Linux and Open Source

Steven J. Vaughan-Nichols & Paula Rooney

Ignorance no excuse for GPL violations

By | December 17, 2009, 6:59am PST

Summary: It’s time for everyone in this business to understand that, despite its heritage of copyleft, the GPL is just like a Microsoft EULA.

I spent the morning with Jason Perlow (right) over at his ZDNet Tech Broiler, where he took apart the latest GPL violation suits.

Given my own experience with Chinese OEMs, everything Perlow says is quite reasonable. There’s no process. It’s hard to tell where code is coming from. The companies in question may have just had Chinese engineers who were ignorant of how they needed to publish their source in order to comply with the GPL.

Well, as a teacher once told me chillingly, “that’s an explanation, not an excuse.”

If these companies were incorporating Windows code into their devices and seeking to profit from them, Microsoft’s lawyers would be on them with both feet faster than you can say “ka-ching.”

It’s time for everyone in this business to understand that, despite its heritage of copyleft, the GPL is just like a Microsoft EULA.

Software under the GPL may be free in terms of its price. But it’s still licensed, and its use still obligates you to a form of payment, in this case the publication of code.

The Busybox Web site is written in English but its language is pretty plain:

Basically, if you distribute GPL software the license requires that you also distribute the source code to that GPL-licensed software. So if you distribute BusyBox without making the source code to the version you distribute available, you violate the license terms, and thus infringe on the copyrights of BusyBox. (This requirement applies whether or not you modified BusyBox; either way the license terms still apply to you.)

Don’t understand English? Find someone who does. All these defendants have English-speaking engineers and lawyers on-call.

While at CompuTex in June I talked to several Chinese executives who described their ambitions to go up the food chain, to turn their companies into big name brands, to become real players on the global stage.

Part of being a player means taking responsibility for your work, as in this case. It means having a development process you can monitor, audit, and explain after-the-fact.

While I understand what Jason is writing, I’m left feeling as I do about companies that use spammers and phony Internet games to harvest e-mails and addresses from unsuspecting users. I just said do it, I didn’t say how, they say when caught.

Well, here in the real world you’re responsible for how as well as what. The explanations are not excuses. If your engineers are ignorant you have a legal obligation to educate them.

If not, pay up.

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Topics

Dana Blankenhorn has been a business journalist for 30 years, a tech freelancer since 1983.

Disclosure

Dana Blankenhorn

Dana Blankenhorn has been a journalist, writer and part-time futurist for over 30 years.

At the present moment I run only a personal blog in addition to my ZDNet open source blog.

DanaBlankenhorn.Com has the subtitle The War Against Oil. In the past I have used it to write about political history, e-commerce, personal matters, some ideas related to open source, and The World of Always On, which is the idea of using sensors, motes and RFID to turn WiFi links into platforms for applications which live in the air.

My IRA account at Schwab holds a few tech shares, most notably some Intel and Applied Materials, but there are no open source companies in it. I don’t even own any CBS stock.

Biography

Dana Blankenhorn

Dana Blankenhorn has been a business journalist for nearly 25 years and has covered the online world professionally since 1985. He founded the Interactive Age Daily for CMP Media, and has written for the Chicago Tribune, Advertising Age's "NetMarketing" supplement, and dozens of other publications over the years.

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RE: Ignorance no excuse for GPL violations
musdahi Updated - 18th Oct
Ignorance no excuse for about it is bank that website attacked from the site support from any soldier site to the light home page is great GPL
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Jason's beef ...
n0neXn0ne Updated - 17th Dec 2009
... is with RMS. He needs to get over it.

^o^

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RE: Ignorance no excuse for GPL violations
zakkiromi Updated - 26th May 2011
It means having a development process you can monitor, audit, and explain after-the-fact. k
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RE: Ignorance no excuse for GPL violations
musdahi Updated - 18th Oct
Ignorance no excuse for about it is bank that website attacked from the site support from any soldier site to the light home page is great GPL
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RE: Ignorance no excuse for GPL violations
edward polling Updated - 4th Jul
You may be a victim of some ignorance that they will step in and do it all for you. Please rethink that phrase and update your knowledge if ipad bag blog sutudeg education news and pclos hwdb necessary. l
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RE: Ignorance no excuse for GPL violations
anandpur@... Updated - 17th Dec 2009
Samsung, JVC, Humax and Astak (which is primarily a US importer and reseller/rebrander of Chinese goods)

What Jason Perlow is taking "better look" at these companies Samsung, Humax is South Korea companies and JVC is from Japan not sure about Astak. If he can check Wikipedia .

I think what we have here is a classic case of large companies having little or no clue of how to deal with Free Software and Open Source licensed software or what they actually need to do to comply.

How come "large companies" know where thay can get cheap protects made and sold for profit and know very little about how to comply
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RE: Ignorance no excuse for GPL violations
gaberdiye03 Updated - 21st Jun
@anandpur@... Samsung, JVC, Humax and Astak (which is primarily a US importer and reseller/rebrander of Chinese goods)

What Jason Perlow is taking "better look" at these companies Samsung, Humax is South Korea companies and JVC is from Japan not sure about Astak. If he can check Wikipedia .

I think what we pembe maske energy balance oyna oyunu moliva orjin krem tutune son nanomatik complex 41 new fx15 have here is a classic case of large companies having little or no clue of how to deal with Free Software and Open Source licensed software or what they actually need to do to comply.

How come "large companies" know where thay can get cheap protects made and sold for profit and know very little about how to comply
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RE: Ignorance no excuse for GPL violations
wizard57m@... 17th Dec 2009
"It?s time for everyone in this business to understand that, despite its heritage of copyleft, the GPL is just like a Microsoft EULA."

Dana, perhaps you should explain this to many of the posters on your previous blog, Death of the black box EULA...
http://blogs.zdnet.com/open-source/?p=5350&tag=trunk;content
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Boom!
happyharry_z 17th Dec 2009
Can't have your cake and eat it too. I guess that would not have made as interesting an article though.
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Contributr
Ignorance and excuses
jperlow 17th Dec 2009
Dana I agree with you that Ignorance is not an excuse and compliance is an absolute requirement of using GPL code. But there are a few issues here below the surface that are just a bit more complicated than "Pay Up"

One is the issue of HOW do you comply and HOW do you stay out of trouble. In that I think a lot of work needs to be done in terms of education, particularly in Asia where virtually all of these Linux devices are made, engineered, and coded.

The other issue is whether or not these lawsuits are actually helping the cause of Free Software. I've heard a lot about how the SFLC interacts with companies. If you inject the cultural barriers on top of standard abrasiveness you get a formula for disaster. Some sensitivity is needed here.

The OTHER issue is whether or not GPLed stuff really is ideal for use in embedded devices for these manufacturers. With Android, you've got a bare minimum amount of stuff that is actually GPL -- essentially, just the kernel and a few other things. The rest of it is all Apache. It's possible that as a result of all this enforcement, a new SDK/framework other than Busybox and uclibc will be developed in order to avoid the pitfalls of Copyleft.
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Erm...
zkiwi 17th Dec 2009
How you comply is easy. Read the GPL, abide by it. People seem to manage to do that sort of thing for pretty much any other type of license, yet they choose not to for GPL work.

They (lawsuits like these) actually do help the cause of GPL software. Like any license, unless it's enforced it's worthless. So, enforcement has to happen, and sooner rather than later.

The "other" issue is pretty much a red herring. It doesn't matter what's in embedded, it has to abide by the licensing terms for whatever it's made up of. Do you think that no one should put GPL in embedded? Weird thought if you do, and probably impossible to justify.
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"One is the issue of HOW do you comply and HOW do you stay out of
trouble."


Seems like important questions to ask before investing, marketing,
and distributing a product.
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They know what they're doing
Richard Flude 17th Dec 2009
In my trips to Asia I've seen it first hand. They know the GPL
conditions, many simply ignore it believing nothing will happen.

Conforming to the GPL is straight forward. Bundle the GPL stuff and
put it on a website. Put a sticker on your device with a GPL notice and
link to the license and source. Done.

"The OTHER issue is whether or not GPLed stuff really is ideal for use
in embedded devices for these manufacturers."

They need to weigh up the cost of alternatives with their license
obligations.

A small GPL base (kernel, busybox, file system) contains little value
add for these manufacturers. I've produced several of these. Separate
non-GPL stuff into your own initrd, combine at boot. It's simple, and
all built into the kernel (it's free).

They know what they're doing is wrong, and they like the price of GPL
code. Stop apologising for them. Abide by the GPL (or any other
license) or you're stealing other people's work.
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Amen: Ignorance no excuse
twaynesdomain 18th Dec 2009
That's all; just Amen!
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exactly as it says
someitguy79 17th Dec 2009
Either with the binary on the said accessible. You can provide url in the case of embedded devices as other manufacturers do. Most people contacted immediately complied, its this handful that refused to. Every other news source on this points that out. Until this suit only the source for busybox and any changes to busybox were requested to be released. No one until this suit has been asked to pay anything.

The GPL is complied to by various companies large and small. These choose not to.

Therefore the plaintiff's elected after trying the other options to sue. Looks blatant to me. As Dana said Microsoft would not be so kind. Jason, your argument is a red herring as those who are being sued refused to respond to the requests to comply. They can choose not to use or release the source. Don't like it don't use it.
If I've seen that once, I've seen it a hundred times by Microserfs. Usually accompanied by "they should have read their EULA".

Where is the great wall separating Microsoft's EULAs and the GPL? What's good for the goose is good for the gander. Microsoft would be on them like a duck on a junebug if they violated THEIR EULA. THEY ALONE are responsible for accepting, comprehending, and complying with it.

Let's get with the program. A little respect is in order.
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As to how...
jasonp@... 18th Dec 2009
I think we can all agree that ignoring the stipulation completely and playing the ignorance card after the fact isn't the way to go eh?
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You've got that right
cabdriverjim 17th Dec 2009
I'm glad someone here has finally stated the obvious. I'm a developer on a reasonably popular GPL program and there have been more than one occasion over the years when our code was used in a proprietary program. They've always had these elaborate excuses as to why its alright.

Rather than just playing by the rules one guy even devised this elaborate dynamic loading mechanism to allow ASP.Net to call our library and then claimed he didn't have to provide the source code for our library because of that. All other arguments aside, he made proprietary changes to our library and didn't publish the code for those either. Thankfully, he priced himself out of the market and our existing userbase was smart enough to refuse to use his house of cards. Our biggest concern was security updates, though. There was no way we could provide them to users of his software and it was pretty clear he only cared about the money. (His mess was _very_ expensive.) He was marketing the software throwing around our name as a feature but then providing the users with a very subpar implementation of our software. We had no resources to sue him, unfortunately, and it was before the SFLC was around to do it for us.
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cabdriverjim
twaynesdomain 18th Dec 2009
I have only one comment on your otherwise good comment. You said:
--------
We had no resources to sue him, unfortunately, and it was before the SFLC was around to do it for us.
--------

Your "... to do it for us." comment is rather telling about an attitude/possible cultural problem or you would have worded that differently. You may be a victim of some ignorance that they will step in and do it all for you. Please rethink that phrase and update your knowledge if necessary.
1 in 100,000,000 ...... catch me if you can happy
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RE: Ignorance no excuse for GPL violations
twaynesdomain 18th Dec 2009
"
How come "large companies" know where thay can get cheap protects made and sold for profit and know very little about how to comply
"

As with any legal rule or reg, ignorance is NOT an excuse! Either such companies are purposely ignorant, or they are not, which is more likely, and ignorance is simply their first defense and a stall in order to reap profits above and beyond the cost of getting caught. It matters not to them that their installed base may be completely stranded for support and further upgrades/updates once they are caught.
The current attitudes are right on, and as they progress more and more damage, collateral and otherwise will occur. Just the act of beginning to attach such crimes will be enough to scare some off, but not the "large" companies with full pocket books or nothing to lose.
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I've been consulting to firms for over eleven years now on the GPL. There is no excuse today or a decade ago, a license is a license. Its not like it isn't copied into the code again and again. Its not like there isn't any legal precedence. There is no ignorance only flagrant abuses.

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