ie8 fix

Windows 8 to showcase 'desktop as a service'?

By | November 16, 2010, 7:41am PST

Summary: Since April, it’s been quiet on the Windows 8 leak front. But here’s a new tidbit to keep the “what’s next for Windows” faithful going for a bit longer.

Since April, it’s been quiet on the Windows 8 leak front. But here’s a new tidbit to keep the “what’s next for Windows” faithful going for a bit longer.

Blogger Charon at Ma-Config.com unearthed a slide presentation from a Microsoft architectural summit held in London in early April of this year that focuses on virtualization futures. (As Microsoft watchers may recall, new virtualization capabilities are expected by many to be part of Windows 8 when it ships around 2012 or so.) There’s only one slide in the deck that explicitly calls out the 2012+ “Windows Next.” But the deck still gives some general sense of what the Softies are thinking on the Windows client virtualization front.

The Microsoft solution architect presentation, entitled “Desktop as a Service,” describes some of the customer pain points associated with Windows today. From notes that are part of the slide deck:

Customers today “see application compatibility issues, they see DLL hell, they see an inability to manage efficiently, they see high costs associated with maintenance and upgrades, they see a relatively short lifespan…..This cannot continue. Customers are increasingly refusing to let this continue.”

What could alleviate these problems in a single bound? Virtualization technology! Or — to reflect the deck’s messaging more accurately — a panoply of virtualization technologies.

Microsoft already offers a number of virtualization technologies — Virtual desktop infrastructure (VDI); application virtualization (App-V, MED-V, Remote Apps, Terminal Server), OS virtualiztion (Remote Desktop, Terminal Services, VDI); data virtualization (folder redirection and synch); hardware virtualization (Hyper-V), plus various System Center management offerings. While many are touting VDI as the holy grail, VDI is not the same as desktop as a service (DaaS), according to the Softies, and DaaS is more than just VDI.

Here’s a slide that shows how Microsoft is thinking about the next-gen virtual desktop:

In the brave, new DaaS world, “the desktop should not be associated with the device. (T)he desktop can be thought of as a portal which surfaces the users apps, data, user state and authorisation and access,” according to the slides.

DaaS means applications and data are centrally managed, as are the deployment of these apps and data. Apps and data are “treated as cached entities and synchronized with an appstore and “user state store,” the slide deck explained. (Aha! Another mention of the infamous Windows 8 app store concept.) The operating system also is cached and synched with the appstore in this new model. Hardware failure becomes a non-issue (at least in theory) for users, and more reliable maintenance of applications and the operating system become possible, according to the slides.

More and more of the desktop will be virtualizable, as this slide (with the Windows Next mention) shows:


With Windows 7, Microsoft is able to provide virtualization of a user’s data, settings and applications (by using App-V). With “Windows Next” and beyond, Microsoft will be adding the ability to virtualize the operating system, as well, by providing native virtual hard disk (VHD) capabilities in/with Win 8, according to the slide.

As I noted when Windows 8 slides leaked earlier this year, any/all of these concepts and plans could be shelved by the time Microsoft starts delivering the first public test builds of Windows 8 (some time in 2011). But it’s still interesting to see the thought process behind the next Windows release — and how/if it eventually will map to reality.

I’m wondering what the DaaS concept will mean not just to businesses, but also consumers. Would Microsoft be the one providing OS virtualization, via its own centralized datacenters — the way it is currently providing hosted applications via BPOS/Office 365?

Other thoughts/interpretations of what Microsoft might be planning on the virtualization/cloud front with Windows 8?

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Topics

Mary Jo has covered the tech industry for more than 25 years for a variety of publications and Web sites, and is a frequent guest on radio, TV and podcasts, speaking about all things Microsoft-related. She is the author of Microsoft 2.0: How Microsoft plans to stay relevant in the post-Gates era (John Wiley & Sons, 2008).

Disclosure

Mary-Jo Foley

Freelance journalist/blogger Mary Jo Foley has nothing to disclose. WYSIWYG (what you see is what you get). I do not own Microsoft stock or stock in any of its partners or competitors. I have no business ventures that are sponsored by/funded by Microsoft or any of its partners or competitors.

Biography

Mary-Jo Foley

Mary Jo Foley has covered the tech industry for 25 years for a variety of publications, including ZDNet, eWeek and Baseline. She has kept close tabs on Microsoft strategy, products and technologies for the past 10 years. In the late 1990s, she penned the award-winning "At The Evil Empire" column for ZDNet, and more recently the Microsoft Watch blog for Ziff Davis.

Got a tip? Send her an email with your rants, rumors, tips and tattles. Confidentiality guaranteed.

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Thin Clients
mjaus01 16th Nov 2010
I remember using a sun thin client box in 1995. Is this essentially the same concept repacked by Microsoft.
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@mjaus01 The shelf-life of a concept is 10 years according to Microsoft....

So this is innovation now.
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@cyberslammer2 We get it - you hate Microsoft. Now try adding to the discussion.
  • Flagged
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M$ NEVER innovates, everything they do is an EPIC FAIL -

Kinect - only 1 million units sold since the 4th = EPIC FAIL
Win 7 phone - SOLD OUT = EPIC FAIL
Windows 7 - EPIC FAIL
Xbox = EPIC FAIL
Windows Server = EPIC FAIL
Zune = EPIC FAIL
M$Office = EPIC FAIL

I'm with you - M$ will be gone by the end of 2011 (if not sooner)!!!
  • Flagged
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RE: Windows 8 to showcase 'desktop as a service'?
PollyProteus Updated - 16th Nov 2010
@cyberspammer -- epic failure.

Whether your post was intended to be sarcastic or you believe what you wrote, the post was an epic failure.
  • Flagged
@Djblois We get it - you blindly love Microsoft. Now try adding to the discussion.
  • Flagged
@cyberslammer2 Windows 7 as a fail? Sorry, I just don't follow that. We can debate the merits of the other items you...mention...but Win7 is as unfail as it gets.
  • Flagged
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@mjaus01 - There's nothing new under the "Sun" (sorry for the pun) - I worked on mainframe virtual machines in the '70s too.
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@boomer57

Yes but companies are not deploying mainframes to run desktop software. Based on what Mary Jo wrote, the various features would be very useful to most businesses.

-M
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RE: Windows 8 to showcase 'desktop as a service'?
Habiloso Updated - 16th Nov 2010
@mjaus01
The biggest problem for anyone contemplating W8 is the sure knowledge that every second version of Windows is a dud. History has shown this to be true. So, do you risk potentially buying a W8 dud or wait for W9?

As well M$ has a long history of promising high and delivering low. I'd take anything the M$ is saying about W8 with a grain of salt.
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If you speak any German "DaaS concept" is actually somewhat amusing. Reminds me of Das Blinkenlichten and the warm feeling one gets in a server room...
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fdsd
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Sounds like...
cabdriverjim 16th Nov 2010
Citrix XenClient or perhaps a Microsoft spun version of similar tech. The hardware is entirely virtual (Intel vPro only right now) and the running OS can be synched back and forth with a "Synchronization" server. You can quite literally have a near-real-time backup of an entire "local" OS on a remote server. Its really quite amazing in action. I've got some vPro laptops setup with it at work and, honestly, I'm impressed enough I'd consider it on all of the laptops. Replacing a laptop is beyond trivial in that situation and can even be done remotely by the end user with a simple instruction sheet. Best part is that XenClient costs $0 and is basically just a rebuild of CentOS. Goes on the physical box using a CD or thumb drive and you can load the OS from CD or from the Synchronizer service.
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RE: Windows 8 to showcase 'desktop as a service'?
The Danger is Microsoft 16th Nov 2010
@cabdriverjim - Please. You got it setup already? Microsoft shill....easy call.

You lose!
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I am wondering, with all the virtualization of our desktop,, who is responsible for security, and what will the holder of our apps do with it? I know, maybe I am just paranoid?
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RE: Windows 8 to showcase 'desktop as a service'?
The Danger is Microsoft 16th Nov 2010
@Rikaroo - Not at all. Microsoft is trying to not only command 'leasing' their OS they want to 'own' your hardware too!

The Danger is Real! The danger is Microsoft!
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RE: Windows 8 to showcase 'desktop as a service'?
Hallowed are the Ori 17th Nov 2010
@The Danger is Microsoft

Shut up, you blithering idiot.
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@Rikaroo Glad someone else came away from that article with the same thing in mind. With the obscene rush to outsou---erm move everything to the cloud, not enough people (imo) are even aware of the privacy and security concerns that arise as a result. Also take a moment to imagine if these were hosted on Microsoft servers the burden you'd be placing on the vast series of tubes we all call home.
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@Rikaroo Good question. I guess in the long run; it'd be up to the end user to take total accountability for what happens to their systems.

But if the software and the operating system itself is virtual; then wouldn't a virus run through the cloud and not the system itself? It'd be easily neutralized..
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Cost?
curph 16th Nov 2010
Microsoft has had desktop virtualization available for several years no. It hasn't gone anywhere and it won't unless the pricing structure changes. It should be considered a built-in feature of the OS and not an add-on that is only available to you if you license the whole MS catalog.
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@curph - except that Windows 7 Enterprise ships with the ability to run Windows XP virtualized.

Oh ... and except for the fact that you can freely download VirtualPC if you want.

Oh ... and except for the fact that enterprises around the world are enjoying the HUGE benefits of App-V.

Nice try.
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@bitcrazed

Windows 7 enterprise = buy the catalog

Virtual PC - single workstation solution, not manageable when you have hundreds or thousands of desktops.

App-V - still just an also-ran to VMWare despite years of MS pushing it. Why is that?
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RE: Windows 8 to showcase 'desktop as a service'?
The Danger is Microsoft Updated - 16th Nov 2010
@bitcrazed - have some more Russian Vodka...


p.s. - Damn ZDNet site. Must be running Windows software. This was posted to the bitcrazed post as shown below:

@curph - except that Windows 7 Enterprise ships with the ability to run Windows XP virtualized.

Oh ... and except for the fact that you can freely download VirtualPC if you want.

Oh ... and except for the fact that enterprises around the world are enjoying the HUGE benefits of App-V.

Nice try.
  • Flagged
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@curph
I think we can agree the complexity of running a locally hosted VM compared to enterprise wide virtualization is proportionate to the cost...
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@bitcrazed
It's not just limited to Enterprise.
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its great if you have a ton of machines that need the same stuff on them and you have the bandwidth. But I don't see this killing a traditional OS, especially when you have high performance programs like gaming or multi-media. This concept was around before there was a desktop OS, its just upgraded with a lot more functionality.
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Exactly what it is...
maclovin Updated - 16th Nov 2010
@KBot

That's exactly what it is (and WAS).

This is all cyclical. After so much time in the "cloud" (and potential private information being let out) people will go back to normal desktops, and so on and so forth.

Plus there's SO many different definitions of "Cloud Computing". It's like there are as many different String Theories (not ACTUALLY a theory, according to the Scientific Method, which is taught in elementary/middle school).

Ah well.
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@KBot No, its not like that. It CAN be, though, if you choose. This is largely about decoupling the installed OS from the hardware. Whether you run the OS locally or remotely is up to you. And you could feasibly be making that decision every time you need to use the system. That is very possible with the current state of XenClient and laptop hardware currently on the market. Imagine the ability to buy a "blank" laptop with only the hypervisor preloaded at the factory. First time it boots you can install whatever OS you want from a marketplace, for example. Or, more importantly, from your own storage server (home nas device, etc). Buy a new laptop and just transfer the entire OS install from the old one onto it via a synchronizer.
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RE: Windows 8 to showcase 'desktop as a service'?
The Danger is Microsoft 16th Nov 2010
@cabdriverjim - Maybe it's just me but I would HATE to only be able to use my computer when a network/WiFi connect is available.
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at all. I can see where this would be useful in a corporate environment though.
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@JT82
NOPE. not for corporate either. DLL hell goes away simply by moving my station to your server? right...This is simly belligerent marketing to minimalize all IT professionals and to increase the recurring revenues for Microsoft. Do NOT buy in and push back hard!!!
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RE: Windows 8 to showcase 'desktop as a service'?
ahh so Updated - 16th Nov 2010
NOPE. not for corporate either.

Wanna bet? It's happening as we speak. Better get used to it since the decision to do so, isn't yours.

DLL hell goes away simply by moving my station to your server?

Well now you have something called "profile hell", but that's a different story.

:P
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RE: Windows 8 to showcase 'desktop as a service'?
The Danger is Microsoft 16th Nov 2010
@DiggityDoug - uhhh....you IT pro's have ALREADY been marginalized. You're just a bunch of point-and-click junkies (Windows supporters and MAC OS ten supporters anyway).
  • Flagged
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@DiggityDoug "This is simly belligerent marketing to minimalize all IT professionals " HOW DARE THEY MAKE SOFTWARE USABLE AND NOT REQUIRING OF OUTSIDE EXPERTISE!
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Home user benefit
james.vandamme 19th Nov 2010
@JT82 Their second slide intrigued me. The items in blue, you buy at the store. The rest, either somebody makes or rents (presumably from Microsoft). Hopefully, someday, I can buy hardware alone without the Microsoft tax, and if I want to rent an OS and apps online from Monkeyboy (as most sheeple will do), I have that option. On their chart, where you see "OS" on the right hand side, I see a penguin instead.
at home I surf, answer emails,store movies and pictures, and occasionally play some games on my computer. What does this get me? Sounds like complication I don't need or want. I surely would not trust my data to go back and forth to some company somewhere else.
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@Al_nyc "What does this get me?"

The ability to upgrade to new (safer, faster, more effective) versions of Windows without having to re-pave your machine each time.

The ability to run your old apps in your previous OS while you move to using newer apps on your newer OS.
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RE: Windows 8 to showcase 'desktop as a service'?
The Danger is Microsoft 16th Nov 2010
@bitcrazed - That ability has existed for years. Can you type without looking at your keyboard? Doubt it...loser!
  • Flagged
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It has existed for years?
Michael Alan Goff 17th Nov 2010
And here I thought people were complaining that Vista and 7 didn't run the apps that XP did. I GUESS I AM MISTAKEN.
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RE: Windows 8 to showcase 'desktop as a service'?
The Danger is Microsoft 16th Nov 2010
@Al_nyc - Good for you! 95% of Microsoft supporters complain about Google. This is an MS Google move!
@Al_nyc
It gets you nothing. What it does is allow the cloud servers to make sure those movies and pictures aren't pirated, that you really bought the games you like to play, the ability to see what sites you surf to so they can send ads to the email address you use...All that good stuff.

Where do I sign up?
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The more elbows, T's and...
neverhome 16th Nov 2010
other plumbing you add, the greater the chance of stopping up the drain. I'd prefer they kept it simple. Frankly I miss 98SE. Even more frankly, there are times when I miss my trusty old TRS80.
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@neverhome - nobody here is stopping you from going back to using your TRS-80.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TRS-80#Emulators
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Time for a Mac
davidr69 16th Nov 2010
How exactly am I supposed to run music production software, which MUST run as close to real-time as possible, on stuff like this? VST plugins must be aware of the ASIO drivers. My next machine will be a Mac; I've had it (especially since my souped-up Windows 7 box doesn't run Cubase as well as my old XP box).
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@davidr69
Totally agree, windows next should be something tangible like a rewrite of the kernel, resulting in faster boots, more security, better extensibility, etc. this is simply a ploy to move all work to their servers so that IT is marginalized and their vapor is monetized.
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rewriting the kernel?
Michael Alan Goff 17th Nov 2010
Didn't they get in trouble for that with Vista where a lot of older programs stopped working? Well... not in trouble perse. People just complained. More security? How about UAC? Faster boots? Have you used 7? Extensibility... okay, what do you want?
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@davidr69 ... Well, that tells us something about win7 (and 8 & 9) as they're all re-comiled Vista with newe defauluts and differently arranged screens.
XP will be around for a long, long time I think and won't succumb to 7,8 or whatever until/unless MS decides to force it out or working like they did in China to combat pirating, and after which they turned around and sold "real" licenses to them at $35 each to try to keep them from pirating again. It only took an update to trash their machines so they could never be reinstalled or used again. HOW they did that is beyond me, but ... supposedly that's what happened. Maybe they had gvt help.
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@davidr69
You may want to rethink moving to the Mac. My understanding is the new IOS desktop has Steve's version of this same concept. Apple fellas, did I get this right??
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RE: Windows 8 to showcase 'desktop as a service'?
max_wedge Updated - 16th Nov 2010
@davidr69, no one is talking about forcing you to use desktop as a service. The discussion is whether Windows Next will have the option to subscribe to desktop as a service, not that Windows will become nothing more than a thin client.

RE: your cubase problems, not everyone is having problems with Cubase and Windows 7. This suggests there is a cure, I suggest you google the problem. Also make sure you have the most recent version certified for Windows 7, also the latest video and audio drivers for your hardware. Windows 7 differs in some key areas to previous versions, especially xp. Give it a chance and you might find a solution.

Also, if you haven't already, turn of UAC completely! In my experience not a lot of software vendors seem to be able to allow for UAC adequately. Use a two-way firewall and add exceptions for cubase if you are concerned about security.
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how many SKU's is that?
ScottBraden 16th Nov 2010
On one hand, it's interesting to speculate that MSFT will finally support a variety of virtualization models. On the other... that's a long list of features for customers to choose from, and I'm sure each will come with associated SKU's and price tags... it's still about total cost of desktop ownership and why would a customer want to spend more?

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  • [q] "Quote" [/q]
  • [ol][*] 1. Ordered List [/ol]
  • [ul][*] · Unordered List [/ul]
  • [pre] Preformat [/pre]
  • [quote] "Blockquote" [/quote]
ie8 fix

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ie8 fix