Oracle, Google hammer out potential trial roadmap

Oracle, Google hammer out potential trial roadmap

Summary: Lawyers for Oracle and Google try to figure out where we could go from here on the copyrights phase of the trial.

TOPICS: Oracle, Google

SAN FRANCISCO -- At the request of Judge William Alsup, Oracle and Google attorneys hammered out a brief that outlines where the trial could go from here on matters concerning copyright infringement.

Both legal teams arrived to the U.S. District Court of Northern California early on Wednesday morning, discussing (and sometimes arguing in heated whispers) about the nuts and bolts of the stipulation, which can be read below.

Reading more like a "Choose Your Own Adventure" game, there are several possibilities of where the case could go from here, including up and down the appeals chain with new juries and all. Here are some of the major highlights:

  • With respect to copyright issues only (NOT patents), there will be no further work by the current 11-person jury.
  • On copyrights, there won't be any further work until after appeals or if a new trial is granted by the court.
  • Google wants to tie the infringement and fair use matters (Questions 1A and 1B from the jury's copyright verdict form) to be tried together in a new trial. Oracle opposes that.
  • Oracle is free to try to make a case for infringer's profits but with some limitations.
  • If Oracle does go after infringer's profits, neither party can use any reports or expert witnesses we haven't seen already in front of the current jury.
  • If nothing from Oracle's structure, sequence, and organization (SSO) claim is submitted to a new, future jury, then both parties waive their right to a jury trial over damages related to the nine lines of code in rangeCheck and the decompiled test files.

Again, all of this also depends on whether or not the judge rules if the 37 Java APIs are copyrightable in the first place. Alsup said earlier this week that he probably won't have news on that until next week.

If the judge decides that the SSO of the APIs are not copyrightable, then he could award the statutory damages to Oracle on at least the rangeCheck code and the test files. From there, the trial would move up to the United States Court of Appeals for the Federal Circuit.

On the flip side, if Alsup decides that the APIs are copyrightable, then we could end up with a new trial and a new jury on just the issue of copyright infringement.

Signing the stipulation in approval, Alsup concluded with a smile, "Thanks, counsel, for being so brilliant and solving at least one piece of this problem."

Again, all of this only pertains to the copyright segment of the case. The jury is currently deliberating over patent infringement claims. If the jury finds for Oracle on those, then we will proceed to third phase automatically with the same jury.

However, if they find for Google and that there is no patent infringement, then the jury would be dismissed and their work in this case would be done.

Oracle v. Google: Stipulation Regarding Copyright Damages


Topics: Oracle, Google

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  • Im sick of Oracle

    I dont know if its just me, but it seems to me that Oracle is just a really just an overgrown patent (and now copyright troll). Whatever happened to making a product, and competiing in the marketplace. Its the customer that loses on all this BS and Ill guarantee Oracle, I was going to build a server at the TV station I work at, now, I dont want to give a dime to this horrid, dispicable business. I miss Sun Microsystems.
    • everyone hates Oracle

      and this 'roadmap' leads to $0.00 damages awarded to Elli$on!
      The Linux Geek
      • Even Larry Ellison doesn't like Oracle?

        That's hard to believe. I think it likely, though, that Oracle will get a dollar for the code found to be infringing.
        John L. Ries
    • Most business people would put aside that view.

      IF the company actually made a usefull product. Problem is nowadays there are so many choices that your view does come into play. I'm afraid Oracle has lost whatever good will they may have had and considering their tenuous hold on large scalable databases is being lost to open source, they are doomed.
    • "I miss Sun Microsystems."

      I'll give you this - Oracle is worse, but...'ve got to be kidding me:
      - you miss flimsy rails for v210? (came to work one day to find the server dropped 5 fit from the top of the rack onto a disk array!). Oh - they would sell you better rails - for $250 extra!
      - miss having no grace period for support downloads (took Sun VAR 5 days to process the PO and i couldn't download patch cluster)
      i can go on and on.
  • Bad strategies from Oracle

    Before with Sun Microsystems there are no problems until acquiring sun by Oracle.
    I think the strategies from oracle will loose a big community of java developers to find an alternative, like as made with the new Android system with C#.
    • That depends on the verdict.

      If the Judge rules that APIs cannot be copyrighted then Dalvik can continue to implement the Java language. Developers are far more likely now to abandon Oracle's JVM than Android.
      • If the Judge rules that APIs cannot be copyrighted

        no, it just means an appeal, more dragging, more dragging. . . . .
  • Jury deliberation time is troubling on 2 patents.

    Given the previous phase I would say there is disagreement with at least one person who gets it and cannot be swayed by Oracle nonsense. For tech people who code this is a slam dunk for google. Oracle spin and obfuscation/lies are really hard for civilians to understand. Maybe hung jury on patents?