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Adrian Kingsley-Hughes

Windows 7 beta testers - get ready for a wipe and reload

By | April 8, 2009, 5:35am PDT

Summary: The latest post on Microsoft’s Engineering Windows 7 blog outlines what existing Windows 7 beta testers will have to do in order to be able upgrade to the release candidate. Two words: Clean install.

The latest post on Microsoft’s Engineering Windows 7 blog outlines what existing Windows 7 beta testers will have to do in order to be able upgrade to the release candidate.

Two words: Clean install.

We’ve also learned that many of you (millions) are running Windows 7 Beta full time. You’re anxious for a refresh. You’ve installed all your applications. You’ve configured and customized the system. You would love to get the RC and quickly upgrade to it from Beta. The RC, however, is about getting breadth coverage to validate the product in real-world scenarios. As a result, we want to encourage you to revert to a Vista image and upgrade or to do a clean install, rather than upgrade the existing Beta.  We know that means reinstalling, recustomizing, reconfiguring, and so on.  That is a real pain.  The reality is that upgrading from one pre-release build to another is not a scenario we want to focus on because it is not something real-world customers will experience. During development we introduce changes in the product (under the hood) that aren’t always compatible with what we call “build-to-build” upgrade.  The supported upgrade scenario is from Windows Vista to Windows 7. [emphasis added]

This was to be expected. After all, given all the changes since the Beta 1 build and the RC build, it’s unrealistic to expect to be able to upgrade and guarantee no problems. However, given that the Beta 1 build was released early January, and it’s now early April, beta testers have had three months to set up their systems and get comfortable. Back when Vista was being beta tested, testers had access to new builds regularly, so test systems were always in a state of flux.

However, if you really want to avoid carrying out a clean install, Microsoft has offered a workaround:

  1. Download the ISO as you did previously and burn the ISO to a DVD.
  2. Copy the whole image to a storage location you wish to run the upgrade from (a bootable flash drive or a directory on any partition on the machine running the pre-release build).
  3. Browse to the sources directory.
  4. Open the file cversion.ini in a text editor like Notepad.
  5. Modify the MinClient build number to a value lower than the down-level build. For example, change 7100 to 7000 (pictured below).
  6. Save the file in place with the same name.
  7. Run setup like you would normally from this modified copy of the image and the version check will be bypassed.

Personally, I wouldn’t do this because there’s a good chance that you’ll end up having to do a clean install anyway.

It’s also worth repeating Microsoft’s warnings on playing it safe:

ALWAYS BACK UP YOUR MACHINE before running any OS installation and NEVER TEST AN OS ON YOUR ONLY COPY OF ANY DATA. Testing a pre-release product means just that—it is testing and it is pre-release. Even though this is a Release Candidate, we are still testing the product. We have very high confidence but even if an error happens once in 1,000,000 we want to make sure everyone is taking the precautions normal for a pre-release product.

Good medicine.

Windows 7 beta testers aren’t the only ones who will find themselves having to carry out a clean install in order to go up to the release candidate (or final release) of Windows 7. XP users will also find themselves unable to upgrade.

Speaking of the real world, many have asked about upgrading from Windows XP. There’s no change here to the plan as has been discussed on many forums.  We realized at the start of this project that the “upgrade” from XP would not be an experience we think would yield the best results. There are simply too many changes in how PCs have been configured (applets, hardware support, driver model, etc.) that having all of that support carry forth to Windows 7 would not be nearly as high quality as a clean install.

So if you gave Vista a miss and hoped that Windows 7 would be an easy upgrade, you’re outta luck. That said, I’ve never found upgrading to be the easy option in the long run and nothing beats a clean install.

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Adrian Kingsley-Hughes is an internationally published technology author who has devoted over a decade to helping users get the most from technology.

Disclosure

Adrian Kingsley-Hughes

All opinions expressed on Hardware 2.0 are those of Adrian Kingsley-Hughes. Every effort is made to ensure that the information posted is accurate. If you have any comments, queries or corrections, please contact Adrian via the email link here. Any possible conflicts of interest will be posted below. [Updated: February 23, 2010] - Adrian Kingsley-Hughes has no business relationships, affiliations, investments, or other actual/potential conflicts of interest relating to the content posted so far on this blog.

Biography

Adrian Kingsley-Hughes

Adrian Kingsley-Hughes is an internationally published technology author who has devoted over a decade to helping users get the most from technology -- whether that be by learning to program, building a PC from a pile of parts, or helping them get the most from their new MP3 player or digital camera.

Adrian has authored/co-authored technical books on a variety of topics, ranging from programming to building and maintaining PCs. His most recent books include "Build the Ultimate Custom PC", "Beginning Programming" and "The PC Doctor's Fix It Yourself Guide". He has also written training manuals that have been used by a number of Fortune 500 companies.

Adrian also runs a popular blog under the name The PC Doctor, where he covers a range of computer-related topics -- from security to repairing and upgrading.

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Upgrade from Vista sp1 Ultimate to 7 RC ... EASY!!!
SonicLogic 7th May 2009
So I burnt the dvd poped it in my Vista Ultimate machine got a really nice Windows 7 wallpaper click about two times it checked if I was compatible and I was but it had to disable Vista ultimate download content. Which it did by it self after a restart. There was also a little thing with my ATI Catalyst where it recommended me to uninstall it before setup and reinstall it once in Windows 7 (which I did and got the windows 7 version). Go through the setup process again click bout two times selected Upgrade and that was it only asked me to verify time and input serial number. Easiest windows install or update EVER in my opinion and Ive installed many times. Afterwards in Windows 7 all my software works settings are the same just had to reinstall the ATI catalyst and done same system different windows. The only thing ive noticed no to work is the AMD BOOST feature from the AMD Fusion for Gaming app (the app crashes) i would recommend people try that app out if you own amd ati gear. But apart from that im really impressed with the upgrade no fuss and it was only about 1 restart or 2 and all done in windows environment.
On Windows you have to go out of your way to do that, but it's well worth the effort.
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I don't even put data on the same disk as the OS
xXSpeedzXx Updated - 8th Apr 2009
The OS disk is more likely to fail due the reading and writing that is always going on. Always put data on a separate disk(s). Raid 5 is good, Raid 5,1 is better. If you can't do raid, Secondary HD in Case is good, and back that up to a USB/E-SATA drive. And to be really redunant, make a 3rd copy and store it off site, in like a safety deposit box.

And then Ghost or mirror your OS drive to another internal secondary drive. This way if it fails, your up and going in no time.
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I think maybe four or five have been due to hard drive failure. The most common reason is OS upgrade, of which I only do clean installs because the small amount of time I spend on it now is usually a heck of a lot more time saved in the future. "Registry rot" is the next most common reason, and those are usually computers in which the primary user logs in as an admin and takes full advantage of that fact.

But I agree that ghosting the OS/programs partition is an excellent practice. And off-site data backup is the most important practice of all.
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A safe deposit box?
mwagner@... 8th Apr 2009
How serious a disaster do you want to mitigate? If loss of music and photos is all you care about, a safe deposit box is overkill.

On the other hand, if you depend upon your system for your livelihood, you have to consider how much data you can afford to lose and how much time you can afford to lose to recover what you can and be back on line.

Disaster recovery is about more than losing a disk drive.

A large enterprise not only keeps nightly incremental back-ups off site, they often operate a redundant "hot site" some distance away to insure that diaster-recovery is measured in hours, not days.
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It's not possible
frgough 8th Apr 2009
to have programs on a different partition. Regardless of where you tell
Windows to install a program, it will still throw a bunch of that program
on drive C.
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True...
Badgered 8th Apr 2009
It's not possible to have programs on a different partition. Regardless of where you tell Windows to install a program, it will still throw a bunch of that program on drive C.

True, some DLLs, and obviously registry settings are stored on your boot volume.

I'd say keep your data on a separate partition, and keep your install disks handy.
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Not what I meant
Michael Kelly 8th Apr 2009
I meant OS and programs on one partition, data on another. So in Windows XP that's the Documents and Settings folder, and in Vista the Users and ProgramData folders. I presume Windows 7 uses Vista's structure.
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Don't expect a response
Kaiwai 9th Apr 2009
People around here do the old 'post and run' rather than enter into any
meaningful dialogue.

You raise an interesting issue when there was a study which compared
Windows users to Mac users; Mac users tended to use external
storage as extra storage (for documents and stuff) to use regularly
where as Windows users tend to use theirs as primarily for backup.
Not too sure how scientific the study was but as shown by the number
of Windows users here to dump all their stuff on one hard disk - its
fairly accurate.

For me, all my stuff is stored on my external hard disk and backed up
again onto a thumb drive just incase the external hard disk dies.
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Blog Post Comment Not A Forum
rmark@... 9th Apr 2009
Sorry, but this is a comment section for a blog post, not a forum where you can get emails when someone responds to your entry. Don't expect people to "Chat" here.
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response
aussieblnd@... Updated - 10th Apr 2009
and how will all this affct Programs. Microsoft's own programs will have to be re-installed which means yet another call to MSFT to activate office etc.. (office being one of the programs that must be tested for function with Windows 7) Micrsoft may or may not let you do this 7-8 times in one year while testing.
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Regardless of where you tell Windows to install a program, it will still throw a bunch of that program on drive C.

You tell the installer where to install the program. And if it places files outside of that location then it is the installer that is to blame.
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Select your mission-critical ...
mwagner@... 8th Apr 2009
... applications wisely and this can be managed.

More importantly though, ever since XP came out it has been straightforward to locate user files on a separate partition/drive. It is even easier under Vista and more so under Windows 7.

It is less straightforward to isolate programs from the Windows OS due to the design characteristics of Windows but well-written programs will put data wherever you want them to put it.

In the end, as long as you can relocate and selectively backup user/customer data and application data, it doesn't matter very much where application software gets installed.

I think the point though of this blog is that a clean install of a new OS is always "best practice" for many reasons.
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Moving user data to another disk
Earthling2 Updated - 9th Apr 2009
Each directory under Users\<user name>, such as Documents, Pictures, etc. has a Location tab in the properties dialog. There you can change it to be on another disk. Windows will move the files from the current locatoin to the new one. If you're moving to the existing directory, Windows will take care of merging the content (it will ask you what to do, as usual).

You can also try and just drag and drop directories from one disk to another (make sure you hold shift so that they get moved, not copied). It usually takes about 1 minute after reinstall to merge empty user directories with existing stuff on another disk.

Programs and settings is another issue of course, but at least this way the precious data are safe.
That implies you are not backing up and could not just restore after an upgrade.
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No it does NOT.
It is always a VERY good idea to back up data.

However, if the data was already (preferably by default) on a separate partition, your data would already be in the right place after an upgrad or reinstall. You do not need to copy back your backed-up data.

DO make backups anyway; you never know when a mistake deletes your partition.
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Great article
Cylon Centurion 8th Apr 2009
I really can't wait to see what they've got going on in the RC. So far, I'm loving what I see.


Personally, I think Microsoft is doing the right thing in not allowing XP upgrades. XP and Se7en are two different operating systems, and they're saving themselves massive supports calls by not allowing the upgrade.
Hell, even with me running Vista SP1, I still wouldn't upgrade. It'll be a nice time setting everything up again, but it'l be well worth it.
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Xp and Se7en are two different operating systems...
SpikeyMike Updated - 8th Apr 2009
... and so are XP and Vista. Yet, Windows 7 is just a point release from Vista.

Not that I disagree with the clean install route - I am just pointing out the obvious.
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Which makes you wonder
LiquidLearner 8th Apr 2009
If they shouldn't have allowed Vista to be upgraded to from XP... I suppose you don't have a choice when it's your previous OS though. It really wasn't a good experience. And I'm not sure that calling 7 "just a point release" is really correct. 7 was in development before the Vista we wound up with, I'm pretty sure a lot of Vista was taken from early work on 7. I can't currently recall the old code names from before XP shipped.

You can call 7 a lot of things. Personally I think it's a good step up from Vista, and I liked Vista before I started using 7. Even prefered it over XP. There's no question I'll be going to 7 the day it comes out.
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but figured I'd see how the upgrade went on Vista SP1 first. Never did do that reload... Everything just worked, except the printer that I could barely make work on Vista. And I can't make it work on a fresh load of 7057 either. Oh well, lasted 7 years. Can't really complain. Wife has been bugging me to get a new one anyway.
The benefits of reinstalling the Windows OS rather than upgrading are well-established. (Heck, in the old days (pre-XP) we used to reinstall the SAME OS version annually just to keep Windows running well. The real problem though isn't separating the data from the OS files -- that's easy enough -- it's the growing number of applications with install counters. Even when properly unistalled before wiping the HD, I end up on the phone begging Adobe and Nuance and a half-dozen other software vendors for "one more install, pretty please." It's demeaning, time-wasting, and ultimately will drive me away from their software (I'll NEVER re-purchase an application because I need to re-install it for legitimate reasons), but right now it's a big part of the OS re-install process.
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If these companies were smart
Michael Kelly 8th Apr 2009
they would make exceptions in their database for Windows beta testers, increasing the number of installs to somewhere in the 15-20 range. By beta testing with their software installed you're doing THEM a favor.
I always do a clean install anyway. If oyu are "hard core" enough to install pre-release code, you should be prepared to clean install each release. Once it's GOLD, then Windows Update will take care of that for you but, until then ...
I really appreciate this article, as I was going to attempt to "upgrade" from the 7000 build, but clearly, it will not work.

And, yes I really feel like I made a mistake by installing it over Vista instead of sticking with a dual boot PC, but keeping both systems up to date felt like a royal pain.

In Microsoft's defense, there were warnings that once 7 was released, I would have to do a clean install once more, so I knew the day would come were all of my work in tweaking 7 would be in vain, but it is a lot like death. Knowing it is about to happen does not make the experience any more welcome.
What did you expect? After all, you are only testing it. If you installed 7 because you expected something in return, then you are not a tester.
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Adrian, When Is RC Going To Be Released??
itanalyst2@... 8th Apr 2009
Just so I can mark it.
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Funny titles
Earthling2 9th Apr 2009
It is interesting to see how the original blog entry title, "Delivering a quality upgrade experience" changed to "Windows 7 testers - RC is a clean install" and the main emphasis - on importance of testing Vista to Win7 (rather than build-to-build) upgrades - to "what existing Windows 7 beta testers will have to do ... Two words: Clean install."

That's why I prefer to read the originals. :-\
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I would never try to "upgrade" on a beta.
No_Ax_to_Grind 9th Apr 2009
That would be the errand of a fool. Sorry...
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No, it isn't the 'errand of a fool'
Lerianis 9th Apr 2009
The fact is that is EXACTLY what Microsoft does with their own testing computers. They do NOT do clean installs.... they just do upgrade, upgrade, upgrade as the tester builds come out.

Microsoft had better have a workaround for this, or I'll have a workaround for their OS...... WIPING IT TOTALLY OFF MY COMPUTERS!
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Uh, I am sure your right. Pfftt...
No_Ax_to_Grind 11th Apr 2009
Oh well, you won't be using it anyhow so no biggie, CYA.
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RE: Windows 7 beta testers - get ready for a wipe and reload
RedsReboot-22599354177376338262696428243341 9th Apr 2009
Does anyone know when/where we might see this new release? Hopefully I can find it without using torrents. That takes too long.
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Always clean load! Always.
Narg 9th Apr 2009
It doesn't matter if it's a Windows Beta, Linux Beta, or OSX Beta. I've always found it best to load the release versions cleanly. There seems to be no way to get around problems that you WILL have if you don't do it that way.

Overall, I think people need to learn that an OS is not a brick outhouse. It's only a part of the whole computer, and itself can easily break, and also if you compute properly can be easily replaced. Backup!
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No, don't clean load
Lerianis 9th Apr 2009
There is no reason why there should be a problem doing an upgrade installation of a Beta to an RC. None whatsoever, because it is OVERWRITING ALL THE FILES! Period and done with, when something is overwriting everything ANYWAY..... no reason for there to be problems.

Personally, I've been downloading the 'tester builds' of Windows 7 for 4 weeks now.... no problems installing them over an earlier beta build.

This is just Microsoft playing their stupid little games again, and hoping that people will be stupid enough to make the argument that you made.
When Windows 7 is released in its final form, how many of the people who get it will perform an upgrade from an earlier Windows 7 build? Maybe .001%. How is it a "stupid little game" for Microsoft to encourage its testers to test the RC build using the methods that real customers will be using (clean in stall, upgrade over Vista)?

Interestingly, when I read the Microsoft blog post, I see it as them *going out of their way* to describe in detail a workaround that will *allow* the build-to-build upgrade that you want to do. Normally Microsoft wouldn't bother with this and would leave it up to "others" to figure out and spread (which they likely would have).
You are forgetting that in the REAL WORLD, things aren't always 'upgraded' the way that Microsoft thinks they should be. Heck, I upgraded Windows SP3 BETA to Vista.... yet it still went through okay.

Same thing applies here. Microsoft, as I said before and as MANY other people have agreed once they THOUGHT ABOUT IT, is playing their games once again.

"Install it our way or don't install it!" is basically what they are saying. There should be NONE OF THIS BUNK. Just let it overinstall XP, Vista, Vista Beta, Windows 7 Beta.... and don't play the games.

As I said before, you are OVERWRITING EVERY SINGLE FILE IN WINDOWS DIRECTORY 99.99999999999% of the time! Except those made by ADD-ON APPLICATIONS

There just is absolutely no need to require an install from Vista by making it so freaking hard (and yes, editing a file and copying nearly 3GB's of files to your hard drive IS HARD FOR THE AVERAGE USER AND CONSUMER BETA TESTER).

Just don't even bother with the minimum build bull. It's time to stop playing those games. Every other company has learned that. I betatest NUMEROUS other applications...... they don't pull this bull. They just allow me to install over the beta version once the final comes out!
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7000 to RC upgrade
tora@... 15th Apr 2009
There is a good reason for MS going out of their way to describe a workaround.
When MS released the beta to the public they asking testers to use the build as their daily OS, for everything they would normally do, to give a good working over.
Considering that, the only decent thing is to give an upgrade work around.
Anyone with the savvy to even desire the BETA will be aware of this and deal with it accordingly. Perhaps the article would have been better aimed at less knowledgeable "newbies" that those already in the know. To me it is insulting.
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Clean install is the only way to go
chrisportela 9th Apr 2009
The clean install is basically the simplest way to install an OS. It SEEMS like its more complex but in the end it's a lot better. You don't really deal with all the upgrade issues. Besides it wipes the system clean so it's back to the basics and as fast as it's going to get(I mean unless you super customize it to be fast as hell)
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There is no such thing
emenau 11th Apr 2009
You can't 'clean' install a 'DIRTY' OS. wink
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Clean Install Save Money
PeterPac Updated - 9th Apr 2009
And why exactly should I waste money buying Vista just so I can upgrade to Windows 7. By chance do you work for Microsoft? Any knowledgeable computer user can save and place programs/documents/pics on external devices, in another partition and just install Windows 7, then place or install the programs into it. With the economy the way it is people just do not have the money to be buying Vista just to upgrade from XP to Vista and then to Windows 7. We are not talking $20.00 to do this but hundreds of dollars when people do not have the money to spend doing all this.

MS is crying because Vista flopped in sales and now want everyone to buy both OS's. Get real. I myself will not throw away money and buy 2 operating systems when I can just buy Windows 7 and start from there.

There are loads of advice on the internet to show just how to save data and program installations from XP, do a clean install of a operating system and add everything back on it without costing the price of 2 operating systems.
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NO CLEAN INSTALLS!
Lerianis 9th Apr 2009
I swear..... Microsoft, stop playing your damned games, or I'm going to stop beta testing your software and telling you about the problems I have with your beta OS's.

There is NO reason why Windows 7 RC should require a clean install or an install from Vista. Just allow us to install it over an old beta build using the 'upgrade' option!
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Update better than Clean Install!
Loverrock Davidson 11th Apr 2009
A CI wipes out any diveritfied cross ligerated di-nomial
qualifiers which are the backbone of a good Vista install!
Steve told me:

http://fakesteveballmer.blogspot.com
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Almost missed this one!
Loverock Davidson 12th Apr 2009
Phew, glad I caught it so I can brag about how much people want to be me. happy
I did a install on a later build with no problems,except install took over 2 hours instead of 25 minutes for a clean.
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Is this really an issue?
TurboFool 13th Apr 2009
Who out there is savvy enough to install a beta OS, and doesn't already make it a matter of standard practice to clean-install their OSes? Only upgrade of an OS I've done in the last ten years was performing an upgrade install to get from Vista Home Premium to Ultimate on my notebook because I couldn't get the Ultimate install disc not to see the stupid built-in Home Premium key Dell stuck in the BIOS somewhere. Otherwise, like most people who know what they're doing, I install clean so I have the best-functioning OS I can. I always keep my data separate, and even when I don't (I actually installed 7 onto my data drive because I thought I'd rarely use it which turned out not to be true), I keep it all nicely separated to make transferring it to my external drive before a format much easier.

This is only a problem because MS made this beta so widely available to average users, and those average users ignored the warnings about the OS and started getting comfortable in it. I'm comfy, too, but I always had my usual contingency plans in place for when it was time to wipe it.
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Not hard at all. Being Beta all you do, is uninstall programs which have required Product Activation, for example, Paperport 11.2 Professional, but don't look for Paperport 11.2 Professional to give back a Product Activation, because it is broken.
After all have been uninstalled, reformat and install Windows 7 Ultimate RC Version.

Very simple, then reinstall the programs. Such is the life of the Beta Tester.
If you don't want to do a clean install, leave the beta testing to us "geeks". A clean install is painless for us.

I wouldn't think of upgrading to a new OS any other way. I know that it is going to save me a lot of problems down the road.

I do have one question. Where are people getting the idea that they are going to have to purchase a copy of Vista in order to upgrade to Windows 7? You couldn't upgrade Windows 2000 to Vista and no one had to buy a copy of XP in order to get to Vista. If you are running XP, you will be able to upgrade to Windows 7, but you will have to do a clean install.

Anyone complaining about doing a clean install has no business beta testing anything.
I always go for a wipe and clean install all the time. Just the way I was taught!
where can the beta be found?
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I'm getting the message "This copy of Windows is not genuine" on the screen, under "Windows 7 Evaluation copy. Build 7100.
I called Microsoft and got to a genuine advantage tech, who apologized and said they have no way of removing the message.
Also, when the popup led me through the hoops and I tried to re-enter my key, the message said validation not currently supported for Windows 7.
Any comments?
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So I burnt the dvd poped it in my Vista Ultimate machine got a really nice Windows 7 wallpaper click about two times it checked if I was compatible and I was but it had to disable Vista ultimate download content. Which it did by it self after a restart. There was also a little thing with my ATI Catalyst where it recommended me to uninstall it before setup and reinstall it once in Windows 7 (which I did and got the windows 7 version). Go through the setup process again click bout two times selected Upgrade and that was it only asked me to verify time and input serial number. Easiest windows install or update EVER in my opinion and Ive installed many times. Afterwards in Windows 7 all my software works settings are the same just had to reinstall the ATI catalyst and done same system different windows. The only thing ive noticed no to work is the AMD BOOST feature from the AMD Fusion for Gaming app (the app crashes) i would recommend people try that app out if you own amd ati gear. But apart from that im really impressed with the upgrade no fuss and it was only about 1 restart or 2 and all done in windows environment.

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