Tech Broiler

Jason Perlow and Scott Raymond

Who is a Candidate for Desktop Linux?

By | October 11, 2009, 4:39pm PDT

Summary: I personally do not fall into the group of people that can easily migrate away from Windows, but that doesn’t mean you or someone you know can’t make the switch. As I said in earlier post last month, the work that I do in my professional life requires that I still need to use [...]

I personally do not fall into the group of people that can easily migrate away from Windows, but that doesn’t mean you or someone you know can’t make the switch.

As I said in earlier post last month, the work that I do in my professional life requires that I still need to use Windows and various Microsoft and 3rd-party Win32 applications, even though I also use Linux. I also use various applications in my personal life that have no true functional Windows equivalents, so I have both Windows and Linux computers at home.

However, my situation is somewhat out of the ordinary. I don’t expect that most regular end-users have or need more than one personal computer at home or at work. Additionally, as an Information Technology professional and as a writer who covers the industry that I work in,  I choose to use multiple systems with different operating systems at home for educational purposes and also because I have a genuine curiosity about what is out there in both the Open Source and Microsoft-centric worlds. That’s not necessarily a realistic usage scenario for everyone.

There are certainly ideal groups of people who are capable of moving towards a 100 percent Open Source or Linux environment in both their professional and personal lives. I’m not really interested in discussing the political and ideological aspects or why someone would want to make that choice. That path been re-hashed over and over again and supplies far too much fodder for flame bait. Please take that into consideration when you submit a Talkback on this piece.

The greater and more important question is, who CAN switch to Linux? It should be noted that when I refer to groups of people here, I am for the most part excluding Information Technology professionals, Techies, digital content creation professionals, UNIX/Linux sysadmins and scientific academia who have much more sophisticated or specialized needs and may even be using Linux, the Mac and Windows and or a combination of these already.

As to WHICH Linux distribution any of these target users should be looking at, I am going to treat all of them equally and say that every single one of them will meet the basic usage requirements for the set of folks detailed below. For more information on Linux distributions, check out my Surviving the Recession with Free Linux Distributions roundup.

Click on the “Read the rest of this entry” link below for more

The Lower Range:  The “Super-Casual Web Surfer”

These users are 98% Web and email use, with very little else.  If they are using anything outside of a web-browser at all, it’s probably a rare case (they might use a game, if someone installed it for them).  And if they know what a “file” is, its more in the abstract.  To them a “file” is like an “inch”– it’s a unit of measurement and a description a lot of people use which doesn’t really apply to them.  It might as well be made of manila poster board for all they know, or care.

Senior Citizens are an especially big component of this group — although a surprising percentage of Seniors have become quite savvy in terms of social networking, bulletin boards, and messaging (although note that if in that sub-group, they’d likely be manipulating digital photos or videos, so they’d be in another “grouping” entirely).

These people for the most part don’t understand how computers work, and don’t really have to.  They’re probably perfect Linux candidates, without them even necessarily knowing WHAT Linux even is.

The Super-casual Web Surfer is also probably the same type of person who might be perfectly happy with a netbook or entry-level computer as his or her primary computing environment. They also do not use external devices with proprietary device driver and support software that doesn’t run on Linux. They have zero dependence on specialized, vertical-market applications. Virtually everything they do is web-oriented.

The Lower-Mid-Range: The “Type a Letter” User

These people do a TINY bit more than the Casual Web Users.

This group may occasionally use basic MS Office apps, but if they do its in a fairly unambitious manner for viewing purposes mostly, and they probably often have to be “babied” through any explanation more complex than “click on this”.  But many of these people wouldn’t know an Excel spreadsheet from a hole in their head.  They might dash out the rare letter to someone, but that’s about it.  They write it and print it.  They probably know how to save the file, but rarely if ever do they need to send that file AS electronic data to someone.

These users are Web-wise, but are NOT using services which require “file manipulation”, like Facebook (digital photos), iTunes (music files) or Blackberry (special hardware and software configuration).

These are the people who even this many years into the computer revolution still probably won’t understand how a hard drive works, what a “directory” is and how they are laid out and accessed, etc.  They use and manipulate files, but if those files weren’t conveniently stored in areas labeled “My Music”, “My Pictures” etc. they’d never be able to locate them.

Hardware-wise, these are probably the people who use whatever comes with a PC they buy and rarely if ever expand a system.

These would be good candidates for Linux, as long as they can manage to find where their documents are on a Linux system, and if they TRULY don’t exchange documents with anyone else (most people actually DON’T).

The Middle of the Middle: The “Just Work, Dammit” User

These people usually don’t want to be troubled.  They just want it to work.  Most of them could get away without any custom apps, although they DO want to be able to manipulate their photos, videos, etc.  So something easy has to exist to do that.

I know of a CEO of a major corporation valued in the 100 billion dollars and above range who fits in this category and uses Linux exclusively on his desktop with no Windows software whatsoever. He has five icons on it: Email, Web Browser, Word Processing, Spreadsheet, Presentation. He isn’t concerned about interoperability with Windows users.

In order of priority of what is critical to him, he sends email, he browses the web and he opens up and prints occasional productivity documents, which places him in this category of users that happens to be significant in size. There’s absolutely no reason why these types of users cannot use Linux instead of Windows.

End-users like this have pieces of understanding of what’s behind the computer they use. They’ll know what a file is and probably have a decent idea of how to manipulate through directories and drives, but its kind of a “soft” understanding which shouldn’t be challenged.  This stuff gives them headaches for the most part and the computer really IS just a tool for these folks.

They definitely use Office, and probably work in professions where they manipulate documents and might need them at home.  “True” Office probably still won’t be a concern for most of them (how many people REALLY work for Law Firms, Ad agencies or the Government?) but note that there would be a subset of them where that might apply.

Like my CEO example, these people may generate “soft” work products (word processing documents, spreadsheets, presentations, PDFs) that are going to be printed hardcopy, are usually not of a complex nature and/or do not need to be exchanged or originate from Windows/MS Office environments. The majority of home users fit into this category, as do high school and college students.

Note that to keep things easy to categorize, we’re not including iTunes users here.  We’re considering that a “custom app” and so putting people who use it into the next category.

If they buy additional hardware they’d tend to try and consult someone more technical first.

This group sometimes owns digital cameras and my need to edit or upload photos to services such as Flickr or Picasa Web Galleries, and they also own digital media players and other mobile devices which are not dependent on proprietary software or specialized device drivers that are unsupported in Linux by the originating vendor or by the Linux community.

These people CAN be good Linux candidates, but only if whoever is setting it up for them does a lot of checking in advance to make sure their usage is as casual as it seems (and also that they aren’t in the sub-group needing “True” Office).

The Upper-Mid-Range: The “Set It and Forget It” User

A slightly bigger jump.

These people probably DO install their own apps, although most of these folks still aren’t technical.  They just want things to WORK.  In years past, they probably bought programs in software stores, but today they likely grab software off the web, and not always wisely.

The “True Office” divide probably still exists. Some will need it but most won’t.  The real issue with people like this would be something like iTunes.  They want it, they want it to work, and they don’t want to think about workarounds or alternatives. If they depend on iTunes to buy their music, it may be a deal-breaker for Linux.

At work, beyond mere Office, they might also use BlackBerries or another mobile device they expect to be able to integrate at home, and they might even be handed a Citrix Remote Access install disk or a VPN client by their IT department and be expected to install it and use it at home.  They’ll tear their hair out if this doesn’t all work for them.

They’d tend to buy printers right from Costco or Staples and expect them to consistently work right out of the box.

These are often bad candidates for Linux, because they can be casual AND demanding in different ways as users.  They want things to be easy, and yet always work. They should probably stick with Windows and Mac.

The Upper Range: The “Power User”

They aren’t the experts by any means, but they are usually clever enough (or stubborn enough) to figure things out.  They’re likely to use any number of software and hardware devices, but by the same token might accept compromises.

If iTunes doesn’t work, they might accept that if they can kludge another solution but have everything else work better.  If they occasionally need “True” Office, they might be able to puzzle through something like CrossOver or VirtualBox, although not being techies they might need assistance.  If a specific piece of hardware doesn’t work on Linux, they’d have the savvy (and patience) to ask what comparable hardware would instead.

These people are good candidates for Linux in many cases, but might do better with Windows or even the Mac in others.  The benefits of the Linux config would have to outweigh the ones of the Windows or Mac config, although they’d be flexible and adjust either way.

Do you or someone you know fit into any of these categories? Talk Back and Let Me Know.

Jonathan Lurie (jonathan.lurie@gmail.com) contributed to this article.

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Jason Perlow, Sr. Technology Editor at ZDNet, is a technologist with over two decades of experience integrating large heterogeneous multi-vendor computing environments in Fortune 500 companies.

Disclosure

Jason Perlow

My Full-Time Employer is IBM. I write as a freelancer for ZDNet.

Disclaimer: The postings and opinions on this blog are my own and don't necessarily represent IBM's positions, strategies or opinions.

I own no investments or direct financial instruments in the companies I write about.

Biography

Jason Perlow

Jason Perlow, Sr. Technology Editor at ZDNet is a technologist with over two decades of experience with integrating large heterogeneous multi-vendor computing environments in Fortune 500 companies. A long-time computer enthusiast starting the age of 13 with his first Apple ][ personal computer, he began his freelance writing career starting at ZD Sm@rt Reseller in 1996 and has since authored numerous guest columns for ZDNet Enterprise and Ziff-Davis Internet. Jason was previously Senior Technology Editor for Linux Magazine, where he wrote about Open Source issues from 1999 to 2008.

In his spare time, Jason is an avid amateur chef and food writer, where his work reviewing New Jersey restaurants has appeared in The New York Times. He is also the founder of the popular food web site eGullet and blogs about restaurants and cooking at OffTheBroiler.com.

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RE: Who is a Candidate for Desktop Linux?
JACOBSONR 14th Oct
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We do like to use a web browser, and view those
MS Office attachments we get.
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Contributr
You're in the introduction.
jperlow 11th Oct 2009
As I said, I'm not including techies and IT people in these groups, because they are probably already using a combination of both Windows and Linux/Unix.
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Curious as to why you assume IT people would be using a both. Linux IT types may have to use/support Windows but it's not the case from the Windows side.
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You are a computer geek.
Grayson Peddie 11th Oct 2009
That's all I can say.
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He's actually a troll
nucrash 12th Oct 2009
But give him the added cred if you want to.
I've never seen a useful contribution from you to this forum but somehow you feel the need to bash someone who has a genuine interest to participate in the discussion.

If he is a troll then where does that leave you?
Mentalist, you haven't submitted a worthwhile post in all the time you have been under your latest pseudonym. Surely you cannot be accusing others of the exact thing you do on here day after day???
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Anything useful to say?
The Mentalist 12th Oct 2009
???
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Sustain your claim... if you can
The Mentalist 12th Oct 2009
Where are those post of mine you supposedly mention? I would like to see them.

Talk is cheap son...
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Not just a troll
Tiggster 14th Oct 2009
He's a stupid troll. happy
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I'm Upper-Mid-Range...
Tom12Tom 11th Oct 2009
"They want things to be easy, and yet always work."

Yup, that's me. Linux would probably drive me crazy. (grin)

BTW, yes, I bought my current printer at Staples, and yes, it worked perfectly (with Vista x64) right out of the box.
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Just want it to work!
SpikeyMike 10th Dec 2009
Most Linux users I know are/were Windows DuFuses. That's why they run Linux - they aren't clever/competent/interested enough to securely run Windows!

The difference is, they were clever enough to ask someone who's taken the time to learn Linux to set it up for them, or they were interested enough to install it for themselves.

Going on a few years now, when someone asks for advice on buying a new PC (mine's too slow! is the reason given), I get them converted over to Linux and 'poof' - all of a sudden they're able to use their computer again.

Being an experienced computer user since the late 80's, it is difficult to understand the mindset of these people who 'just want it to work' and won't bother putting any effort into learning. Having given those types Linux instead of Windows actually gives them what they've asked for.
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Just gave my computer to "just work dammit" family.
CounterEthicsCommissioner-23034636492738337469105860790963 11th Oct 2009
Yesterday I gave my computer to a family of 6. It will be used for homeschooling they tell me. No internet (yet) but that may come. I figure they're in the 'just work dammit' category. But the kids are of course tech-savvy (or will be, soon).

The day before I gave it all away, I made it a dual boot machine. Vista and Linux Mint KDE, and tweaked it so that it would be a 'set and forget' machine. Also set bookmarks for safe online game sites, put a flashy pink skin on FF (for the young ladies). Oh, and OpenOffice on both partitions.

Now the interesting part. I showed Vista: no reaction. I showed Linux/KDE --> enthusiastic reaction.

We'll see what they use, in 3 months...
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What did you set as the default boot ?
JeremyAllison 12th Oct 2009
My guess is whatever you set as the default will be what they use in 3 months.

Jeremy.
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Oops - I didn't even think of that...
CounterEthicsCommissioner-23034636492738337469105860790963 12th Oct 2009
come to think of it, as it was Linux's bootloader, it probably defaults to Linux Mint KDE.

That settles it then...

(it will also help that I told the guy that Windows is very insecure especially when it comes to online banking, and that there is a near 100% certainty that Windows will crash and become unusable one day happy )
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Wow ...
orionds 2nd Nov 2009
CounterEthicsCommissioner, I couldn't help laughing reading your post. KDE is a beautiful desktop and probably way ahead of Win 7 too.

I'm an ardent supporter of Linux and have been using Ubuntu for just 3 months though I've tried Mandrake (before Mandriva).

The family of 6 will probably end up using both because there are some things that are specific to Windows and their friends are mostly likely locked into Windows in some way or other.

However, my experience with teenagers using computers show they are more ready to give Linux a go, whereas grown-ups are more reluctant, even the ones who just word process, use e-mail and browse the web.

One housewife just wanted the "comfort" of the Windows desktop (and wallpaper) even though her old notebook constantly crashed and XP crawled (literally) at a snail's pace in the 256 meg ram, Celeron environment.

Her son is a convert to Ubuntu on his quad core AMD PC with 4 gig ram and GeForce 9800 GT display. Somehow, he got out of his 3D gaming and loves the speed of Ubuntu. He even has "Linux(ing)" next to his messenger ID.

Well, her XP crashed for the last time, beyond resuscitation. Her son refuses to re-install XP because all his mother wants is a browser with flash and java, not even a word processor.

It's just a matter of installing a light Linux distro and then she can see her antiquated notebook fly.

As for myself, I would probably fit in the power-user category. At the moment, I'm actively finding and learning the Linux equivalents of what I use in XP. I'm close to 90% of the way there and then ... bye, bye Windows.

Of course, I'll pass the knowledge to my teenage students. Several of them have made the jump. Three of them have used Ubuntu live CDs to save the Windows data for their family when XP and Vista would no longer boot.
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re: Wow
skippythetubrat@... 12th Dec 2009
"Well, her XP crashed for the last time, beyond resuscitation. Her son refuses to re-install XP because all his mother wants is a browser with flash and java, not even a word processor.

It's just a matter of installing a light Linux distro and then she can see her antiquated notebook fly.
"

Puppy Linux.

"Several of them have made the jump. Three of them have used Ubuntu live CDs to save the Windows data for their family when XP and Vista would no longer boot."

That's what I do at my repair shop. Boot to the ubuntu live CD. cp the files to a temp directory on my samba server, resolve the windows issue (often w/ a reinstall from an image), cp the files back to the repaired machine.
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You forgot one
Duke E. Love 11th Oct 2009
The Upper Range: The ?Power User, Just Work, Dammit?

Those who are sick of dealing the the uncountable hidden bugs, gotchas and work-a-rounds when using FOSS development tools. The world where good enough is not good enough.

The world of Oracle, PhotoShop and Visual Studio.
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I'll also be the one who'll fall into that.
Grayson Peddie 11th Oct 2009
But because I'm a techie, Jason will tell me that
I'm in the introduction, like DonnieBoy. happy

So, I fall into 3 of the combinations:

* Introduction (I've been excluded as a techie.)
* "I want it to just work, you crazy."
* Power User
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Turnabout
CFWhitman 13th Oct 2009
This paragraph works just as well this way:

'Those who are sick of dealing [with] the uncountable hidden bugs, gotchas and work-a-rounds when using Visual Studio. The world where good enough is not good enough.'

A lot of it is what you're used to (because the bugs you're used to don't bother you as much), how open minded or flexible you are willing to be, and how much of the power you want in your hands rather than the hands of the IDE (or the people who developed it).

The other packages you mention:

What does Photoshop have to do with development? As to Photoshop, I'm sure it's great, but I've never wanted to spend the money for it, so I've gotten along with Cinepaint and Krita and the Gimp.

Oracle, OK, but Oracle is backend, and it runs just fine on Linux. Also, it certainly is possible to use something else with decent results under many circumstances, including PostgreSQL, MySQL, or even (gasp) Microsoft SQL Server, and use a frontend that runs on a different operating system than the backend.
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My bad... *Web* Development tools
Duke E. Love 13th Oct 2009
You know tools for *developing* web apps:

PhotoShop, Illustrator, Flash Catalyst, VS, DW, Flex Builder, Aptana, Oracle, and Gasp... MSSQL, ColdFusion and LiveCycle ES2, etc.

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Nope - Linux is fine for "*Web* Development tools"
UsernameRequired Updated - 14th Oct 2009
Looks like you've just listed some web dev apps from Adobe and
crossed your fingers there!

Photoshop. Too much bloat. I've been using it for about 20 years and
I've seen it go from a light-weigh ******** image editor to the over-
weight app that it is now. Personally, I'm not a big fan of The GIMP, but
it works. There are no tools in PhotoShop that are essential for web
development. It can't easily be used for pixel perfect layout for
instance. Besides, for UI design, you can't beat Fireworks.

Illustrator. Meh. As bloated as Photoshop. Freehand was always
better. Again, Inkscape works, and it works really well.

Both Flex Builder and Aptana are essentially Eclipse plugins, and we all
know Eclipse is multi-platform - swing and a miss there!

As mentioned, Oracle and most of their software works on Linux. As
for Coldfusion - I didn't know anybody was still using that!

All you really need is Notepad/Gedit/TextEdit/VIM (not Emacs. I hate
Emacs...)

EDIT: Block out H A R D C O R E !!!??? Will you politically correct idiots
get a grip! I thought that the 1st amendment was supposed to mean
something to you people. Wow. ZDnet is PATHETIC...
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Sorry you lose
Duke E. Love 15th Oct 2009
>and we all know Eclipse is multi-platform - swing and a miss there!

Nope. Do your home work. CF, Flex and flash Builder Win/MAc only.

>>Inkscape works, and it works really well.

I like Inkscape to. But No Catalyst support. Why is this important? RTFM.

>>Notepad/Gedit/TextEdit/VIM

Are you serious? Do you remember all the names of your classes, objects, functions and all the variables and in what order they need to be in?

I don't either, but my IDE does. Welcome to the 21st century where you don't have to be rain man to write code efficiently.

>>It can't easily be used for pixel perfect layout for instance. Besides, for UI design, you can't beat Fireworks.

Pixel perfect?. To quote Barny Frank "What planet do you spend most of your time?"

There is no such thing as Pixel perfect and probably never will be with a mark up language or CSS. Which is why I use Flex, Flash and Catalyst for pixel perfect Web UI's.

>>As for Coldfusion - I didn't know anybody was still using that!

Adobe, CarFax, Logitech, Mayo Clinic?

Who is using CF?
http://www.whousescoldfusion.com/

Gartner Loves CF 9 BTW. And I quote:

"Adobe has just released version 9 with an impressive list of new features that stand toe-to-toe with anything you?ll find from Microsoft, IBM, Oracle, or any of the elite open source options as well."

http://blogs.gartner.com/mark_driver/2009/10/06/i-continue-to-be-impressed-with-coldfusion/

Thanks for putting me in my place. I sorely deserve it since I don't know WTF I am talking about.

Thanx for playing. Come again.
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RE: Who is a Candidate for Desktop Linux?
billroberts123 11th Oct 2009
I understand why you wouldn't want political/social considerations to be included in the Talkback, but a large part to the move to Linux is just that. I moved to Linux to get out of the Microsoft upgrade mainstream. I liked Vista, after tweaking, and to have it obsolete for $'s on the upgrade makes me angry. After moving to Linux (PCLOS) I found I really enjoyed it. I am not a professional, so I don't know all the perameters, but this suits me fine and I love being out of the Microsoft loop.
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Basement dwelling bums are good candidates...nt
transposeIT Updated - 12th Oct 2009
nt
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I vote for you...
The Mentalist 12th Oct 2009
as you are the best candidate to date.
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These seem the least likely
IT_User 12th Oct 2009
If they're spending their days glued to the screen, they're most likely downloading and playing with lots of different apps or else playing computer games. Either way, they wouldn't be drawn to Linux.
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Aaaah... the voice of experience.
dave.leigh@... 12th Oct 2009
nt
Why should it be either Windows or Linux, when you can have both? One should expand one's possibilities, not limit them.

That's why a dual boot is perfect for almost everyone. For all categories, with the possible exception of the digitally illiterates: those are probably best served by 100 % Linux (less security worries).

Be a superpower user: have the best of both worlds! happy
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Contributr
Those who need Dual Boot
jperlow 12th Oct 2009
and desktop virtualization are probably in the introduction. I.E., content creation, techie. Or possibly in the last category.
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Those who need Dual Boot
dave.leigh@... 12th Oct 2009
Know it, and don't need an article to tell them so.

Besides, dual boot is so last century. These days we're using VMs.
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What do you gain from dual booting?

I could setup a dozen operating systems in a VM, so would that make me a superduper mega power user?

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The new idea is Virtual Box, installed on my Mandriva machine and also on my PCBSD machine. (Did you notice the "PC" in front of BSD? I am not so smart that I choose to make life difficult). Boot once and run whatever you like. You need native Windows use it, back to Linux for what you need there. Works better for me than dual boot, and I have been dual booting for 8 years.
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Desktop Linux is an old idea
Tiggster 14th Oct 2009
Just use Windows 7! happy
Well sure. If your PC has the horsepower.

I have three PCs (two desktop, one laptop). Only ONE of them is ever going to be able to handle Win 7 (and currently has it installed in fact). The other two? Will have to be happy with Linux. And what's wrong with that? It works, and works well them. All the Win 7 hype in the world isn't going to change what they, upgraded as far as possible, can run.
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I agree
Rob C 27th Oct 2009
My PC's are 2004, with 1GB of ram.
Which combination would have the least impact on my system ?
IE which version of linux and which VM software would take little resources in themselves, and allow Windows XP to run well ?
I am leaning towards the new release of Ubuntu, and Virtual Box.
I would value your advice
Rob
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funny categories
steeleblue_cactus 12th Oct 2009
Afraid I fine your categories a bit condescending. I'm a "senior citizen" as are most of my friends. We all were there before DOS and "grew up" in our careers using computers. We have all migrated from DOS to NT to XP to Vista, etc. with some different flavors in between. Most of us would not be considered geeks today but some were a few years ago.

However, I would say that now 99% of us would fall into your "just work" category. Since retirement most of us fall into web, e-mail and media. The thing is, we no longer want to fiddle with compatibility issues, drivers, video cards, keep track of updates, etc. It was fun once but now it takes up time we would rather spend on other things.

So while our habits (according to you) make up Super Casual Web Surfer our skill set does not match your assumptions. Each and every one of my friends has the required skill set but for other life-style reasons couldn't care less about moving from our Windows/Mac environment.

Before I retired I worked with many folks you would term "The Lower-Mid-Range: The ?Type a Letter? User". But I can guarantee you they certainly knew what an Excel spreadsheet was, did exchange documents with others and most certainly knew exactly how and where to manage their files.

You sound like a snob who assumes that because a user doesn't use their computer "to it's fullest" they don't have the skill set to do so. Most people just do what they need to do and go about their lives elsewhere.

While I might agree with your "categories" I would certainly NOT agree with your definitions of peoples skill level within those categories. A person's "skill/knowledge level" is not comparable to their needs/usage level.
...in order to fit users to Linux.

Take his classification of iTunes as a "custom app". Using this criteria he was able to reclassify a whole swath of people from ?Just Work, Dammit? to ?Set It and Forget It?.

Then there's the CEO of the $100B company. It's likely he has an administrative assistant who handles document formatting issues. Just like every other CEO of a $100B company.

I could go on but Jason has carefully constructed his categories to maximize Linux capable users. These are his ideals. He made no attempt to represent real life groups of users.
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Contributr
I said quite clearly in the introduction
jperlow Updated - 12th Oct 2009
That I am not interested in political or ideological issues. I'm talking about the usage criterion by which someone may be a candidate. Period.

I included in this piece a huge category of people that would not be good candidates. Anyone requiring Office, iTunes, or a specialized application or device which was Windows-based or Mac-based. And in the introduction I eliminated a large category of users as well, those working in IT, Scientific/Academia and digital content creation. Because they are either already using Linux or use a combination of Linux and Windows and/or Mac.
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That I am not interested in political or ideological issues. I'm talking about the usage criterion by which someone may be a candidate. Period.

I, and I think the majority of people, hardly consider iTunes to be a custom application. There's nothing political or ideological about it. You intentionally defined your categories to expand the base of people who qualify to use Linux.
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Could you stop being obtuse?
The Mentalist 12th Oct 2009
Why don't you write down what you want to see in the article and hand it to Jason so he can make the "corrections" you consider necessary?
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ahh
steeleblue_cactus 12th Oct 2009
But then you went ahead and began to define your "candidates" by (at least partially) skill level - not just needs.

I agree that both skill level and needs are both criteria for which OS a person might chose I do not think you should lump all together.

You imply (no actually state) that a person utilizes their computer only as much as their skills allow. This is not true. I have spent 30+ years in the business and have dealt with users of all levels. I must question how much actual exposure you have had to a large group of people who work outside the IT world. Because it seems very limited to me.

Your points were well made but completely lost all credibility when you tried to define your groups with such obvious disdain for any skill set they may have.

Or perhaps you were just trying to be cute with your descriptions - either way you failed.
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Its just that simple!!
Stan57 12th Oct 2009
Are you really that stupid to think the normal commentators are not going to turn this into yet another them vs US argument. You should know that the Normal user will never update his/her computer on there own. They will buy computers at best buy or whatever store they normally buy electronics from.
They could care less about linux or even windows for that matter. Its just that simple!!
what is your point?
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In a nutshell...
storm14k 12th Oct 2009
...he did. You just don't want to admit it. No matter how he described the groups it still breaks out the same way. The only group with a problem are the ones that know just enough to be dangerous. They dabble in things that they don't know much about. Everybody else either doesn't do enough to run into problems or actually knows what they are doing.

What some people try to do is take the problems of the one group that probably wouldn't make a good fit for Linux and apply that across the board. However most people are doing any formatting in Office that doesn't translate to OOo or vice versa. Only the "dangerous" group knows enough to use Itunes but have no clue to alternatives. The rest either don't buy music online or know about alternatives like Amazon. The low end doesn't know what Photoshop is. The high end knows they don't do anything with Photoshop that they couldn't do with Gimp. The middle only knows how to use Photoshop without any understanding of what they are doing and how to do it with any other package proprietary or not. The majority don't have all these Windows only apps either as I've noted before. Its only the dangerous crew that goes to Best Buy and shells out money for garbage. The low end has no clue and the high end probably knows of other ways to get the same thing done while saving money.

Now the professional in any field should look at what they use and need and decide accordingly. But the majority of average users excluding the group discussed pretty much has no reason that they couldn't switch if they wanted to. If they don't want to thats fine. But the idea that they CAN'T is just pure FUD.
I don't think Jason is a snob.
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The real "dangerous" users...
bswiss 13th Oct 2009
... are the "perpetual dangerous users".

You know, the ones who aren't able -- or aren't willing -- to read and follow directions, and find it unreasonable that doing more sophisticated things might require a little learning, and maybe even a little actual thinking.

Of course, the general public is continually spoon-fed a marketing regime that encourages such a "barbarian user" approach and "magical technology" fantasies.
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Defining what "is" is?
LazLong 12th Oct 2009
And I don't even care or agree with Jason's
But at Least you are here to correct things with your particular POV.
"..in order to fit users to Linux." How typical, the same dogmatic, myopic,
(even if pragmatic at times) "the path of least resistance" perspective.
yes, yes, MS & Windows is the center to your universe.

Anyway in a earlier post I had said:
(and this is just a basic/simple two dimensional model, and there are even more detailed 2d/3d onion skins)

I see users divided in three (overlapping) groups;
And at the ends of the spectrum.

-Casual/general users, they use what is available and generally Know no better, equally greek or geek to them. (all the same to them)

-IT professionals & enthusiasts, those who have awareness and/or understanding of the concepts & fundementals, all the same 1's & 0's. (all the same to them)

And then there is that that middle group "The Power Users" those that know........ or at least think they know computers & IT, but really only familiar with Windows or their particular set of apps & tools.

Nothing bad/wrong about any catagory and they do overlap quite a bit.
At least IMHO............

http://talkback.zdnet.com/5208-17924-0.html?forumID=1&threadID=70235&messageID=1347543

I would also add

That the largest group most probably is the first (at least in terms of a marketing demographic) what is percieved as the lowest common denominator. Or Average/Joe Sixpack (consumers) (at least by Corp sales, Marketing, etc) But who really is Average? And if made aware or just available with parity, it (Linux) is and they are good if not great candidates. Consider Tivo, TomTom, Phones, Google etc.

At the other end of the spectrum, which may be the smaller/smallest group (in marketing (influence) terms) but are the movers & shakers, first adopters, etc. and help shape things...... Whether or not they are marketable. (at that current time)

I have to go...... I will poost later about the middle? Maybe?



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Get Off My Lawn!! ...damn kids...
dave.leigh@... 12th Oct 2009
I'm still workin', but I've been around a long time as well, and I know exactly what you're talking about.

I think you're being a bit oversensitive, though. Jason's "techie" label would clearly include "hobbyist," which is the most concise description I know for someone with skills for which they do not have a practical application. To put it bluntly... you. So you're excluded already.

That's not a slight against you, either. A hobbyist has no need to justify his purchases, wants, or preferences to anybody. "I just want it, dammit" is quite good enough.

My mom, who died last year, was an excellent candidate for Linux except for two things... 1. Greeting Cards. She loved designing and printing her own, and Broderbund has some of the easiest and most comprehensive software for that on Windows; and 2. her sewing machine included a digital interface. She could take graphics she had drawn on the computer, do a color separation, build a data file for the sewing machine, and have the machine do embroidery for her. The software was Windows-only. Of course she was retired, so why did she buy that?

Because she wanted it, dammit.
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