ie8 fix
madison

Why are black levels changing for the worse on Panasonic's plasma HDTVs?

By | February 9, 2010, 5:41pm PST

Summary: [UPDATE: CNET has again heard back from Panasonic, and if you're impacted by the lightening black levels, don't expect a fix. The company has deemed this adjustment to be a typical response to the set reaching a certain stage of its lifespan. As a result of this response, CNET's David Katzmaier says to avoid 2009 [...]

[UPDATE: CNET has again heard back from Panasonic, and if you're impacted by the lightening black levels, don't expect a fix. The company has deemed this adjustment to be a typical response to the set reaching a certain stage of its lifespan. As a result of this response, CNET's David Katzmaier says to avoid 2009 Panasonic plasmas and look to alternatives from Samsung instead. ]

It’s nowhere near the public relations nightmare (or threat to safety) that Toyota is enduring with its recall of thousands of cars, but another Japanese company is dealing with a threat to its reputation for high performance. In this case, Panasonic is enduring charges that the black levels of its top-rated plasma HDTVs change for the worse over time. Considering that deep black levels are a big reason that the company’s plasmas are seen as best in class, it’s an issue that Panasonic should want to quickly dispatch.

However, the electronics giant took its time responding to an inquiry from our sister site CNET’s top TV reviewer, David Katzmaier, about the allegations that came from the well-respected and well-trafficked AVS Forums. The reply did provide an explanation for the lighter black levels—an automatic voltage adjustment by the offending sets over time has been set too aggressively—and added that newer models have an improved automatic control that tweaks the settings in lesser amounts.

But as Katzmaier points out, Panasonic doesn’t list which new plasmas sport the improved control, and doesn’t say if and when a fix will be available for consumers with sets that have been negatively impacted. The longer this issue festers, the better plasma competitors like Samsung and LG begin to look, so Panasonic really should lay out a plan that addresses how its disappointed buyers can be assuaged—and soon. Let us know in the TalkBack section if your Panasonic plasma has been affected by changing black levels.

Kick off your day with ZDNet's daily e-mail newsletter. It's the freshest tech news and opinion, served hot. Get it.

Topics

Sean Portnoy is a freelance technology journalist.

Disclosure

Sean Portnoy

Sean Portnoy is a freelance technology journalist; currently, all work that Sean does is on a contractural basis. Sean has also written corporate communications documents for CA.

Sean does not accept gifts from companies he covers. All hardware products he writes about are purchased with his own funds or are review units covered under formal loan agreements and are returned after the review is complete.

Biography

Sean Portnoy

Sean Portnoy started his tech writing career at ZDNet nearly a decade ago. He then spent several years as an editor at Computer Shopper magazine, most recently serving as online executive editor. He received a B.A. from Brown University and an M.A. from the University of Southern California.

Related Discussions on TechRepublic

Did you know you can take part in these discussions with your ZDNet membership?
20
Comments

Join the conversation!

Just In

Pride and Prejudice ?
bervick@... Updated - 2nd Mar 2010
CHRISTOPHER

Please allow for 10 days to receive your check.

Panasonic PR Dept
-----
As you can see, this can be seen both ways. You
have 2 plasmas. Oh good for you. And what
generations are they ? How many hrs have lapsed
? What is their MLL now.

How to (use google in a sentence - copy/paste
the entire url) :
http://www.google.com/search?
hl=en&source=hp&q=panasonic+black+levels+rising
&aq=0&aqi=g1&aql=&oq=Panasonic+black+levels

This pretty much sums it up

CHECK IT OUT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xE3Mp89xHOg


NO OTHER BRAND of plasma does this in such a
short amt of time and by that much. ON top of
the line models no less !!!
0 Votes
+ -
Am facing this too
alokgovil Updated - 9th Feb 2010
I think I am also facing this issue on my Panasonic. Black is not as black and I could not think of why this would be for plasma TV other than the driver circuit applying wrong voltages to get to black.

The black I get there is no way close to the high contrast ratio numbers they cite in the specifications, even in completely dark room.

I am pissed off. Panasonic, you need to fix this and deliver update to all models having this issue.
According to AVSForum Member D-Nice, this is a firmware problem that could be corrected.
This has owners livid.
Owners feel they have been sold panels that start out great, but within 6 months significantly degrade. These panels were marketed with ridiculous contrast ratings of 50,000:1.
If you read Panasonic statement carefully, it suggests that the rise in black levels is much more gradual, which means the new panels will be broken too. That should help sales. wink
- Rich
0 Votes
+ -
HINT: Plasma
wackoae 9th Feb 2010
Guess what, Plasma TV don't last ... Panasonic may claim something different, but the facts are very well known.

Another thing they don't tell you .... never buy a Plasma if you live above 6000 ft. Just ask people who live around the Denver area ......
0 Votes
+ -
Your info is 5-6 years out of date
bobstaggers 10th Feb 2010
Your info is 5-6 years out of date. Most plasmas are now rated to 9500 ft. I've had three at above 6000 ft for 8 plus years and no issues. Expected life span of plasmas now may equal or exceed most LCDs....and burn-in is no longer an issue. Plasmas also do not have the "judder" issue that ALL LCDs have, have better contrast, and better off angle viewing. Downside though is they use glass screens rather than plastic like LCDs so do reflect more light than LCDs. However the glass screen is much more impact resistant than an LCD screen.
0 Votes
+ -
I'll second that
gigabot71 25th Feb 2010
I live near Denver and have a plasma with no problems whatsoever.
Unfortunately, it is a Panasonic plasma, so I'll need to have a good look
at it to make sure there are no black level changes.
I have a 50" panasonic for over 7 years and 2-42" for over one year and never had problem. The poerson who started this problem may have changed the setting fro dark to light. this will change the black levels. Even if a set did change a bit from factory spec., these plasmas still outperform all LCD's on the market today. LCD tv;'s cna never come close the black levels of these plasmas. In addition, LCD tv;'s continue to suufer from poor off angel viewing, motion blur (even at 240 hz) and do not last as long as plasma sets.
0 Votes
+ -
are you bonkers?
nanotm 10th Feb 2010
tft's last for 10 years + no worries while the average plasma needs recharging in 4 years

the contrast and response times on plasma's is good for short period of time but it has to get reduced fairly fast or the set dies to early fyi a 50k>1 contrast ratio has to be stepped down in 1k intervals for every 10 hours of use or that 10,000 hours tv is going to last 100 hours once they drop the ratio down to around 20k>1 it should just about make it to the vaunted 10,000 hours.

lcd or tft screens are superior in every way to plasma the off angle blure you speak of is worse on plasma given that you need to be about 2ft away from the screen and at that distance a plasma screen is all lines.

motion blur only happens in cheap sets and affects both the low end plasma's and the bottom of the bin lcd's (anything over 16ms response time is going to have blur problems)

if you bothered to look around at decent lcd sets in the last 10 years you would know that the problem of viewing angle /distance was all down to the missmatch of the glass in front of the liquid crystal panel not to mention the incorrect focal distance hence why so many cheap as chips screens look so poor, if your going to trash talk a product at least get your facts straight.
0 Votes
+ -
You ARE bonkers!
bobstaggers 10th Feb 2010
Where on earth did you get the idea plasma TVs need recharging? There is no such thing. My oldest plasma is 10 years old and still working fine, never had to have it "recharged". BTW life expectancy of most modern LCDs AND plasmas is now 20+ years.

ALL, I say again, ALL LCDs suffer from judder (you called it motion blur) which is when an object moves too fast for the transistors that open and close for the pixels cannot keep up with the motion. There is no cure for this, it is inherent in the LCD design. Attempts to alleviate the effect by increasing screen refresh rates (120MHz and 240MHz) help but can never completely fix the design. Many people never see the judder, others see immediately.

Off angle viewing is still better on plasmas, primarily because of the use of a glass screen vice plastic. Also, have you noticed many LCD manufacturers are now using "shiny" screens similar to glass? Reason is the anti-reflective coating on plastic screens mutes color transmission.

Most modern LCDs and plasmas are excellent TVs with their own inherent issues. I simply prefer plasmas because I watch a lot of sports and play online gaming (my PS3 is connected to a 60" Pioneer Elite plasma).

Not sure your "facts" are any better then the guy you flamed for his.
0 Votes
+ -
You missed one!
bigpicture 10th Feb 2010
I have a 58" Pan plasma, and it also doubles as a room
heater. But the Hi Def sports pictures are clear.
0 Votes
+ -
um
nanotm 11th Feb 2010
Where on earth did you get the idea plasma TVs need recharging?

from having had a plasma screen at work for a long time and it needing to have the argon swapped 3 times then again it being a comercial product perhaps it was made different to the home standard panels.

then again lcd might not give the perfect clarity above 32inch screen size (since response time drops dramatically on screens over 32inch) but it wont suffer from colour fade unlike the plasma (which panasonic has clearly tried to control the rate of decay with the mentioned technique) the older sets wernt sealed pixels either they were simply layers of substrate sandwitched together with a membrane of gas injected between them at least with the generation 1 and comercial sets you could replace the gas and give your set another 10k hours of life.

still for my money lcd is a better tech since it has been around longer and the newest versions are boasting an average of 8ms responce time for sets up to 60inch so the blur effect wont be there. not to mention it cost less than half to run an lcd tv for a same size plasma, add that to the latest "mirror finish" screens being used and you have a 160 degree no loss viewing angle so its the same as if not better than plasma which is basically just a revamp of the old crt tech just a lot more pricy.

besides all that plasma screens are like the iphone and the ipad and the ipod, there a gimick for those with too much money and inferior to other cheaper products on the market although that is perhaps a whole other kettle of fish.
0 Votes
+ -
Recharging?
DT2 Updated - 11th Feb 2010
There is no "recharging" of a plasma screen. If some tech has done and charged you money for this service I would take them to the BBB or call your attourney. If you don't believe me, check here:

http://www.plasmatvbuyingguide.com/plasmatvreviews/plasmatvpixel.html

http://www.plasmadisplaycoalition.org/satisfaction/recharging.php

I have two 50" Pan plasmas, one for over six years and they both still look great.
0 Votes
+ -
quit spreading false information...
focusandconcentrate@... 11th Feb 2010
to propogate your lcd fanboyism. it's persons like you that ruin the internet.
I have been selling plasma's and lcd's for eight years.
The latest lcd's with led backlights are superior in every way. Less power, better white and blacks and there colour palette does not change with time.
0 Votes
+ -
Is a fact !
Gradius2 10th Feb 2010
There will be NO fix at all for those TVs, the costs is way too high.
I'm under the impression that upcoming power consumption requirements will force Plasma TV off the market... so any long, slow, expensive engineering change is money down a rat-hole. (As far as Panasonic is concerned, even though that's certainly NOT the case for all of us existing customers.)

Am I wrong about this?

BTW, I own both an older Panny Plasma and a recent Sharp LCD, I'm asking a question and not just posting to sneer about the one technology versus the other. Thanks in advance....
0 Votes
+ -
well sort of
nanotm 11th Feb 2010
there has been a motion tabled as part of the climate change initiative to get plasma's hiked in price &/or manufacturing ceased as to wheather it will happen is anyones guess, although given half the politicians have jumped on the bandwagon expect a lot of stupid regulations like this to get put in place.

gotta love that lcd's cost less to make less to run and the same to purchase though.

just kinda hoping that befor the fuel gets too overpriced for the average person to fill up on a tank of petrol that they actually sell viable electric cars and not the overpriced and handicapped ones that are currently available.
0 Votes
+ -
have you seen the avg power consumption...
focusandconcentrate@... 11th Feb 2010
for 2010 plasmas? they're near lcd levels, but not quite. and i was quite surprised at how cool plasmas were runnning for '09 models, so i expect even "cooler" plasmas for '10 model year. don't listen to that ding dong, nanotm. he is spreading so much false information, it's not even funny.
I just watched starttrek. the big moment when nero's
practically all black ship pans across the screen this
issue is sooo apparent.
It is just a muddy brown green. No definition. It really
does look bad.
I am no HDTV expert. This started 2 weeks ago. I also
get lots of afterglow from menus, tickertapes and such.
very sad. I spent alot on this v10 . i bought this solely
on the blacks.
0 Votes
+ -
Pride and Prejudice ?
bervick@... Updated - 2nd Mar 2010
CHRISTOPHER

Please allow for 10 days to receive your check.

Panasonic PR Dept
-----
As you can see, this can be seen both ways. You
have 2 plasmas. Oh good for you. And what
generations are they ? How many hrs have lapsed
? What is their MLL now.

How to (use google in a sentence - copy/paste
the entire url) :
http://www.google.com/search?
hl=en&source=hp&q=panasonic+black+levels+rising
&aq=0&aqi=g1&aql=&oq=Panasonic+black+levels

This pretty much sums it up

CHECK IT OUT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xE3Mp89xHOg


NO OTHER BRAND of plasma does this in such a
short amt of time and by that much. ON top of
the line models no less !!!

Join the conversation!

Formatting +
BB Codes - Note: HTML is not supported in forums
  • [b] Bold [/b]
  • [i] Italic [/i]
  • [u] Underline [/u]
  • [s] Strikethrough [/s]
  • [q] "Quote" [/q]
  • [ol][*] 1. Ordered List [/ol]
  • [ul][*] · Unordered List [/ul]
  • [pre] Preformat [/pre]
  • [quote] "Blockquote" [/quote]
ie8 fix
Click Here
ie8 fix

The best of ZDNet, delivered

ZDNet Newsletters

Get the best of ZDNet delivered straight to your inbox

Facebook Activity

White Papers, Webcasts, & Resources
ie8 fix
ie8 fix