ie8 fix

Microsoft: Here are some of the Win 7 changes coming in the next build

By | February 26, 2009, 6:25am PST

Summary: Windows 7 testers wanted more feedback from Microsoft. It looks like they’re getting it. In a February 26 post to the Engineering Windows 7 blog, Microsoft itemized some of the changes that it is making to Windows 7 that will be part of the Release Candidate (RC) test build.

Windows 7 testers wanted more feedback from Microsoft. It looks like they’re getting it.

In a February 26 post to the Engineering Windows 7 blog, Microsoft itemized some of the changes that it is making to Windows 7 that will be part of the Release Candidate (RC) test build that is widely expected in April.

From the blog post introduction by Windows chief Steven Sinofsky:

“(W)e want to start posting on the feedback and the engineering actions we’ve taken in responding to the feedback.  We won’t be able to cover all the changes (as we’re still busy making them), but for today we wanted to start with a sampling of some of the more visible changes.”

The post goes on to detail some of the Windows 7 changes Microsoft is making in response to tester feedback — in the task bar, Media Player, networking, touch, the Windows Explorer and overall performance.  Given that Windows 7 was deemed “feature-complete” as of the public beta that Microsoft released in January, the changes coming between then and the Release Candidate are largely cosmetic. (At least it seems that way to me….)

A number of Windows 7 testers have complained recently that Microsoft was not sharing enough information about changes it planned to make in response to their feedback.

Windows SuperSite’s Paul Thurrott questioned in a post yesterday whether Microsoft had already locked down Windows 7’s feature set before the majority of technical and public beta testers ever got to see a first release of the product. I’ve wondered the same.

It’s great Microsoft is starting to share feedback with the thousands, if not millions, of testers who take their time to help the company find and fix bugs and usability problems. But Thurrott’s question is still a good one.

Windows 7 testers: Is this feedback that Microsoft is providing enough? Any other specific features/areas you’d like to see addressed in the future?

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Topics

Mary Jo has covered the tech industry for more than 25 years for a variety of publications and Web sites, and is a frequent guest on radio, TV and podcasts, speaking about all things Microsoft-related. She is the author of Microsoft 2.0: How Microsoft plans to stay relevant in the post-Gates era (John Wiley & Sons, 2008).

Disclosure

Mary-Jo Foley

Freelance journalist/blogger Mary Jo Foley has nothing to disclose. WYSIWYG (what you see is what you get). I do not own Microsoft stock or stock in any of its partners or competitors. I have no business ventures that are sponsored by/funded by Microsoft or any of its partners or competitors.

Biography

Mary-Jo Foley

Mary Jo Foley has covered the tech industry for 25 years for a variety of publications, including ZDNet, eWeek and Baseline. She has kept close tabs on Microsoft strategy, products and technologies for the past 10 years. In the late 1990s, she penned the award-winning "At The Evil Empire" column for ZDNet, and more recently the Microsoft Watch blog for Ziff Davis.

Got a tip? Send her an email with your rants, rumors, tips and tattles. Confidentiality guaranteed.

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RE: Microsoft: Here are some of the Win 7 changes coming in the next build
dfwekrdfe63-24353627165909230341806269401020 11th Nov
dsddpl,good post!
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Cosmetic
imhassan 26th Feb 2009
All these changes are cosmetic but still
welcome as they improve usability in one way or
the other.
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Of course they are
MissingMatter 26th Feb 2009
Since the first paragraph states:

"We won?t be able to cover all the changes (as we?re still busy making them), but for today we wanted to start with a sampling of some of the more visible changes."
I'd like to see the star button "orb" redesigned. It sticks out like a sore thumb on the new superbar...
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use small icons
tech_walker 27th Feb 2009
reduces the orb and the whole toolbar mess.
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What have you done....???
Nsaf 26th Feb 2009
We will always find something to complain about...this is cosmetic, this is like a sore thumb..this is too big, icons are too small...this and that..what the hell have you done to make life easier for others?
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I've granted everyone on the planet 3 wishes.
No More Microsoft Software Ever! Updated - 26th Feb 2009
I just haven't told them how to use them yet. That's patented and needs a signed NDA.
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NT
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Who are you asking?
ShadowGIATL 26th Feb 2009
Sounds to me like there is no point in trying to please you anyway.
As much a s cosmetic revisions are all fine and dandy
I would like to see usability take a front seat.
I would like to see usability in little shops like
mine to be able to utilize this OS as a tool.
I would like to see this OS become the new "XP"
in the terms of usability.
other than that I am starting to like the OS as a
whole.

UNHOLYTECH
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WTF?
Zach S 2nd Mar 2009
XP is waaay less usable than Vista or Win7. I need my search function when I click Start. I like the show desktop feature in Win7, organizing buttons, what else?
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Unbelievable innovation here...
Mike Cox 26th Feb 2009
My rep gave me a preview of these changes at a personal Q&A session at the Redmond campus. Once I saw the new Needy Window feature my draw just dropped. I broke out in a cold sweat and needed a Cola to maintain by blood sugar. I was not sure I could handle the other changes but managed to get through it. My rep then gave me a DVD with these new bits and told me "go forth and deploy". I then told my MCSEs to cancel their weekend plans, this new beta MUST BE DEPLOYED NOW. My rep and I then went for a glass of fine cognac.
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Troll...nothing to see here
Martin_Australia 26th Feb 2009
Wow, you really need to get a life dude....
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My rep and I
Cylon Centurion 26th Feb 2009
His repeated use of the words "My rep and I" make me think this guy is no older than 15 and has not had a higher level english class.

My rep and I both agree that he should stop doing this. My rep then said he should pay attention in his classes. My rep and I then laughed and then toasted Windows over some wine where we then rode off into the sunset and lived happily ever after. happy
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Sucker...nt
TheBottomLineIsAllThatMatters 27th Feb 2009
nt
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Give me a second chance
clarnT 26th Feb 2009
after I accidently hit the "Shut Down" button to stop the
process. I know I shouldn't be so butter-fingers but it
happens, and once you hit the button, there she goes. And I
know my clients will be even worse about it.

Yeah, it's bothersome when you hit a button and a pop-up
shows itself asking if you "really wanted to do that," but it
sure beats having to wait those few minutes to get back to
work after an inadvertent click.
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A better implementation...
dcoaster Updated - 26th Feb 2009
That is a really good point. In fact it just happened to me yesterday and was really frustrating! It would be great if they could come out with a shutdown mechanism like the unlock mechanism for the iPhone or now, Windows Mobile. Drag the shutdown icon to a part on the screen to shut down or drag it back to its position to cancel your decision to shut it down.

Just an idea.
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Classic Start Menu
ericvhunter@... 26th Feb 2009
Now that would be nice as well. Sorry, I have changed XPs, Vistas, to Classic options. Just a thought.
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What is it with the classic start menu?
MissingMatter Updated - 27th Feb 2009
Seriously, why are people so adamant about wanting that back?

The new start menu has all the same elements: recently used applications, links to common folders, and a list of all installed programs.

The new menu goes further in adding a search function that lets you instantly find anything on your computer. How is that a step backwards?

Is it that you prefer flyout menus? Because that was a terrible idea, especially when browsing multiple levels deep.

Is it that you miss the run option? Because that can be added easily, and the search function pretty much replaces it anyway.

Seriously, what is it that you miss so much about the old start menu?
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Yes
rcfoulk@... 27th Feb 2009
Many want the classic start menu and the older, much more useful explorer interface. It's not a matter of being stuck in the mud or unwilling to change. The simple fact of the matter is that many folks intuitively get a hierarchical approach to searching or recursing. To us the so-called "improved" approach represents the result of human factors consultants on bad drugs. It's much like arranging your desk. Each has their preference which is no less or more valid than anybody else?s. To have an organizational model taken away by Microsoft's paternalistic and frankly arrogant notion that they have a better idea is not okay. And all this is aside from the larger truth that with respect to highly locked down business desktops all this fluff is irrelevant anyway. Windows 7 is shaping up to be nothing other that a refurbished Vista and will, as did Vista, fail to meet the benefit vs. cost calculus that will make many businesses upgrade, particularly in this economy. Frankly cosmetics on the desktop are of little value. Security has been otherwise taken care of by software and appliances and the other so-call benefits are marginal with respect to total upgrade costs.

Newer is not out of hand better and Microsoft would be well advised to think long and hard about the overriding preference for XP over these newer products. There?s a message there.
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Classic should be an option
boed 27th Feb 2009
What is it with zealots who say no classic? We are just asking for an OPTION to have it - feel free to make the new start the default - but classic for me is significantly more efficient. I use about 20 apps daily - I have them organized for optimal access with the classic menu. I'm not denying your right to the new menu - why are you pissing on my corn flakes?
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Well for starters
ericvhunter@... 2nd Mar 2009
I like a lot of my things on my desktop as small as possible. The new menu (Hell even the "new" XP" Start Menu) Was to me just like a bunch of stuff thrown together and to me was very clunky. The Classic 9x Start Menu was very small and worked very well. Also I think having to type run in a SEARCH box is not even a viable option. Its search. Its should not be for launching applications.
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Why limit yourself to searching for docs?
de-void-21165590650301806002836337787023 2nd Mar 2009
In Vista and Win7, the search box in the start menu can help you find whatever you're looking for - be it a doc, photo, song, application, control-panel applet, etc.

In Win7, hit start and type "printer" - you'll see a number of handy printer related tasks pop up including "add printer", "share printer", "find and fix printer issues", etc. This is MUCH more discoverable than having to navigate several start menu folders, control panel, device manager, printers folder, etc.
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I don't know
Khyron 2nd Mar 2009
But ALOT of people prefer the classic menu style to the new one and I submitted that request when I was done with my beta testing. Most people feel less is more, they don't like all the search bars and dynamic menus. too confusing. Just give them a list of installed applications. Keep it simple.

Personally, I use the default XP/Vista menu system. The 95-2000 classic menu is retro imho.
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YOu can always change what the button does.
Cylon Centurion 26th Feb 2009
Go to Taskbar properties and you will find that you can select different choices.
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Am I missing something or has the preloaded e-mail app (outlook express, Windows Mail) been removed from the OS in Windows 7?


I didn't notice it at first since I use Thunderbird. I automatically installed Thunderbird but upon checking everything out I don't believe I saw one of these....
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It has been removed
MissingMatter 27th Feb 2009
The removed windows mail as well as photo gallery calendar, and movie maker and put them in the live suite of applications. You can download them free.
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The EU is trying t0 separate the browser from the Windows OS. I wonder if the lack of e-mail client and the other apps you mention is an attempt to placate the EU to stop the lawsuits....
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Perhaps.
de-void-21165590650301806002836337787023 2nd Mar 2009
But it also makes servicing the OS much easier too.

IM/Email clients are evolving at a surprising rates. Vista suffered from the issue that by the time it had shipped, Windows Mail had been superseded by Live Mail. So many Vista users were frustrated to not be able to sign into their hotmail account using Windows Mail. MS were not permitted to remove functionality in a service pack to had to leave Windows Mail there whilst trying to encourage people to download and install Live Mail.

All in all, it was a mess.

I am delighted MS have removed Windows Mail. Now I can choose which mail client I use.
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It's handled by Windows Live Services
tech_walker 27th Feb 2009
And since you use Thunderbird you don't need it. Wish vlite would let me get rid of it in Vista.
I think people have just gotten too darned lazy to use the brain that was given to them to learn something new. What a shame that people allow themselves to get stuck in a rut. How boring. Get with it people, change is good. And, stop looking at only what's on top, it's what's inside that counts.
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Wow there's a lot of updates.
Narg 27th Feb 2009
Go to the site Mary gave showing all the changes. There are a LOT. And they all seem to be customer/tester directed. Microsoft is listening, and it shows.
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I haven't been happy with Windows since...
GrizzledGeezer 27th Feb 2009
...the introduction of XP. Microsoft has increasingly been "hiding" both the hardware and the operating system, to the point where you feel you've lost control of the computer.

Things that used to be simple -- such as searching for a document -- are now complex and confusing.
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searching for a document confusing?
tech_walker 27th Feb 2009
In XP it sucked, Vista is great for searching documents.
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Searching is NOT hard!
de-void-21165590650301806002836337787023 27th Feb 2009
Hit start type name of app/doc you want to launch. Select appropriate app/file.

Open Explorer. Want to find doc you worked on a couple of weeks ago? Type into search box:
after:2/1/2009

See here for more search syntax hints:
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/winfamily/desktopsearch/technicalresources/advquery.mspx

Searching doesn't get much more powerful than this happy
Will the RC build be a public release as was the beta?

I am chomping at the bit and don't want to wait until April either!
Massively disappointing . Two really important features that have been acknowledged as having some traction in Redmond Magazine is the restoration of the classic start bar menu and a repair/restore choice similar to what is in XP on the W7 DVD. I cannot stress how important that classic start bar is to most people hanging onto XP. Microsoft by refusing to accept that it is liked and very much still wanted by a very large % of people dismiss them as irrelevant and being of no value. I think W7 should be about giving people choice not about forcing people to do old tasks in new ways.I cannot help but feel Microsoft in totally ignoring and not even commenting on this feedback is doing everything in its power to really aggravate , frustrate and upset XP users so I really do not know how they expect W7 to float with any better results than VISTA. W7 shows promise so why work so hard to get us upset. It seems such a small consideration to let us arrange and organise a task bar the way we want it to work. The pin/unpin option has issues . I discovered that if I installed Office 2003 then upgraded to Office 2007 the taskbar had residual icons from O2003 left that could not be removed by unpinning. Therefore you need a delete option and its not there. I like to have all my internet programs displayed on the task bar under a heading of Internet Programs for example. I am unable to do this in W7 but can do it in VISTA although it is clumsy. Having backup and system restore options is not foolproof. What if the build FAILS to load . In XP one could stick in the original CD/DVD and boot to get a repair/restore option .. not so in W7 so builds are going to fail,end users will lose data and there will be no way to resurrect this. Giving IT Pros tools is fine , most ordinary users don't backup and do not understand images etc so that repair/restore option is important.

Again after playing with W7 its all just cosmetic , its faster than VISTA but not faster than Xp and has nothing in it that is compelling in a real sense. It will only appeal to those wanting to keep up with the Jones.

Ken

IT Director
Melbourne
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Living in the past
techwiz2000@... 27th Feb 2009
Wow Ken, How can you be an IT director and like to live in the past?

The new windows taskbar is far superior to the classic. I do agree that it will take some getting used to for a novice user (just like the new ribbon menus in Office 07) but once the user gets comfortable with the new interface productivity will increase.

I will not got back to the previous versions of office simply because I love the new ribbon menu format. Just as I love the new taskbar in Win7.

"Stay Current, Learn the new technology"

techwiz2000
http://hooahtech.blogspot.com/
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To the novice user...
Dave32265 27th Feb 2009
it's more about familiarity than anything. They just want to turn their machines on, do what they need to do and thats it. As I have been told by many windows clients of mine, "I don't want to learn something new", and quite frankly they don't have the patience with change either. I can't tell you how many clients rebelled against vista for this very reason and stuck with XP. I think it would definitely be a step in the right direction to have the "classic" option.
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Let's be honest here ...
de-void-21165590650301806002836337787023 27th Feb 2009
... no PC user is going to be be so confused by the Vista/Win7 start menu that they're going to be unable to find their apps, control panel, most frequently used programs, all (properly) installed apps on their system, etc.

Sure, the new Start Menu is a change from XP, but heck, show me any other software that has remained completely unchanged in 9 years.

There will be a small learning blip for the first 24 hours, after which, most user's behavior patterns will have begun to readjust.

As an example, my 10 year old daughter got her own laptop last summer. She'd used an old XP laptop of mine for several years to play her games on.

Her new laptop ran Vista. She didn't even ask me how she would go find her games and get start them - she just found them.

A few weeks ago, I put Win7 beta on there and, again, she didn't ask me where or how to find her games.

Interestingly, she DID say that she loved the new task-bar preview & peek - she uses that a lot to find the window she's expecting to see when she's playing a game while IM'ing her grandparents etc.
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Your experiences...
Dave32265 Updated - 27th Feb 2009
are different than mine I guess. I can only go by what I hear from my clients and friends. Most of my windows clients, however, are middle aged and older and I have seen the resistance to change time and time again. The younger crowd is somewhat more open to it. Maybe it is a generational thing? Who knows. People like what they like and I cater to their wants and needs. Still it would be great if the option were there for the "classic" look just for the familiarity factor.
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So if they resist change, why are you trying to make them change? If they like XP, leave them on XP (just make sure they have all the latest patches).

Nobody's twisting their arm and FORCING them to change to Vista or Windows 7.

You make it sound like Microsoft sent an armed assault squad and made you put Vista on their systems at gunpoint.

It's all about choice Dave. They have a choice, remain on XP and keep what they know and like, or move to Vista or Windows 7 and experience something new. Or maybe even take the big jump and switch to one of the Linux distros. Visit a whole new world.

A friend of mine had turned on Classic menus in Vista because that's what she knew from XP. Then I showed her the power of the new Vista Start menu search and how easy it is to use.

Now she loves it the new Start menu format. And she's in her 50s, so it's not a generational thing. She still has a lot to learn, but she's getting there, simply because I said "here, let me show you how it works...".

It seems that the smallest bit of education can override fear of change.

Which makes me wonder, maybe your not doing enough for your clients in the form of education?
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Obviously you...
Dave32265 Updated - 27th Feb 2009
seem to like conflict. Either that or you just enjoy the sound of your keys as you type. Where in my previous post did I even hint at arm twisting anyone? All i said was they made their CHOICE to stick with XP because they didn't like the way vista looked or acted and didn't want to learn a different GUI. Please reread my post. Also I stated "I cater to their wants and needs". Again, their CHOICE!

In fact I do educate my clients as to alternatives as I am a big advocate of Linux. Also if you (again) read my posts, I specifically state "windows clients". Why you ask? Because I have educated quite a few to the freedom of Linux and it's usability (for the most part).

Rant all you like as I did not post one derogatory word about MS or windows. My customers use it and are happy with it. I am simply making the case for the option in Win 7 for a "classic" look to it.
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Fear...
Wolfie2K3 27th Feb 2009
Sheesh. I'm 45 years old. It took me all of maybe 10 minutes to adjust to the new menu structure and taskbar.

The difference - I went into the experience with an open mind.

Waaay back in the day, Windows used to ship with this thing called Program Manager (3.x). When Win 95 came along, it shipped with Program Manager as well as the then new taskbar. I played around with setting Win 95 up with Program Manager for a bit. I wanted that old familiar interface. But I soon discovered that the new interface was better - and I dropped Program Manager and went with the new interface.

The simple fact is, Windows stopped shipping with Program Manager with Win 95.

For what it's worth, the new Start menu in Windows 7 isn't THAT much different from the "classic" menu. It's still located in the same place. You can still find your programs on it. The thing is, it's more efficent.

Type in "Word" and all programs that match pop up - MS Word, WordPad, WordPerfect, etc...

Type in "Paint" - and MS Paint or PaintShop Pro pops up along with any other apps that have the word Paint in the title.

Type in "Spreadsheet" and any and all spreadsheet apps pop up - including MS Excel.

The point is, just because the old way is familiar, doesn't make it better. It just makes it familiar.

There's nothing to be afraid of. The new start menu doesn't take THAT much effort learn. Once you get the hang of it, you'll probably wonder why Microsoft didn't think of doing it this way 15 odd years ago.
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"There's nothing to be afraid of."
Dave32265 27th Feb 2009
Not saying there is. Personally, I like change. If I didn't, I'd be in the wrong business. I just go by what my clients want. If they are thinking of upgrading then I show them exactly what that next step is. Most, and again this is what they are telling me in conversations about their needs, don't want different. As I said, it seems to me to be more of a familiarity or comfort factor than anything. All I'm saying is, it would be a great idea to have the "classic" look available to those who want it.
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@Dave: Not just the young
de-void-21165590650301806002836337787023 2nd Mar 2009
Since moving from the UK to the US, my family back in the UK has seen the value of getting online. Finally, they see the value of a computer and the internet - it's not just for geeks any more.

In the last 3 years, my mother (64), father (68), mother-in-law (65), father-in-law (61) and my grandfather 85) have all got online. All started with XP (that's what was installed when they bought their machines). All have moved to Vista. My Grandfather and Father-in-law are both eager to try Win7. When they arrive for a visit in 6 weeks time, I know my Father-in-law will be bugging me to upgrade him to Win7 within hours of touching down.

Never once have I heard them, nor anyone I know, complain that they miss XP's start menu.

I agree that some are very definitely set in their ways and are highly resistant to change. However, I think that this whole thing about the start menu is an overhyped issue bemoaned by the vocal minority.
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I'm just going by...
Dave32265 2nd Mar 2009
what my windows clients tell me. In other areas this may or may not be the case. My younger clients tend to embrace change much better. Maybe that's a unique situation in my area, I really don't know. I just think the option for the "classic" look should be an option for those that want it. Not saying it should be forced on anyone, by any stretch of the imagination.
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Living in the past
aussieblnd@... 27th Feb 2009
Wow Techwiz (that's a questionable title). As an IT Director he must also be concerned about the users on the system. From the sound of it you have no clue just how many really stupid people can be and are end users in a corporate environment. And about 80% the time it also includes your company CEO.
I use Verizon Broadband, and am pretty much crippled in using Windows 7. I forgot how long it takes to download at 56K, and Win 7 wont use the Broadband Modem. Works fine in Vista, but 7 says it is a non-supported OS. Even if I liked Win7, and I might if I were able to use it, I have no clue. Because I don't like to be tied up for hours downloading the changes and updates at 56K.
Upgrades that leave some users behind, are pretty poor business. I'm kind of leaning toward dumping Microsoft, and go for Linus Umbuntu.
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Driver issue
techwiz2000@... 27th Feb 2009
That's just a driver issue altacom. Simply try using the CD that cam with your modem and use the drivers on it. Win7 is pretty good at using XP drivers.

I setup a few myself for some of my hardware.

techwiz2000
hooahtech.blogspot.com
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RE: Microsoft: Here are some of the Win 7 changes coming in the next build
dfwekrdfe63-24353627165909230341806269401020 11th Nov
dsddpl,good post!

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