 2012, that is assuming the voters are smart enough to kick the socialism crook out in next election.
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Debt as a way of life.
TripleII-21189418044173169409978279405827 7th Feb 2009
I am old school, learned from my parents. I don't buy anything unless I have the money (the obvious exception being my home mortgage). In today's society, it has somehow become actually wrong to not subscribe to instant gratification. It seems as though everyone is expected to run up the debt and their income is pretty much solely to pay off the purchases.

Trust me, the feeling of being beholden to no-one (saw the crash coming in 2006, downsized and completely debt free) is priceless. One thing I tell people who live on credit, you are mortgaging your future with that purchase.

It really is an interesting experiment, and I anyone here should try it. Except for your automatic mortgage payment, live on cash 100% for 2 months. You will learn the real value of the money you earn. It is far too easy to whip out the plastic and toss $149.99 on it to get that super duper whatever. Now count out the 20s and see it leaving your hand. Everyone who tries it is always amazed at how much money they saved after 2 months. grin

Something else I advise, if you are having a tough time making ends meet, now is the time to talk to financial or credit counselors. Do it before you are behind means many more options.

TripleII
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Been doing that for many years now
Linux User 147560 7th Feb 2009
it's called living within ones means, and until recently (last 10 years or so) most people were smart enough to do that. But like you said... instant gratification without considering long term repercussions. Man, karma is a biatch! devil
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More people to share the pie
hamobu-22333136139518773481685514128812 9th Feb 2009
I heard somewhere that if everyone on earth live like we (Americans) do, we would need six earths. Obviously much of the rest of the world is catching up (China and India) and since we have only one planet, we need to slowly start downsizing.
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Can I hear a big 'Duh!'?
Ginevra 9th Feb 2009
I am not an economist or a businessman and have never had the ability to express this in sophisticated terms, but it has been obvious to me for a very long time now that something was fundamentally wrong with the way our economy has been running. Everyone--businesses and consumers alike--seemed to forget for many years that money (or rather, the effort and value represented by money) is a finite thing, and that people are not bottomless wells of cash!

Clearly the individual consumers who overspent and overborrowed must take responsibility for their own actions, but I don't believe the lenders and sellers who went to so much trouble to convince everyone they could safely live beyond their means can be let off the hook entirely, either. They helped build this house of cards that's now collapsing around us. If we are going to rebuild a strong economy, the era of conspicuous consumption and the flawed economic principles that have driven it must end once and for all, no matter how painful that turns out to be for everyone.

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