Can hackers have a disease and be absolved from a crime? Maybe...

By | December 1, 2009, 12:04pm PST

Summary: The Home Ministers of various departments in the U.K. are practically falling over themselves in the Gary McKinnon extradition case. More troubling is that it appears that the basic issue of a crime being committed is now completely overshadowed by the actual events that have taken place since the U.S. Department of Justice issued a request for extradition.

The Home Ministers of various departments in the U.K. are practically falling over themselves in the Gary McKinnon extradition case. More troubling is that it appears that the basic issue of a crime being committed is now completely overshadowed by the actual events that have taken place since the U.S. Department of Justice issued a request for extradition.

Further compounding the issue is the legal team that McKinnon has put forward along with other supporting experts are using arguments that are far off the legal framework it is almost stunning that the justice system even works in the U.K.

In 2001 the U.S. military networks were hacked into. The hack was discovered and the prime suspect, Gary McKinnon (43) who now lives in London, was charged in 2002 by the U.S. government and an extradition request was made. From there it’s been all downhill when viewed from a justice perspective.

Lawyers, Judges and Ministers have tried six different methods of having his extradition stopped. And to make matters worse, Gary McKinnon admitted hacking into the U.S. military networks and has yet to go to any kind of trial. His innocence presumed or not is now compromised and potentially wrecks his opportunity to get a fair trial in the United States.

Three different levels of courts have all denied his requests to turn down his extradition to the United States, among them the European Court of Human Rights, the High Court of the U.K. and High Court of the House of Lords. Now the politicians have entered the fray and nobody appears to even want to recognize that a trial has yet to even occur. Negotiations have already occurred to ensure Mr. McKinnon has certain outcomes if found guilty;

The UK wanted to be sure that Mr McKinnon would not face a military tribunal, will be eligible for parole and that he would not serve his sentence at Guantanamo Bay.

Mr. McKinnon also appears to be making his own original mistakes even worse by changing his story on why he broke into the networks in the first place and claiming he’s a bumbling hacker, despite fact that he’s a former system analyst with extensive IT experience and actually wrote his own perl scripts. Clearly he understands and knows how to hack into networks and knows the difference between legal and illegal access.

Then a new defense approach was taken this year with a medical strategy which suggests that McKinnon, who has Asperger’s syndrome and therefore should avoid such an extradition. McKinnon was diagnosed this year, eight years after the initial hack was carried out. This ‘new’ medical evidence is why the case is being reviewed yet again by the Minister Alan Johnson.

The other angle that the defense team is using is that the trial should be held in the U.K. and not the U.S. This opens up new problems that the courts will have to be wary of in the future. So far in this particular case, none have accepted that argument.  The defense has already suggested the primary reason for trying this tactic - less jail time.  Mr. McKinnon has publicly said he’s terrified of being sent to the United States. In an interview with the BBC, his emotional state seemed very coherent and professional.  His willingness to attempt his own defense during a TV interview is not going to help his legal team or his own outcome. Today the extradition appeal was turned down by the minister but still has another 7 days to file yet another appeal.

Poll

Should a medical condition absolve you from extradition?

Poll

Will Gary McKinnon get a fair trial?

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Disclosure

Doug Hanchard

http://government.zdnet.com/?page_id=5774

Biography

Doug Hanchard

Doug is the principal of Rapid Response Consulting, an advisory group that integrates ICT solutions. He has worked at some of the largest telecommunications firms in Canada, including Bell Canada, Telus and AT&T and is a guest lecturer for several universities and associations. He serves on several advisory boards in Canada and the United States.

Starting with a new national ISP in 1993 in sales, positioning internet access, web sites and network services began the path of telecommunications technologies from the early Bulletin Board Services (BBS) to the first web pages for commercial clients.

Became the National Data Network Service Manager for Frame Relay and Internet access for AccTel Enterprises which was acquired (after 3 mergers already) by AT&T Canada. Interested in how marketing could expand service availability, he moved to Telus to become the Frame Relay / ATM Product Manager and expanded the network across Canada. In 2002 he went to Bell Canada becoming a Solution Architect to get back to his passion for technology working with enterprise clients. In 2006, became the Director of R&D and Senior Solution Architect for Bell Canada Security Solutions Inc, developing I.P. based physical and logical security platforms and ICT services.

This position created new commercial concepts such as Crisis and Disaster technology solutions required for emergency use after an event occurred. He designed interoperable technologies and application combinations allowing any to any I.P. service through landline, broadband, satellite and wireless technologies to be deployed anywhere

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I agree I do miss your points -they are not relevant to the story
doug.hanchard@... 28th Dec 2009
As it pertains to the McKinnon story, none of your points are valid arguements or counter points to the story I have written. Your points about what was or wasn't damaged, what he did or didn't access has no relevance on the case before the Home Office or the courts. There is sufficient circumstantial evidence that McKinnon broke U.S. Intrusion laws into U.S. military and government computer networks. Once Mr. McKinnon is before the court, then the significant of the evidence will decide his fate.

I have simply raised the issue of disease (pick any one you like; cancer, alcholism or autism, take your pick)and should (and can it) it be used as a defense strategy as it pertains to an extradition for a alleged crime in another country. So far, the answer appears to be no, but Gary McKinnon's team has banked everything on it.

Further, there is no plausible legal standing or reason why Mr. McKinnon should have his trial in the U.K. and nor should it be considered from a prosecution point of view. The legal precedence it would create has far reaching consequences.

Mr. McKinnon's legal team continues to argue that McKinnon wouldn't survive in U.S. Prison's. Many would argue that this is a dead-end and completely irrelevant, because he hasn't even gone to trial, let alone a sentencing hearing upon being found guilty.

If McKinnon is convicted, it would not surprise me if McKinnon was allowed to serve out his prison term in the United Kingdom.

Thanks for writing,
Doug
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Aserger's has shades of gray
betelgeuse68 1st Dec 2009
More than likely if he was compelled to try breaking into US systems, it was the technical challenge and machinations in his mind of what it would take. Asperger's is a form of mild autism and if you're more on the impacted side, I can readily see this happening.

But on the other hand, if his situation is a milder form of Asperger's, he was probably well aware that what he was doing was illegal.

The problem is, the law likes to live in black & white and life seldom operates as such.

I don't have enough information about his Asperger's case to make an informed decision but if he's done nothing wrong since then... it would seem the US Justice system is out for revenge at this point. But I'm sure behind the scenes they want to make an example of him so as to dissuade anyone else from even thinking about similar actions.

Except, such attempts are being made I assure you - just ask anyone with a network server facing the Internet. I used to have an SSH tunnel into my home network and I would get login attempts from the Asia/Pacific rim ALL THE TIME. In one case someone was trying for six hours to get into my server and I ultimately shut down SSH just to make them go away.

-M
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And as soon as he's found guilty, he should be strung up by the nads. happy
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Hmm, you did see the bit about Guantanamo Bay in the article?

The US are holding people without charge for years on end with no trial. Is that how you can be so sure if there is a trial it will be fair?

Gary is guilty so tell him how much time he has to serve and let him do it here in the UK - at our cost.

As for the notion that he did $700,000 worth of damage that's problably the amount of money spent to update the systems so they don't get hacked by another drive by hacker, not forgetting a few back pockets to fill or all the capiatl hill hangers on.
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nahh..
NoThomas 2nd Dec 2009
"Hmm, you did see the bit about Guantanamo Bay in the article? The US are holding people without charge for years on end with no trial. Is that how you can be so sure if there is a trial it will be fair?" They US is holding war criminals there, are you saying he is a war criminal?

"Gary is guilty so tell him how much time he has to serve and let him do it here in the UK - at our cost." nahh, yall could easily just let him out, nothing the US could do then.

"As for the notion that he did $700,000 worth of damage that's problably the amount of money spent to update the systems so they don't get hacked by another drive by hacker, not forgetting a few back pockets to fill or all the capiatl hill hangers on. " One report says he knew the location of the US Navy's 6th Fleet, could that be how much fuel it cost to move the fleet?
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McKinnon "terrified" of US prisons...
M.R. Kennedy 2nd Dec 2009
"Gary is guilty so tell him how much time he has to serve and let him do it here in the UK - at our cost."

Let's ignore his rather fallacious mention of Gitmo. Snowball's chance in Hades of his ever being sent there.

But considering the descriptions of UK prisons I've seen (which are probably apocryphal, for the most part), he'd be far better off worrying about being incarcerated in the UK.

Most US Federal prisons (medium or low security) provide far better living conditions.
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happy
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Gods, I hope not
Palmetto_CharlieSpencer 2nd Dec 2009
You and I can't afford to subsidize the medical treatment for everybody else grin
what a lot of rubbish!

most of your facts are wrong!

Gary McKinnon was born autistic and was officially diagnosed a year and a half ago, NOT this year - by a top specialist in the field no less and two others (for good measure, just as experienced autism specialists)

and he 'admitted' to crime without a lawyer present and AFTER HOURS AND HOURS OF QUESTIONING and after being threatened that his girlfriend will be kept in the police cells UNTIL he 'confesses'

Gary has also been diagnosed by top psychiatrists to have severe depression and paranoid delusion - THAT is not just autism, that's serious
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Serious it is...
doug.hanchard@... Updated - 1st Dec 2009
I don't believe Mr. McKinnon was threatened into doing the BBC interview, which I submitted as a link within the article. You can make your own mind up whether or not it was coerced or not.

As to his form of Autism, Asperger's syndrome, I said in my story;



Then a new defense approach was taken this year with a medical strategy which suggests that McKinnon, who has Asperger?s syndrome and therefore should avoid such an extradition. McKinnon was diagnosed this year, eight years after the initial hack was carried out.


I never disputed, suggested or implied whether or not he was born Asperger syndrome. Even if was 18 months ago instead of a year ago with respects to the diagnosis by medical professionals, it wasn't used as a part of his legal defence in his appeal to the European Court of Human Rights until this year.

With respects to depression or paranoid delusions by medical professionals is not part of the article. The question remains; if you have such an illness, disease or lack certain functions, should that allow an individual to escape the law or punishment?

As I said in my blog, every court in England and Europe has declined to agree with Mr. McKinnon's legal team and now it's before the Ministers, which would be making a political decision and not one based on the statues currently in force throughout the United Kingdom.

It should be noted that other attempts to use a disease or illness as a defence all over the world. With the exception of capital murder crimes, in a search of the internet, I can not find a single case that has had success. I did a search on Autism and Aspergers Syndrome to determine if such conditions had been used as a component in a legal defence and could find none until Mr. McKinnon's case showed up.

Doug

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I have made the same arguments...
NoThomas 2nd Dec 2009
at zdnet uk. Do a search for my username and you will find my postings.

Would he get a fair trial in the US?
Yes, there has been very little news coverage here. It should be easy to find a Jury that has never heard of him. Would he get a fair trial in the UK? Probably not, it would be slanted towards him with all the public outcry and news coverage.

As for aspergers interesting enough there is another case in which it was taken into consideration for sentencing "A Los Angeles hacker received a slightly reduced sentence Monday of 55 months in prison for participating in a multimillion-dollar computer-fraud scheme, after a federal judge took into account the man?s diagnosis with Asperger?s Syndrome." http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2009/08/truckers/

For some Aspergers is the main argument, here is my point. Where was the public outcry when "In the United Kingdom, a 21-year-old student with Asperger's was given only four months of jail time for possession of 922 pornographic images of children." According to Garys defense team that 21 year old student should not of gone to jail, nor should the case of a "22-year-old woman with Asperger's who was sentenced to life in prison for beating her mother to death, saying her lack of empathy didn't reduce the gravity of the crime." http://www.slate.com/id/2233313/pagenum/all/

Gary's main defense seems to be damages, he admits to the hacking but deny's causing any damage. (according to the extradition treaty he had to of cause a certain amount of damages to be extradited, I think its about $700,000 but I might be wrong) Like that should make it ok.

he did not just accidently stumble onto the militaries network, He created the perl scripts to find computers with weakened security, he then used that to compromise the computers. It is like me walking down a block of houses and going to each door to see if its unlocked, according to his defense team its ok for me to enter those houses as long as I do not cause any damage to them. How does that make sense?

Are these the actions of someone looking for ET?





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Good points
doug.hanchard@... 2nd Dec 2009
Thank you for submitting your comments.

Doug
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Its not right
Ray Harding 2nd Dec 2009
The Asperger?s defence is the last roll of the dice for Gary's defence team. Personally I think the US should not be extraditing and should be thankful that it was Gary's activities that alerted them to the security holes instead of suffering a cyber attack from a hostile regime/group. If the US government are looking for a whipping boy for the security breaches then I believe they should be looking inwards at the persons incharge of the facilities in the first place for having such lax security.
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huh...
NoThomas 2nd Dec 2009
So if someone was walking down your street, found your garage open or door unlocked and let themselves in your house and sat down on your couch and look thru your personal stuff, then you would thank them for alerting you to the fact that you left your door unlocked or garage door open? Would it not be better for them not to enter your house at all? Is it ok for me to hack your PC as long as I just look thru your personal files, You would thank me for that?
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Someone explain why Asperger's should prevent extradition.
Palmetto_CharlieSpencer Updated - 2nd Dec 2009
What's the connection? What are the medical repercussions of putting McKinnon on a cruise ship to NYC? We transport critically wounded military personnel halfway across the world on a daily basis. If he actually has Asperger's, why would it prevent him traveling? If it plays any part in the legal process, it's a factor to be introduced in sentencing. It's not a reason for him not to stand trial, or for him to avoid extradition.
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The logic is...
NoThomas 2nd Dec 2009
Its like an obsession, he was almost forced to do it, atleast that is what his defence team is saying.

They are also saying he is scared to death, and because of that he is under a severe depression and might be suicidal, which the EU could then block extradition under the Human Rights Clause. That is what his defence team is arguing.
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Funny how he gets more scared the longer he delays.
Palmetto_CharlieSpencer 2nd Dec 2009
As the original post noted, he's coherent enough to participate in his defense.

I'd be scared too if I was facing a trial. EVERYBODY is scared when they're the guest of honor at one. Find me someone who looks forward to the experience.
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ohh I agree with you.
NoThomas 2nd Dec 2009
I imagine I would go into a severe depression facing 6 years in the federal pokey. I do not like the precedent either. All a bad guy has to say is, oh hey yes I commited that crime but hey if you try to take me to court well I might commite suicide so...
If I leave my garage open with valuables inside I would expect it to get robbed. However, I am not talking about a garage I am talking about the US department of defence. They should not have left their doors open. And they are lucky it was a hacker from the UK that got in instead of a ******** fanatical groups/regimes. When security is your business especially if your protecting a country then I think that you have to take a reasonable amount responsibility for leaving your doors open. Gary does deserve to be punished but punishment should fit crime and the crime originated in the UK so he should be sentanced in the UK.
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They are lucky..
NoThomas 2nd Dec 2009
"If I leave my garage open with valuables inside I would expect it to get robbed." Thats a sad world we live in where you would expect to be robbed.

"However, I am not talking about a garage I am talking about the US department of defence. They should not have left their doors open. And they are lucky it was a hacker from the UK that got in instead of a ******** fanatical groups/regimes." They are lucky but still does not excuse him. They should not of left their doors open you are right but one does not preclude the other. If I accidently left my door open and someone robs me that is not ok, the defence should not be well he left his doors open so I robbed him.

"Gary does deserve to be punished" You said earlier it was not right for him to be punished.

"but punishment should fit crime and the crime originated in the UK so he should be sentanced in the UK." No he broke into the US goverments server's and systems, he commited a crime on US Soil the Millisecond he trespassed onto the US systems.

As for the punishment fitting the crime, I would like to point out that he was offered a 18 month plea deal but he turned it down, which forced the US to charge him fully which is 6 years in the federal pokey for a felony.

Yes now he wants to be charged in the UK, know why? All he can be charged for is a misdemenour and face community service. The UK government refused to charge him with even that which is why the US government did charge him.

2 things I would like to point out, first if the UK goverment did charge him then one could make an argument of double jeopardy. Since the UK refused to charge him then they opened it up for the US government.
Second he needs to come to the US to face trial for the simple point, if he was on trial in the UK his defence team could say that since the systems he broke into were on American soil, the UK courts have no jurisdiction so they do not have any standing to listen to the case.
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Place of judgement...
doug.hanchard@... Updated - 2nd Dec 2009
Ray,

You suggested;


Gary does deserve to be punished but punishment should fit crime and the crime originated in the UK so he should be sentenced in the UK.


I recognize how you have come to this conclusion, but it's not how the law works for (almost) all crimes that are international in nature.

Mr. McKinnon's break and enter started in the U.K. but broke into a U.S. physically located property and thus the laws and institutions that can represent prosecution are a U.S. right of juridiction. This does not mean that the U.S. Attorney General Office exercises this priviledge and ability in all cases or circumstances. When it does, the grounds for extradition, as in this case, suggest they are valid.

The extradition treaty has no bearing on who should be able to prosecute, and does not influence - as far as I know even the type of trial. As I noted in my post, the U.K. government did make a request of the U.S. Attorney ensuring that Mr. McKinnon would not wind up in Cuba.

The United States made the request and both country's have a treaty, thus the actions requested if compliant (with U.K. law) will be adheared to. It's likely one of the reasons Mr. McKinnon's legal team has hit significant road blocks in getting it overturned by any Home Office Minister or MP.

In an interesting parallel, the recent break up of an international fraud ring (U.S. Canada, U.K. etc.) stealing over $9M in a single day will likely have a blend of extraditions and local enforcement actions.

Nobody knows exactly what outcomes of that incident will be until legal proceedings begin.

Doug
The fact that he gained enough knowledge to hack these websites demonstrates his capabilities. All hackers of this type (bad guys) should be thrown in jail for as long as possible.
I think instead of all the fanatical wrangling and silliness they should be making a big pile of the "books" that will be thrown at him if he's found guilty. IF he's a mental case, then simply replace the prison building with a mental facility - one way or another he goes away from the public long enough to make sure his knowledge is outdated by the time he's released. The Guantanamo reference is a little stoopid, but in his case I'd likely make an exception and vote to use the big G just for him.
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Hanchard misses the point entirely
FrankNSense 28th Dec 2009
Hanchard misses the point entirely it is not about the rights and wrongs of hacking it is about the injustice to all british people that they are all victims to a treaty where one side does not have to provide any evidence whatsoever. Would Americans stand for say, Russia to be able to extradite Americans with no evidence and no trial? Not a hope! so why should British not have the same rights as Americans?
Gary McKinnon admitted illegal access (ie.just looking) technically he didn?t ?Hack?, there were no passwords or firewalls on thousands of machines. He was looking for UFO evidence. Illegal access was not extraditable, in fact, it only carried a six month sentence in the UK. To be extraditable there has to be a damage element to the charge with a minimum threshold of $5000. America indicted him with causing magically $5000 damage on each system he ventured on to??? In fact, originally the indictment included six university systems all of which publically denied any damage was caused, so they were quietly dropped, and a new superseding indictment issued without them, which is very telling.
Had the US tried to extradite under the old treaty they would have had to prove the damage in a UK court which, of course, they could not do, so they waited over three years for the one-sided treaty to be used whereby they did not have to prove anything! (The original US evidence of damage was dismissed by the Crown Prosecution Service as hearsay, inadmissible and not able to be abducted! I have the letter from the CPS which states that)
Gary McKinnon was appalled at the total lack of security in the US systems so he left countless notes telling them to do something about their security. These letters are never mentioned, only the one with an emotive value that can be used against him.
His cyber peace protest "US foreign policy is akin to government-sponsored terrorism these days..." half the world believes that... we are talking Bush and illegal invasion of Iraq with the resultant death of hundreds of thousands of innocent people... Perhaps I missed something but I didn?t think criticising a government?s foreign policy was extraditable.
"It was not a mistake that there was a huge security stand-down on September 11 last year..." rightly or wrongly Gary believed that 911 and the collapse of the three buildings, was an inside job. Why, he asks, when FAA rules demand that fighter planes investigate any aircraft that deviates from its flight path for 5 minutes, were no fighters sent up when these four aircraft deviated for up to one and a half hours!
He did not delete anything other than his own traces and as for shutting down the entire military district of Washington... from an antique dial-up computer? I don't think so; if the biggest military power on the planet can be switched off from somebody?s bedroom then god help us all. If they shut it down themselves in panic... then that's another story.
Analysis by a UK digital forensic expert of the damage claims appears to be the cost of installing the very security measures that should have been there in the first place. The actions which the prosecuting authorities want him to answer to is the fact that he pointed out that their security was non-existent and this is another case of victimising the whistle blower.
Hanchard's implication that McKinnon's Aspergers diagnosis was a legal convenience is shocking in the extreme. He was diagnosed by the three most eminent Autism experts on the planet. No one said Autism is a defence but it IS mitigation and a good reason why, when Lord Justice Stanley Burton stated McKinnon could be tried in London, that it is unbelievably cruel, inhumane and unnecessary to drag him away from his medical support, family and loved ones just to appease the US government's embarrassment. Anyone who knows Autism knows how devastating, damaging and catastrophic that would be.
As it pertains to the McKinnon story, none of your points are valid arguements or counter points to the story I have written. Your points about what was or wasn't damaged, what he did or didn't access has no relevance on the case before the Home Office or the courts. There is sufficient circumstantial evidence that McKinnon broke U.S. Intrusion laws into U.S. military and government computer networks. Once Mr. McKinnon is before the court, then the significant of the evidence will decide his fate.

I have simply raised the issue of disease (pick any one you like; cancer, alcholism or autism, take your pick)and should (and can it) it be used as a defense strategy as it pertains to an extradition for a alleged crime in another country. So far, the answer appears to be no, but Gary McKinnon's team has banked everything on it.

Further, there is no plausible legal standing or reason why Mr. McKinnon should have his trial in the U.K. and nor should it be considered from a prosecution point of view. The legal precedence it would create has far reaching consequences.

Mr. McKinnon's legal team continues to argue that McKinnon wouldn't survive in U.S. Prison's. Many would argue that this is a dead-end and completely irrelevant, because he hasn't even gone to trial, let alone a sentencing hearing upon being found guilty.

If McKinnon is convicted, it would not surprise me if McKinnon was allowed to serve out his prison term in the United Kingdom.

Thanks for writing,
Doug
He has one O level, is not an expert as confirmed by previous employers who described his knowledge as unremarkable. He was originally a hairdresser and has been a UFO enthusiast since he was a child.
The U.S computers had no passwords or firewalls on thousands of machines and Gary McKinnon was the whistleblower who left messages warning them their security was crap. Thank God it was Gary McKinnon that alerted them and not a terrorist.

The U.S requested extradition from the U.K three years after they indicted Gary McKinnon, because the U.K had then started using an extradition treaty with the U.S whereby America no longer had to prove the alleged damage Gary has always denied.
Without the financial damage it was not an extraditable offense in 2002.

No one in the World has ever been extradited for computer misuse, so why Gary? because he was naive enough to admit computer misuse without having a lawyer.
A Romanian man who hacked into the Pentagon was sentenced to 8 months in prison in Romania. No extradition request was made. Romania will not extradite it's own citizens without evidence and neither will America. About time the U.K had equal rights to Americans.
If we in the U.K want to extradite an American we have to provide Probable cause, to extradite a U.K citizen the U.S only needs to have a suspicion.
The U.K wanted America to extradite IRA terrorists that murdered British women and children but America wouldn't do it.

This one sided extradition treaty Britain was duped into signing was supposedly only to be used for terrorists but it's being used against a 67 year old cancer victim for price fixing and against a UFO guy with Aspergers.
Terrorists are not being extradited but instead the U.S are targetting vulnerable members of British society.

If the boot was on the other foot there is no way we would be able to extradite an American for the same offence and we in the U.K would have to provide actual evidence of the crime which would make it extraditable.

Hilary Clinton says American girl Amanda Knox was convicted of murder because of anti American feeling but that doesn't explain how Amanda Knox's Italian boyfriend was jointly convicted of the horrendous murder of a young English girl.

I personally think many American officials do not like British people and the British government are too afraid of America to stand up for any British citizen. At least America and France stand up for their own.

What chance does Gary McKinnon have of getting a fair trial when you strongly suggest in this article that his Aspergers is untrue.

As Aspergers was only recognised by the World Health Organisation in the mid 1990's, Gary McKinnon was 30 years old by then so could not possibly have been diagnosed as a child.
His appearance in the public eye fortunately brought him to the attention of experts in the field.
World famous artist Peter Howson was also diagnosed only recently despite being 50 years old and many adults remain undiagnosed and struggle every day of their lives as they are confused by the world around them.

It is true that the U.K do not view computer misuse anywhere nearly as seriously as America does. We realise that most hackers end up running computer security companies and no harm done.

This witchunt against Gary McKinnon seems extreme in the eyes of most Brits and Europeans and we see it as a hangover from the paranoia of the Bush era which we hoped had gone for good.

Gary McKinnon has already served a cruel sentence of almost eight years of his life. Even an animal would not be kept in a heightened state of terror for anywhere near this length of time without a huge outcry from people around the world.

Time to drop this America, it is severely damaging relations between the people of our countries.
Gary McKinnon should be tried in the U.K. He is not a fugitive, he was not in America and did not flee America; he was on a dial up connection on a home computer in London over eight years ago.

As I understand it the perl script was not written by him but pieced together from the internet. A perl script as you must surely know is a very basic simple thing and Gary McKinnon was no more than a script kiddie.

Incidentally, his Aspergers was diagnosed by three of the Worlds leading experts including Professor Simon Baron Cohen. Do you doubt their expertise?

Many people with Aspergers are articulate but confusion is rife re-social rules and an understanding of what's expected of them and of the consequences of their actions.

Understanding is what's needed here and not brute force to drag someone from their own country.

Why not help us fight for equal rights for British citizens. Now that would be Justice.

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