ie8 fix
Click Here
madison

Greenpeace Cool IT: But does GP miss the point?

By | May 28, 2009, 1:07pm PDT

Summary: Greenpeace upped the ante on the IT sector by switching focus from reporting on the environmental performance of consumer electronics to looking at how the industry as a whole is performing on climate change. Yesterday they launched their inaugural Cool IT ranking of the top 12 IT firms performing on climate change. The ranking is weighted as follows: 50% for solutions [...]

Greenpeace upped the ante on the IT sector by switching focus from reporting on the environmental performance of consumer electronics to looking at how the industry as a whole is performing on climate change. Yesterday they launched their inaugural Cool IT ranking of the top 12 IT firms performing on climate change. The ranking is weighted as follows: 50% for solutions provided to enable the economy to reduce emissions, 35% for political support of emissions reduction and 15% for corporate performance.

And here is the ‘Leader Board’ for the current Greenpeace Cool IT review:

I agree wholeheartedly with Greenpeace’s focus on solutions and as readers will know from this previous post, I also believe leadership in the public policy arena is important. But we should not under estimate the difficulty the industry faces in confronting some of its best customers across the political lobby:

The IT industry must, therefore, push back against the lobbying of powerful industry sectors such as coal and transport who are heavily lobbying for a weak deal.

None the less, such corporate activism may very well be the mark of a new breed of corporate sustainability leadership with corporations increasingly taking strong political positions, even across industry sectoral lines, to support sustainability public policy.

But there are some troubling aspects of the GP methodology and assumptions made:

We first looked at the biggest global IT and technology companies, then, because we are looking for the most progressive leaders, we focused on those who have already made environmental or climate leadership promises. We then selected a majority of companies from Japan and the US because both countries need to improve their current 2020 greenhouse gas emission reduction targets and their overall negotiating positions in the Kyoto talks.

Fine to select the biggest companies but to focus on companies that are based in the US and Japan only because of the current weakness in domestic environmental legislation is a nonsense. Does the ‘Leader Board’ reflect a rating of industry performance or a prioritization of Greenpeace campaigning activity? It suggests that GP’s main focus here is less on enouraging IT innovation and more on leveraging the political influence of these firms in the short run. Such a narrow tactical aim could very well back fire on Greenpeace and undermine the veracity of this index in time.

And what of the contribution of the IT industry in Europe, India & China? The contribution IT can make particularly in developing economies is immense. Such markets have the dual problem of needing to grow fast to lift people out of poverty whilst facing great political pressure from the West to curb CO2 emissions. They operate at fairly low levels of resource efficiency so IT enablement of rapid improvement can help ease political pressures and deliver global reductions in CO2 more quickly.

And when it comes to industry prioritization, unfortunately, Greenpeace seems to send conflicting messages. On the one hand:

Because of the range of solutions that companies are or could be involved in we also ensured we chose a range of companies to cover all parts (hardware, software and services), and those that make components that other companies and industries use for climate solution technology.

But on the other hand, the list of firms GP actually reviewed and ranked largely ignores the enterprise software market and instead focuses on consumer brand names, services, hardware and devices.  Nor is the role of systems integrators considered. It is this limited focus that slightly jars with Greenpeace’s own vision of what IT should enable:

IT solutions provide a key element of the solutions the world needs as outlined in our Energy Revolution blueprint. For example, to have a large increase in renewable energy use new smart grids are needed in developed countries and need to be built in developing countries. IT is vital for smart power grids. To achieve large energy efficiency gains the production, transportation and building will need to be made drastically more efficient, all of which can be achieved with the help of IT solutions.

Lofty IT goals indeed but its hard to see how they can be realised without the engagement of major enterprise software players.

On the whole, I am thrilled to see Greenpeace start down this road. The landscape is cluttered with faux industry rankings mostly rolled out as a marketing gimmick. With this index, even if imperfect, the direction and motivation is spot on.

Update: Response from Greenpeace (thanks Tom):

Hi James,

Here’s a short response from Greenpeace. We started this project with a group of companies who had already claimed to be leading on climate change issues. As our work moves forward we will be looking at additional companies who have the potential to show leadership in this area measured against our criteria.

The challenge is open to all large players in this field and we aim to identify further leading companies in upcoming editions from different types of companies and also in different areas.

For example we are also starting this work in India:

http://www.greenpeace.org/india/press/releases/ict-sector-slow-climate-leadership

Tom Dowdall
Greenpeace International

Kick off your day with ZDNet's daily e-mail newsletter. It's the freshest tech news and opinion, served hot. Get it.

Topics

James has more than 15 years of experience working on corporate sustainability issues from both the corporate and NGO campaigning perspective.

Disclosure

James Farrar

The most important and material disclosure is of my employment with SAP. During the course of my job I come into regular contact with SAP stakeholders of all kinds including NGOs, customers, government representatives, customers, partners. I will draw from my daily experience in my writing but I will try to make sure I fully disclose any material relationship I might have as an employee of SAP with the subject matter of my writing to the best of my ability. My goal is to raise awareness of sustainable development issues across the tech sector in an objective and fair way. Any opinions expressed in this blog are entirely my own and not those of my employer or anyone else for that matter. I have no significant financial investments in any other tech companies. You may find my personal blog at www.jamesfarrar.wordpress.com

Biography

James Farrar

James has more than 15 years of experience working on corporate sustainability issues from both the corporate and NGO campaigning perspective. He has worked directly within the banking (Farm Credit System), aviation (British Airways) and IT (SAP) sectors in the USA and Europe. His campaigning experience includes work at Amnesty International's business engagement programme and at Global Witness, a leading NGO campaigning on the issue of resource revenue transparency especially relating to so called 'conflict resources'.

James's day job is at SAP working within the Sustainability team. You can view James' extended profile on Linkedin and you can follow him on Twitter.
80
Comments

Join the conversation!

Just In

RE: Greenpeace Cool IT: But does GP miss the point?
gaberdiye03 Updated - 21st Jun
@Christian_You should be interested not in consensus (which does not in fact exist on this topic), but science. True, the science can be difficult, but at a minimum you should hold scientists (on both sides) to a higher rigor than pembe maske energy balance oyna oyunu moliva orjin krem tutune son nanomatik complex 41 new fx15 simply treating them as the holy ones. Its human nature for someone, including scientists, to slack off if they are off the hook. There is plenty of room for bias in science, and challenging that bias should be the role of media and public. One source of bias is that those who get paid to research this topic as a problem get funded, while those on the opposite side do not, nor are they hired by academia, not because of the quality of their research but because they are on the wrong side of opinion. Even scientists who know their stuff can be myopic. A study of scientists found them biased against papers written by names that were female. You don't think this bias is felt in other ways? Consensus is bunk. Science is what matters.
0 Votes
+ -
Re: But does GP miss the point?
rikasa Updated - 28th May 2009
I for one believe we have a responsibility to be 'good stewards' of the planet, but the amount of suspect science and unbridled emotionalism that has surfaced regarding the supposed 'green house' effect tells me that GP may miss the point in far more ways than one (ok - granted they do get some things right):

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=288952680655100870

http://www.globalwarminglies.com/

re: unbridled emotionalism
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXQq78lvKrU

I guess my most pressing concern is the claim raised by environmentalists that the increase in C02 has pulled up temperatures when all data to date seems to point the to the exact contrary. Don't get me wrong - I wanna believe that we can make a difference in terms of protecting the environment by improving the way we live our everyday lives, but I just don't want those efforts to be futile by means of 'misleading' science. Who' right? Anyone got any balanced info on this?
0 Votes
+ -
Talk about missing a point
Roger Ramjet Updated - 29th May 2009
That globalwarminglies website is very misleading. Some sentences are statements without fact - while other "facts" seem to measure 1 thing while ignoring others. I've read things like extra Co2 tends to make water more acidic - and that can hurt the root systems of plants i.e. a new "acid" rain. With ice shelves the size of Rhode Island breaking apart and mountain glaciers retreating - how can anyone not believe the Earth is warming (uncontrollably)?

Q1: Do you accept that models and data from 20 years ago is on-par with what is available today?
Q2: Did you know that Co2 levels were ONLY 2-3x higher during the reign of the dinosaurs (when the Earth was *very* warm)?
Q3: Are you really unaffected by *wacko* enviroloonies - so that you can make your own well-thought-out decision (even if it agrees with them)? Can you agree with Al Gore?

GCC is as true as I am writing this. There should be no doubt at all that the Earth is warming. This is Step 1.

Step 2 is whether MAN is responsible. There can still be a healthy debate on this - as long as you accept Step 1. Step 3 is what to do about it.
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
Missing point
jamesfarrar.1@... 29th May 2009
I agree --- I have to accept the consensus of the scientific community.
0 Votes
+ -
Consensus is useless
pranavb99@... 5th Jun 2009
You should be interested not in consensus (which does not in fact exist on this topic), but science. True, the science can be difficult, but at a minimum you should hold scientists (on both sides) to a higher rigor than simply treating them as the holy ones. Its human nature for someone, including scientists, to slack off if they are off the hook. There is plenty of room for bias in science, and challenging that bias should be the role of media and public. One source of bias is that those who get paid to research this topic as a problem get funded, while those on the opposite side do not, nor are they hired by academia, not because of the quality of their research but because they are on the wrong side of opinion. Even scientists who know their stuff can be myopic. A study of scientists found them biased against papers written by names that were female. You don't think this bias is felt in other ways? Consensus is bunk. Science is what matters.
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
Consensus
jamesfarrar.1@... 6th Jun 2009
Lets be clear we need consensus on the course of action we need to take and not endlessly navel gaze the science. You make fair points about challenging the scientific study. But I can't help but this is often a bit of a political smoke screen. obfuscation for flat earthers who politically cannot accept the problem and so revert to undermining the science. But I'm sure Newton, Einstein, Copernicus etc. faced the same thing in their time.
0 Votes
+ -
But
rikasa Updated - 29th May 2009
did you watch my video link - if not; give it a go. I'm not saying we should just swing over to their side, but at least give some attention to the example of a scientist resigning from the IPCC in disgust at the handling of their findings that questioned global warming theory. By being attached to the UN, the IPCC is inherently political. I'm sorry, but that's how many people feel about the UN. And regarding Al Gore; he missed the fact that C02 increases (which have in fact seen significant upward fluctuations in the distant past) occurred several hundreds of years after similar historic increases in temperature; i.e. temperature drives C02... maybe the sun controls our weather? Maybe that's what we should be looking at.
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
But
jamesfarrar.1@... 29th May 2009
Yes I'll watch the video linked ... but quite honestly climate change denial was not the subject of this post. The Greenpeace ranking is the issue at hand.
0 Votes
+ -
Very sorry for digressing!
rikasa Updated - 29th May 2009
But thanks for interest in the video. I was just concerned that when an environmental organization takes some of the IT giants for whom many of the visitors to ZDNet work for to task, one would hope they'd boast exemplary credentials and base their assessment criteria on sound scientific principles.
0 Votes
+ -
RE: Talk about missing a point
branchman67 29th May 2009
I for one don't subscribe to the theory that we are the sole or even main cause of global warming (and indications are we will be in a slight cooling period for the next couple decades). However, of all people, I thought Penn Gillete (the magician) has the most salient point on how to approach the issue. You have to take it in the following stages:

1) Is the earth warming?
2) If yes to 1, are we responsible?
3) If yes to 2, can we stop it (He made the analogy that you can push a car down a hill, doesn't mean you can stop it)?
4) If we can stop it, do we want to (is that the best choice, does it compromise other qualities of life)?
5) If we can stop it, and do want to stop it, is conservation the right answer?
6) Finally, if global warming is happening, we want to stop it, and conservation is the right answer, is government policy the best way to do it?

Unfortunately, groups like Greenpeace ignore this thought flow and skip right to trying to pass legislation without addressing the conflicting viewpoints on global warming. The truth is, groups like Greenpeace aren't about saving the planet, they are about controlling people and curtailing freedoms through activism. I know this is slightly off topic, but I take everything a group like Greenpeace does with a ton of salt, not a grain, because they often have other agendas.
0 Votes
+ -
All good points
Roger Ramjet 29th May 2009
But when the fire alarm is ringing - do you have time to figure out where the fire is, how it started, how much water do we need to put it out, etc.

The thing missing from your post is URGENCY. It is probably too late to reverse GCC (in our or our children's lifetime). You have one choice - be like Nero or not . . .
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
how much?
jamesfarrar.1@... 30th May 2009
we have data from the Stern report on costs and timings. Scientists say we need to stabilize at 500 part per million
0 Votes
+ -
Re: All good points
seamountie 1st Jun 2009
Actually, to use your analogy, and behave like the IPCC, you smell smoke so run through the crowded theater yelling "FIRE".

If you hear a fire alarm, the first thing you do is determine if there IS a fire, then, if there is, what do you do about it. Fight it (it may be a simple frying pan in the kitchen fire), and if you can't, what is the smartest way out.

To panic, or as Heinlein said "When in danger or in doubt, run in circles scream and shout" is just begging to get toasted.

Even when you hear a fire alarm you should analyze - just not for too long!
0 Votes
+ -
RE: Greenpeace Cool IT: But does GP miss the point?
edward polling Updated - 3rd Jul
To achieve large energy efficiency gains the production, transportation and building will need to be made drastically more efficient, all of which can be achieved with the help of IT education news and solutions. k l
0 Votes
+ -
I can't believe how sheeple follow this like a cult, don't drive, don't use A/C, don't eat meat all from a LIE called 'climate change' errr... I mean global warming.

You want the truth, the earth is COOLING!


Communist Lenin a mentor for Obama, 'a lie told enough becomes the truth'...

And idiots follow this trash, the *DATA* is not valid I don't see Al Gore giving up 25,000 square feet mansions, Obama owns a 380HP Dodge Charger HYPOCRITE!

LIES

LIES

LIES

Idiots who tell *ME* I need to do without, I don't see anyone giving up A/C now do we.

If you so are worried about this LIE, then buy your Yugo, sell your house, move into a government Obamatron community where you are only allowed to eat 2 meals a day (NO meat because cows pass gas) and you have your 'gas' captured by the 'toot catcher'....


Obama = United Socialist States of Obama

Get ready for economic destruction, inflation in the double digits and UNEMPLOYMENT!

GM & Chrysler = HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF JOBS GONE

GOOD LUCK OBAMATRONS ENJOY TAXES INFLATION
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
I can tell you feel strongly but ....
jamesfarrar.1@... 30th May 2009
this post is just about the Greenpeace campaign. Point taken but won't be able to unpack this debate on every post. I respect your opinion and your decision to reject the science on this.

0 Votes
+ -
*NOT* based on Science
Christian_<>< 31st May 2009
This is a religion of putting a strangle hold on everything.


I am not sure what 'Koolaid' this movement is drinking but I would like to know how people are going to work to eat when they want to spew this lie of saying 'carbon' is destroying the planet.

Carbon is the building block for everything on this earth, I find it amusing how they are going to capture something and companies are raking in BILLIONS off of this.

But wait, Obama is running the Printing presses wide open devaluing the dollar, but don't worry he is going to tax electricity, fuel and now the Internet.

Nothing like 'Jimmy Carter' CHANGE with Inflation, unemployment and telling people to do without.

We manufacture nothing, and we are going to service what when there is nothing left to 'service'.

Good grief I have heard enough of this psycho environmnetalist who use A/C, computers, drink from plastic bottles and drive cars.

A bunch of Hypocrites.
0 Votes
+ -
You must have a hunch?
Intellihence 31st May 2009
Is there something you should be telling us ?

MY WORLD, not balmer's.--- perhaps bad spelling, but I'm wishing to recall.

"IN a world without walls & fences, who needs windows & gates!?"

REMEMVER! It's my fence

OVER & OUT !
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
message
jamesfarrar.1@... 31st May 2009
I think there is a message here somewhere
0 Votes
+ -
@Christian_You should be interested not in consensus (which does not in fact exist on this topic), but science. True, the science can be difficult, but at a minimum you should hold scientists (on both sides) to a higher rigor than pembe maske energy balance oyna oyunu moliva orjin krem tutune son nanomatik complex 41 new fx15 simply treating them as the holy ones. Its human nature for someone, including scientists, to slack off if they are off the hook. There is plenty of room for bias in science, and challenging that bias should be the role of media and public. One source of bias is that those who get paid to research this topic as a problem get funded, while those on the opposite side do not, nor are they hired by academia, not because of the quality of their research but because they are on the wrong side of opinion. Even scientists who know their stuff can be myopic. A study of scientists found them biased against papers written by names that were female. You don't think this bias is felt in other ways? Consensus is bunk. Science is what matters.
0 Votes
+ -
RE: Greenpeace Cool IT: But does GP miss the point?
zakkiromi Updated - 9th May 2011
The contribution IT can make particularly in developing economies is immense. Such markets have the dual problem of needing to grow fast to lift people out of poverty whilst facing great political pressure from the West to curb CO2 emissions. k
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
RE: Greenpeace Cool IT: But does GP miss the point?
jamesfarrar.1@... 29th May 2009
The opinion of the UN Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change backed by the endorsement of nearly all national scientific academies is good enough for me. Sure we can argue the models etc but I think we have to follow the precautionary principle here. Besides -- what is the cost? The benefit it a cleaner environment, energy diversification, reduced operating costs and unleashing of a new wave of innovation.
0 Votes
+ -
RE: Benefits
branchman67 29th May 2009
Diversity of energy isn't automatically a benefit. If it costs 3 to 5 times as much to heat and power my house, that's a bad thing, and right now there is no alternative energy that can compete with fossil fuels except nuclear power, and the Greens HATE nuclear energy (despite the only emissions being water vapor and small amounts of nuclear waste that need to be stored). Also, bear in mind that things like this cap and trade scam that will drive up energy costs disproportionately affect the poor. Al Gore can still afford to fuel up his private jet, but poor people won't be able to put gas in their car to get to work. Energy diversity is only good if you have CHEAP energy diversity.
0 Votes
+ -
Nuclear costs
Roger Ramjet 29th May 2009
[...the only emissions being water vapor and small amounts of nuclear waste that need to be stored]

Take a look at these websites and tell me how "clean" nuclear energy is.

http://www.physics.isu.edu/radinf/chrono4.htm
http://www.lutins.org/nukes.html#bombs
0 Votes
+ -
now show us
coffeeshark 30th May 2009
Now show us the number of deaths from radiation accidents at nuclear power plants, versus the number of deaths in coal and oil recovery and refinement.

France has been running on nuclear power for decades without serious incidents (involving deaths of non-nuke workers). The majority of the accidents noted by activists are from pre-1980 reactors or old designs like Chernobyl's.

it's too bad the idiots in power watched an old movie with Jane Fonda and think that it's a documentary.

Your link concerning events with nuclear bombs is irrelevant.
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
nuclear
jamesfarrar.1@... 31st May 2009
we may have to seriously consider it but we would need to start building up the infrastructure which takes years
0 Votes
+ -
Hi James,

Here's a short response from Greenpeace. We started this project with a group of companies who had already claimed to be leading on climate change issues. As our work moves forward we will be looking at additional companies who have the potential to show leadership in this area measured against our criteria.

The challenge is open to all large players in this field and we aim to identify further leading companies in upcoming editions from different types of companies and also in different areas.

For example we are also starting this work in India:

http://www.greenpeace.org/india/press/releases/ict-sector-slow-climate-leadership

Tom Dowdall
Greenpeace International
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
Greenpeace Response
jamesfarrar.1@... 29th May 2009
Tom -- thank you for taking the time to respond. I have posted your comments into the body of the blog post as an update. many thanks
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
RE: Greenpeace Cool IT: But does GP miss the point?
jamesfarrar.1@... 29th May 2009
Thats true -- I agree we need to make decisions 100% based on fact and we certainly need to improve understanding of the climatology. On the other hand at some point we must also , as a society, accept scientific consensus and move forward w policy decisions. I think Greenpeace are firmly in the policy arena with this initiativeand indeed w COP15 coming up ... that is where the action is. Point taken though on , always, the need for better and better scientific understanding and supporting data.
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
RE: Greenpeace Cool IT: But does GP miss the point?
jamesfarrar.1@... 29th May 2009
But those decisions about response and adaptation are already in full discourse in the public policy arean and have been for quite some time. Greenpeace, as I'm sure you know, doesn't enact legislation, they are a pressure group not a government agency. They certainly do have an agenda and as a pressure group it is almost certainly by default imbalanced as it represents an often marginal view. The role Greenpeace and other NGOs often play, however, is to drive a sea change on public opinion and perception. In so doing they win friends and make enemies. par for the course. They also keep our society vibrant by catalsysing and mobilising change and reform. But at the end of teh day - they have no governmental power which is why they are called NGO's (non governmental organisations). They live an die based on the strength and appeal of their ideas. I'm sure many of their camapigning efforts fall on stony ground. But many good ideas go forward to shape society for the better. Its an important and positive role they play.
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
RE: Greenpeace Cool IT: But does GP miss the point?
jamesfarrar.1@... 29th May 2009
In terms of benefit -- I am also talking about the political benefits of energy security and independence and this is absolutely a policy goal of many countries.

I don't see how adding additional and alternative fuel sources to the mix in and of itself adds cost. The cost is added, I admit, if we internalize the full and true cost of global warming to the purchase price of hydro carbon based fuels. I'd argue that we have no choice but to hace those costs. The sooner we can innovate and scale alternative sources the better off we all will be. And lests not forget - a laissez faire policy doesnt mean cheap energy, we will inevitably see oil prices rise again as we approach peak oil and the global economy livens up.

As for nuclear -- not all greens hate nuclear.

0 Votes
+ -
..."Public Climate Speech" and "Political Advocacy".
It seems that it's almost more important to "appear
"correct than to actually be correct.
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
Greenwashing?
jamesfarrar.1@... 29th May 2009
Excellent point. Is Greenpeace unwittingly inciting a certain level of PR and greenwashing? Of course its up to the firm to remain disciplined and its actions will always speak louder than words. But as I said in the post -- the index does seem to rather have a bias for political action over IT innovation. I think in time GP will come to see that imbalance as a mistake.
...you participate as part of their propaganda
machine. Personally, I'd avoid companies that get co-
oped like that.
0 Votes
+ -
I think you'll find that
rikasa 29th May 2009
most IT companies excelling in the 'Green Realm' know full well that their endeavours to fall in line with GP's brand of political correctness will do next to nothing in terms of improving the environment. It's just that most people have been duped into believing any greenie rhetoric and therefore subscribing to this is another way to keep the shareholders happy and engender growth. Don't get me wrong. When environmentalists raise alarms over fish going belly-up in a chemical soup reservoir that once was a river, then they are fulfilling their real calling and should have support from all quarters in combating this:

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/44122000/jpg/_44122867_china_tai_ap.jpg&imgrefurl=http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7000336.stm

I think the most environmental friendly thing IT companies or any company can do is try to ensure that their hardware purchases are not sourced from companies responsible for the carnage as seen in the above link, rather than focus on how 'friendly' their solutions are once set-up. Environmental groups could then focus their energies on the admirable pursuit of providing information on responsible hardware makers to companies.
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
Disagree
jamesfarrar.1@... 29th May 2009
Sorry but I disagree here. I see it the other way round. All IT firms should source responsibly. That is the very minimum they can do.

Flexing the business model to shape markets and the industry to meet a global challenge of climate change is something of an entirely different order and calling.
0 Votes
+ -
I agree
rikasa 29th May 2009
with you that all firms should source responsibly and I am certain that not doing this is potentially the most damaging lapse. I am just saying that environmental groups could ensure that firms do a far better job at achieving this by becoming a conduit of information on responsible sourcing. Companies are under enough pressure already to identify and pursue core competencies let alone do the environment the justice it deserves in terms of finding responsible hardware vendors. Therefore, the providence of responsible hardware vendor information would go much further toward improving the environment than focusing on the efficiencies a given IT solution boasts once it is set up.
0 Votes
+ -
But I think that is my point
JohnMcGrew@... 29th May 2009
Greenpeace wishes to score companies based upon
PR and "activism", where I think it's more
important to actually do something. "Activism"
is just another way of saying that they wish to
to enlist their aid in forcing other people to
act as they wish, as opposed to actually acting
themselves.
0 Votes
+ -
Nice point
rikasa 29th May 2009
NT
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
your point
jamesfarrar.1@... 29th May 2009
your point was that to be green GP think you must be part of their 'propaganda'. Fact is 65% of the rating is for solutions and corporate performance. There is no question of anyone joining GP's platform -- there are plents of industry initiatives to chose from: US CAP, BICEP, 3C, European Climate Leaders Forum etc. etc.

I know what your point us but let us not kid ourselves that these large corporations are gullible, hapless sheep to do the bidding of GP. Businesses will make up their own minds for the right reasons and do the right thing.
0 Votes
+ -
...the public and the politicians that hold
regulatory power over them want to hear.
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
what buisnesses do?
jamesfarrar.1@... 30th May 2009
and their shareholders, customers, employees? No influence? Lets be realistic -- these are the primary stakeholder drivers
0 Votes
+ -
Some see it as a move for survival...
JohnMcGrew@... Updated - 1st Jun 2009
...as well as a way to quash competition:

http://townhall.com/columnists/TomBorelli/2009/0
5/30/obamas_corporatism_strategy_might_advance_c
ap-and-trade?page=1

0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
RE: Greenpeace Cool IT: But does GP miss the point?
jamesfarrar.1@... 29th May 2009
Well no thats not true ....... 50% for solutions, 15% for corporate performance and 35% for political advocacy. I don't actually think firms as large and as sophisticated as these are very likely to get co opted by any organisation much less GP. GP would argue that a stable climate is good for all business. The process of stabilizing can be good for the IT business. Besides governments cannot do this alone -- civil society and private sector will need to activate. Maybe another way to look at it is GP is seeing who is sitting on the fence.
That said I still say GP have got the rating out of balance.
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
But you don't get to chose....
jamesfarrar.1@... 29th May 2009
Nice idea but you and I dont get to chose where GP or any other environmental NGO place their attention - that is their call. And any way its not an either or situation. there are already NGO's such as SAI who have provided an ethical supply chain standard SA8000. So it is happening - just that not all NGOs aee the same and do the same thing.

I disagree on the issue of solutions and market scaleability. There is a market in climate change abatement and that market will be served by innovative IT companies drawing on their core competencies.
0 Votes
+ -
This is BAD
Jantje van Leiden Updated - 30th May 2009
So Greenpeace is a sort of new INQUISITION: they put you on the steak if you do not speak their speak.
0 Votes
+ -
Insanity at its best
Christian_<>< 30th May 2009
More Obamatrons pushing his socialist agendas.

Wake me up in 2012...
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
slogans don't .,,,,
jamesfarrar.1@... 30th May 2009
slogans like 'obamatron' don't forward the debate. Think of something to say and come back and comment.
0 Votes
+ -
Wake you up in 2012
John L. Ries 30th May 2009
Would be happy to, but if everyone that thought like you did that, you would have no influence over public policy at all and your side would certainly lose the 2010 Congressional elections and would probably lose the 2012 Presidential election as well (or even worse, the wrong sort of Republican might win).

You could try reasoning with some of those poor deluded "socialists" (you do know some, don't you?). It's not like demonizing them has changed many minds over the past century. Besides, if you fall asleep until 2012, how is the Conservative talk radio industry going to sustain itself over the next 4 years?
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
talkbacks
jamesfarrar.1@... 30th May 2009
John -- thanks for stopping by
0 Votes
+ -
Contributr
Inquisition
jamesfarrar.1@... 30th May 2009
... I share some concern here also. Its not possible for the private sector to stay out of teh public debate but ranking and rating of political contribution like this -- as I said in the post ... could backfire on GP

Join the conversation!

Formatting +
BB Codes - Note: HTML is not supported in forums
  • [b] Bold [/b]
  • [i] Italic [/i]
  • [u] Underline [/u]
  • [s] Strikethrough [/s]
  • [q] "Quote" [/q]
  • [ol][*] 1. Ordered List [/ol]
  • [ul][*] · Unordered List [/ul]
  • [pre] Preformat [/pre]
  • [quote] "Blockquote" [/quote]
ie8 fix
Click Here
ie8 fix

The best of ZDNet, delivered

ZDNet Newsletters

Get the best of ZDNet delivered straight to your inbox

Facebook Activity

White Papers, Webcasts, & Resources
ie8 fix
ie8 fix