Between the Lines

Larry Dignan, Andrew Nusca and Rachel King

In Office SP2, Microsoft manages to reduce interoperability

By | May 19, 2009, 4:00am PDT

Summary: Microsoft Office SP2 claims to have a fully compliant version of ODF, and that’s probably true, as defined by the specification. It’s just completely useless at interoperating with other vendors’ products. This is not interoperability; it’s an attack on the very concept.

Microsoft recently released service pack two (SP2) for their flagship office product, Office 2007. As I’m not a user of Microsoft products, normally I wouldn’t have noticed, but Office 2007 SP2 had an important new feature for users of Open Source office productivity software that made me pay attention. SP2 contains Microsoft’s first native implementation of the file format Open Document Format (ODF), originally created for Sun’s Open Source OpenOffice product. ODF was standardized by the International Standards Organization (ISO) before Microsoft’s rival Office Open XML (OOXML) and is seen as the competitor to Microsoft’s offering for the future of XML based office file formats, so Microsoft implementing it in Office is a big deal.

With the implementation of ODF in SP2, we finally have one portable office file format, accepted and implemented by most office productivity software. That’s the theory, right ? The devil, as always, is in the details.

IBM’s Rob Weir, chair of the ODF Technical Committee and one of the people involved in the design and standardization of ODF examined Microsoft’s implementation of spreadsheet interoperability. He specifically looked at the case of spreadsheets using formulas (which in practical terms is most spreadsheets that users would create and use), and he published his findings here.

I’m not going to go into great technical detail of what Microsoft actually did wrong in their implementation; Rob does an excellent job of that in his blog. Let’s just look at  an overview instead. In short, Microsoft managed to reduce interoperability between office productivity software by their implementation of ODF inside SP2.

How can this be ?  After all, ODF is an ISO standard. Surely if you implement a standard fully, which Microsoft claims to have done in SP2, then you must have an interoperable product. So long as others also implement the standard as written, then everything should just work together. That’s the way things are supposed to work.

One of the reasons is that standards themselves are often not perfect. Microsoft and their attendant band of astroturf bloggers are already raising a hue and cry over Rob’s findings, claiming the ODF standard itself is at fault, and in some cases calling for his resignation as chair of the ODF Technical Committee for the heinous sin of pointing out this emperor has no clothes.

They are right about the ODF standard of course. It is missing a proper definition of spreadsheet formulas. This is the truck-sized hole that Microsoft drove through in their implementation. Sure Excel saves formulas in ODF documents, just in a separate  namespace where no other application is currently designed to look for them. The result is that anyone trying to open an ODF spreadsheet created in Excel will have it rejected. Excel reading an ODF spreadsheet created by another application does something worse, it will use the last value for the data in the spreadsheet cell that should be governed by the formula. The formulas themselves are silently dropped.

Yet Microsoft Office SP2 claims to have a fully compliant version of ODF, and that’s probably true, as defined by the specification. It’s just completely useless at interoperating with other vendors’ products. This is not interoperability, it’s an attack on the very concept.

Unions are not popular in either the USA or the UK any more, which I think is a sad state of affairs. My first action on getting my first job in the UK was joining the local union. So for those readers not experienced with union activity, I’d like to explain the concept of  “Working to Rule”. When a union is trying to negotiate with management, there are a broad range of options they can take before using the ultimate weapon of going on strike. One of these tactics is “Working to Rule”. Normally in a working day, there are hundreds of small rules that people ignore in order to get their jobs done. From refilling the coffee machine for themselves (which could be a health and safety hazard, if you really think about it) to fixing small problems with the machines they use for the job. “Working to Rule” means deliberately obeying every single one of these rules. Coffee machine out of water ? “Not my job mate.” Ethernet cable fallen out of a machine ? “I’m a programmer, not a hardware engineer. Someone had better come and fix that for me.” I’m sure you get the idea. Punctilious observation of every possible rule in order to disrupt orderly working.

This is what Microsoft has done with ODF in SP2.

They’ve done this before.

When Windows NT was first announced, one exciting new feature was the concept of “subsystems”. Windows NT was to be a chameleon operating system. Not only would it run Windows binaries, it had two other “subsystem personalities”, OS/2 and POSIX. Yes, that’s right, Windows NT was originally a fully POSIX-compliant operating system. POSIX is the standard for UNIX programs, meaning you could re-compile the same source code on any POSIX compliant system and it was guaranteed to work the same. POSIX was popular in government contract specifications, as it was supposed to save the government money on IT systems by forcing vendors to be interoperable.

I remember getting my hands on the first beta of Windows NT, starting up the POSIX subsystem and trying some code out on it. It was a joke. Networking ? That’s not part of the official POSIX spec, so no access to the network. Windowing ? That’s not in there either, so no fancy graphical interfaces for your POSIX programs, pure text-based code only. Anything not fully mandated by the spec was ripped out. Yes, it could pass the pure POSIX conformance tests, but that was all it was able to do. No useful code could run on this system, as all of it expected something more than the basic standard, which most other POSIX vendors had managed to create de-facto standards around. The Windows subsystem even had some of these de-facto POSIX-like standards (the Berkeley sockets networking interface for example) but these were explicitly excluded from the Windows NT POSIX subsystem. The only purpose was to allow government purchasers to check the box marked “POSIX compliant” but allow them to purchase completely proprietary Windows solutions, and that’s just what they did. It implemented the letter of the law, whilst completely ignoring the spirit of it.

So how do you do real interoperability ? Well, I like to think that my own project Samba could teach engineers a thing or two about how to do that. We’re working from specifications for the Common Internet File System (CIFS) protocol that are not an official standard, but we go out of our way to make sure we work with other vendors implementations. We attend interoperability testing conferences, where we work with the engineers of other vendors (including Microsoft engineers) to ensure that customers deploying any of our implementations don’t get any nasty surprises. We’ve changed our code to work with Windows 95 and 98, Windows mobile, Windows CE, Windows 7, Network Appliance, a host of un-named embedded versions of CIFS in different appliances, even old versions of OS/2. It’s not hard, it’s just careful, detailed work. The only rule is to follow the words of the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF) for interoperability, “Be conservative in what you send, be liberal in what you will accept.”

If we simply worked from a specification, we’d end up with a product that would work with itself, but would have no chance of working in the real world with other vendors implementations. Very similar to what Microsoft has produced with Office 2007 SP2’s ODF support.

A complete cynic would say that was what was intended. That Microsoft, being the dominant vendor of office suites, would only benefit from creating an implementation of a competing standard that was worthless for interoperability. That causing confusion in the marketplace like this was designed to make customers scuttle back to the safety of only using Microsoft Office and the endlessly mutating versions of .DOC or .DOCX, as these interoperability issues are at least problems the customers have learned to live with over the years.

But I’ve seen Microsoft do better than this. I’ve worked with their engineers on CIFS, they’ve attended interoperability events, they’ve even logged bugs on Samba when they’ve found problems. They know how to do this properly.

But what we currently see in Office 2007 SP2 is still “Working to Rule” in every sense of the phrase.

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RE: In Office SP2, Microsoft manages to reduce interoperability
gwreg4fge 3rd Nov 2009
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What if you created a document format and no one cared? You could call it ODF.
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Yup.
Sleeper Service 19th May 2009
File under 'pointless exercise'.
No I think it would be called OOXML. And yes Sleeper Service no one cared about OOXML.
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Yes? And?
Sleeper Service 19th May 2009
happy
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And what....
storm14k 19th May 2009
Thats all to it...nobody cared about OOXML and even MS cared about ODF. As usual the brains at MS are much bigger than those of their fanboys.
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Why did you bother to comment then?
kozmcrae 19th May 2009
You fool no one. ODF is a growing threat to your way. The more nonchalant you act, the more concerned you appear. It doesn't take a Freud to see it either. Now make me feel better and berate this comment.
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lol...
TylerM89 Updated - 19th May 2009
Everyone can see that you are either on Sun/IBM's payroll or have some sort of vested interest in OpenOffice.

ODF isn't a threat to anyone, and looking at the standards, they couldn't even do it right.

No wonder it was so easy for Microsoft to join the ISO's working group for OOXML and get it passed with this kind of organization.
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Oh no you don't!
kozmcrae 19th May 2009
That's my line you Microsoft shill.
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I care... This is sabotage
FanaticGeek Updated - 21st May 2009
as all (or most) OpenOffice.org users. OOo is a great format, but I continuassly have to work in the .doc (closed) format because most people I know use MS Word. Nothing wrong about that, except that MS is now attacking the .odt format. If I hadn't read this article and one of my friends had told me he had SP2 that supported Open Office formats, I would have my new documents sent to him in the open format, therefore destroying the format's reputation in their eyes. This is downright sabotage.

PS: I have no hidden interests in OO; I'm just a user.
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I have been an Office user forever but have made the switch to OpenOffice. While my company forces Microsoft onto us, I have decided that I am too old to upgrade again. I hate the 2007 format. I am not too surprised that MS wants to make OO look bad; just look at their history. I was happy with 2003 but I will not take any "classes" to learn how great 2007 is.
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It wasn't easy...
zkiwi 21st May 2009
It cost Microsoft a lot in money (read into that whatever you choose), and time to produce OOXML which is even more broken than ODF. Note that Microsoft itself doesn't support OOXML properly, and I do not think that has changed.

Also note that the Office "update" that Microsoft produced with regard to ODF has made stuff which used to work now break. So, on the competence and organization thing, either Microsoft isn't, or they're doing it all deliberately and spitefully.
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.. and I'm not sure how many editor packages do that natively.
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OpenOffice does
maggietoo9 20th May 2009
Open Office can save a document as a pdf file (which can be read beautifully by free apps: Foxit for one). It can also save as HTML and that is a true standard also.

Is anyone aware of the other countries that loudly objected when ISO (I Sold Out) caved in and let Microsoft get away with pretending OOXML was a "standard" when they did not fully disclose the source?? Money under the table, or threats - no two ways about it - an eight-hundred-pound-Gorilla (and an insane one, since Steve Ballmer).

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Editing PDF?
cwtryon 20th May 2009
quote: ".. and I'm not sure how many editor packages do that natively."

Well, actually, NONE. PDF is a great standard, but it is definitely a display-only standard, meaning that, once a PDF file is written, you're not SUPPOSED to be able to change it. That means it's great for distribution of documents (which also requires a form of interoperability), but not for collaboration.
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You mean these guys?
epitax 20th May 2009
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The United States of America . . .
sporkfighter 20th May 2009
. . . is not the world, and the rest of the world does care.
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And they screamed...
maggietoo9 20th May 2009
The rest of the world screamed bloody murder and filed formal complaints when ISO let MS get away with foisting off OOXML as a "standard" when MS refused to fully disclose it's source, as required of everyone else.

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All it takes . . .
sporkfighter 22nd May 2009
. . . is the EU to kick Microsoft in the nuts. Could it happen? Yes. Will it happen? Yes, if Microsoft keeps acting like this.
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He specifically looked at the case of spreadsheets
using formulas (which in practical terms is most
spreadsheets that users would create and use)


You admit here that most spreadsheets use formulas and
that formulas are one of the most important aspects of
spreadsheets and yet ODF has 0, nada, zilch
specifications for how vendors are supposed to store
formulas? And yet Microsoft is to blame? Sounds to me
like ODF is 100% to blame here. Sounds to me that MS
shouldn't have implemented ODF until the
standards defined crazy, obscure features like
formulas in spreadsheets.

MS has been very clear about why the
implemented ODF. It wasn't done to hurt (or help) ODF.
Microsoft doesn't owe ODF anything. Microsoft
implemented ODF because many governments stated that
they wouldn't use any product that didn't. It's as
simple as that. Only someone with an agenda would make
this more complicated than that.
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MS is "someone with an agenda"
T1Oracle 19th May 2009
Or more correctly, a business with an agenda. Profit and interoperability do not always go hand in hand. However, profit and vendor lock in are usually do, at least when you are the vendor.
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whether or not a company is "good" or "bad", where does that put SUN (originator of ODF)? If they operate in the red, they are "good", and if they operate in the black, they are "bad"? You just have to love that kind of childish logic....??!!
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Who cares
FanaticGeek 21st May 2009
OO is free/open source.
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What part of...
kozmcrae Updated - 19th May 2009
Microsoft is trying like hell to kill it, don't you understand?
Oh, that's right. You do understand. You're just here to counter act World opinion against Microsoft's ODF killer. You better hope Microsoft wins because if they don't your conscience will weigh a ton.
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In Other Words...
CFWhitman 20th May 2009
In other words, 'Microsoft had a right to do what they did, since the standard had loopholes (as pretty much every standard does, especially initially). You can't hold Microsoft to blame for giving customers the shaft as long as they openly admit they were trying to give customers the shaft. Long live anti-competitive practices! long live lock-in! long live Microsoft!'

If that's how you feel, then I suppose there is no point in arguing. I thought a little clarification might be in order, though. Just don't expect me to feel the same way.
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It isn't a loophole
mdemuth 20th May 2009
You fools are kind of funny
1- MS extends a standard: MS is evil
2- OO extends a standard: OO is good
3- MS follows a standard: MS is evil

What a load of crap. Your not arguing a point, your making up anything you can to say MS is bad.

The standard is crap. ODF is a spreadsheet document format with no support for formulas.
Think about that for a second.
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OOo Extending the standard?
rfdparker2002 Updated - 20th May 2009
If you read the technical blog post ( http://www.robweir.com/blog/2009/05/update-on-odf-spreadsheet.html ) you'll find that the case is that in the previous version of the ODF standard 1.1, there was no specified 'namespace' for forumulas in spreadsheets, and as the (probably) first and largest implementation of ODF, OpenOffice.org had to chose one themselves. Then in order to remain compatible with the largest implementation of ODF (OpenOffice.org) all the other office applications implementing ODF used the name namespace as OpenOffice.org.

Since this time, version 1.2 of the ODF standard has been released, which fixes this problem by specifying a namespace, etc for formula. Recent versions of major ODF-compatible office suites (including OpenOffice.org) have added support for the new standardised way of storing formulae.

But when Microsoft started working on ODF support for MS Office SP2 ODF 1.2 may or may not have been released - and they decided to base their support on ODF 1.1, so when they came to adding spreadsheet formulae support and found it not in the standard, instead of looking at what every other implementation of ODF 1.1 did, they took it upon themselves to use their own 'namespace'.

So to conclude:
* What every other ODF-compatible application did prior to ODF 1.2 with formulae was acceptable by the ODF 1.1 standard, but they assured they worked with one another.
* What MS have done with MS Office 2007 SP2 is acceptable under ODF 1.1, but they haven't made sure with works with everyone else's implementation.
* What all the ODF 1.2-compliant applications did with formulae is written 'in stone', so they should all be compatible with one-another. OOo already supports ODF 1.2 with its most recent versions - all MS needs to do is update their ODF support to 1.2 - then there'll be no arguing over what the standard said.
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ODF 1.2 still not released
orcmid 26th May 2009
There is no approved ODF 1.2 specification at this point, and the OpenFormula part has not yet achieved committee draft status, nor has it been submitted to public review.

I don't know what applications claim to conform to ODF 1.2 other than OO.o 3.x and I have no idea how that will stack up with 1.2 when it is finally approved.
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but OpenOffice works fine...
elliotg 20th May 2009
I don't get it. OpenOffice works fine when creating spreadsheets with formulas. Why can't Microsoft play nice -- and work well with others?
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What!
wjgrimm 20th May 2009
This is how M$ has always worked. Do you recall "DOS isn't done till Lotus won't run?" I remember when I was running Coherent on a computer- and wanted it to dual boot with DOS. Well, M$ made their DOS partition scheme hard to get along with. That's the time I decided to move away from M$ in my home computing, and have never regretted it. I still have to deal with crappy M$ OS's at work, but every chance I can I replace M$ with a good product- over half of my servers are BSD. My advice to users for the past several years has been- Buy a Mac, spend a few extra dollars. No one that has followed this advice has regretted their decision....
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What a load of bollox
Richard Turpin 20th May 2009
I Agree they have obviously no idea of what a spread sheet is!
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extend...
maggietoo9 20th May 2009
"Extend" a standard does NOT mean the same thing as "violate the spirit of" a standard. But you know that - at least I hope you do.
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The old joke says it all...
bswiss 22nd May 2009
A pilot is flying a small, single-engine, charter plane with a couple of really important executives on board into Seattle airport. There is fog so thick that visibility is 40 feet, and his instruments are out. He circles looking for a landmark and after an hour, he is low on fuel and his passengers are very nervous. At last, through a small opening in the fog he sees a tall building with one guy working alone on the fifth floor. Circling, the pilot banks and shouts through his open window: "Hey, where am I?". The solitary office worker replies: "You're in an airplane.". The pilot immediately executes a swift 275 degree turn and executes a perfect blind landing on the airport's runway five miles away. Just as the plane stops, the engines cough and die from lack of fuel. The stunned passengers ask the pilot how he did it. "Elementary," replies the pilot, "I asked the guy in that building a simple question. The answer he gave me was 100% correct but absolutely useless; therefore, I knew that must be Microsoft's support office and from there the airport is three minutes away on a course of 87 degrees."

~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~


(Another, more realistic version of this story:

A helicopter was flying around above Seattle when an electrical malfunction disabled all of the aircraft's electronic navigation and communications qquipment. Due to the clouds and haze, the pilot could not determine the helicopter's position and course to fly to the airport. The pilot saw a tall building, flew toward it, circled, drew a handwritten sign, and held it in the helicopter's window. The pilot's sign said "WHERE AM I?" in large letters. People in the tall building quickly responded to the aircraft, drew a large sign and held it in a building window. Their sign read: "YOU ARE IN A HELICOPTER." The pilot smiled, waved, looked at her map, determined the course to steer to SEATAC airport, and landed safely. After they were on the ground, the co-pilot asked the pilot how the "YOU ARE IN A HELICOPTER" sign helped determine their position. The pilot responded "I knew that had to be the Microsoft building because they gave me a technically correct, but completely useless answer." )
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Governments state ODF for one reason
putt1ck 20th May 2009
Not to hurt anybody but to help everybody; to help everybody to read/write documents used by the government.

Microsoft doesn't owe ODF anything, but their actions were done to hurt ODF. There are many implementations of ODF 1+; they all interoperate pretty good except one. When a specification or standard is unclear, the best and most sensible way forward is to take guidance from existing implementations. That is if you *want* interoperability.

Office ain't done until ODF won't "run"?
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Yes, that's right...governments want to help people. Here is their game plan: first they'll break your leg, then they give you a crutch, and finally demand credit and future subserviance for their good work in helping you! "You can trust me, ma'am. I'm from the government." Yeah, right!!!

I realize those comments are off-topic, but I couldn't resist poking the eye of somebody so obviously ignorant of the nature and the history of government.

On topic, I'll have to say I agree with the comments about the fault being with the lack of definition in the ODF "standard". How in the world can they call it a standard if it doesn't define how formulas will work? That's like saying we have a gasoline standard, but we don't define the contents. Some could be made from animal lard, some could be made from sugar, some could be made from hemp, whatever. It's liquid, so it should be able to make your car run, right? It's not the fault of the standards body when your engine dies...it's those darned manufacturers! They followed the letter of our standard (make a liquid), but not the spirit!

If the ISO didn't define the "standard" then how can you blame MS? Sure, they want to protect their market share. They may even want to increase their market share. Those darned capitalists! Next thing you know they'll want to create products or services and sell them for profit! Goes completely against your socialist utopian ideal of free love and money (or free software)...
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Excellent motto for MS
dfolk2 20th May 2009
"Office ain't done until ODF won't "run"? "

Good one.
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well said
maggietoo9 20th May 2009
Excellent getting to the point.

The government insisted on MS conforming to the extent that it could write government documents in a format EVERYONE could read, whether or not they have MSOffice.

MS figured out a way to cheat and sneak through "words" so it could put a check in a box, while violating the spirit and purpose of the government's insistence on interoperability.

This is kind of like the goon that keeps trying to twist "words" into something they aren't to support his ridiculous stance.

I guess, if you are dealing with Microsoft, you have to word things in VERY SIMPLE LANGUAGE, so they can understand it... such as YOU MUST SAVE DOCUMENTS IN A FORMAT THAT PEOPLE WITH ONLY AN EXISTING (FREE) OPEN SOURCE OFFICE APPLICATION CAN READ.
DO - YOU - UNDERSTAND??
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I agree-it's a distraction by ODF
royalef 20th May 2009
If you make a standard that ignores basics like formulas for spreadsheets--you wrote an immature standard for today's world. Maybe 20 years ago that would be okay.

Throwing a big bru-ha-ha that microsoft chose to fill a gaping whole with their own solution is a attempt at distracting people from seeing that ODF fails to meet the basic needs of documents today--and therefore is of little use except within a subset of what is being done.

Maybe they should have standardize how to extend, identify and include proprietary data formats.
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Did you ever try Open Office?
FanaticGeek 21st May 2009
"If you make a standard that ignores basics like formulas for spreadsheets--you wrote an immature standard for today's world."

You clearly have never used Open Office.
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did you read your post?
clarnT 20th May 2009
Did you read the story? It was Microsoft's JOB to investigate how to
properly implement ODF the way venders use it. That would mean the
engineers might have to leave the office, or call the vendors over for a
chat on how things are supposed to work.

By only relying on the spec and nothing else is exactly "Working to Rule"
which is what Microsoft wanted to do, so as not to increase
interoperability, furthering their lock on Office tools. And if I were the
body that said "won't buy unless it's ODF capable. . ." I'd sue MS for fraud
since it doesn't work.
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Right
maggietoo9 20th May 2009
Right. The U.S.A. said the software had to be OPEN SOURCE (interoperable) or they would refuse to use it. And Microsoft found a way to cheat - and so they did. Nothing new about that.

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Right
maggietoo9 20th May 2009
Right. The U.S.A. said the software had to be OPEN SOURCE (interoperable) or they would refuse to use it. And Microsoft found a way to cheat - and so they did. Nothing new about that.
But the LDAP standard allows one field in its list to be for whatever the writer wants.

So what did Microsoft do? They put almost everything into the undefined field, making Active Directory incompatible with all other LDAP Directories.

Same old, same old.

Yes! We use Microsoft products, some are good, but we don't have to like their business practices.
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Sorry, Mr. Allison. All you have written is
GuidingLight 19th May 2009
an excellent excuse for ODF's short commings, when you should have addressed the areas in which the ODF Standard should, or must be improved.

Writing a standard geared on what someone called "the lowest common donominator" (a bar lowered to the point where all can reach it) will allow all to grasp the bar, but does little in the way of doing anything usefull once the bar is graped.
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I'm sorry (not really), Microsoft stands alone in that opinion of yours.
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New troll?
TylerM89 19th May 2009
The article clearly mentioned multiple times the standards lacked definiton about formulas, yet, SOMEHOW Microsoft is to blame because they did it in a logical way to them? How can you even come up with such an idea?

If the standard clearly dictated where everything should be and how it should be formatted then Microsoft could of made a true connection, instead they are limited to a way that works best in their case.

Nice try on trying to blame Microsoft, again, but you picked a horrible article example to pin to them.
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Hi Tyler.
kozmcrae 19th May 2009
As my new Microsoft "minder" let me give you some pointers. Try to use a spell checker. It makes for more readable comments. I see you know how to use the shift key. That just may take the edge off my response if I'm already in a good mood that is. Be prepared to stay up late. I may abandon you if you fail to respond to my barbs. Oh yeah, you may need a dictionary. I sometimes use archaic words.

So, glad to have you aboard. Things get pretty lively around here. I'm sure you'll do just fine.
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Misleading article
gnesterenko 20th May 2009
Ok, when I read "Microsoft manages to reduce interoperability" I would usually assume that there used to be interoperability in Office SP1 that is no longer present in SP2. Instead, what you are saying is that MS TRIED to increase interoperability, but due to the failures of both MS engineers and the ODF standards, the interoperability isn't as perfect as you would like. So in fact, interoperability has INCREASED, just not as much as would warrant you actually praising the effort.

Umm... What is this? Bizzaro world?

"The views expressed here are mine and do not reflect the official opinion of my employer or the organization through which the Internet was accessed."
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Microwave Dog
giantiago 20th May 2009
That said, be carefull not to dry your dog in the microwave oven.
You can read microwave oven manual, nowhere it is said not to do that.
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OOXML -- dead format walking?
Ole Man 20th May 2009
http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS8722482021.html

Microsoft has not yet moved to open document formats, and you can bet it never will. Being non-interoperable is a cornerstone technique it has used to make its products de facto standards. And when you're a de facto standard, who cares about real standards?

OOXML in its ISO-approved format is going nowhere at all. Heck, Microsoft itself will not even support it until mid-2009.......... well, mid 2009 is now here... watch Microsoft do their stuff... smoke and mirrors and Alice in Wonderland.... Embrace, extend, extinguish.... nothing magical about it.
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Notice that...
fairportfan 20th May 2009
...in an earlier comment, it is pointed out that the ODF standard (v1.2) has addressed this issue - and that Open Office and most other implementations have followed it.
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