Oracle giving EU a hard time over Sun buy
Summary
Oracle is taking a hard line in dealing with EU objections to its planned acquisition of Sun, according to a Financial Times report on Tuesday.
Topics
Oracle is taking a hard line in dealing with EU objections to its planned acquisition of Sun, according to a Financial Times report on Tuesday.
EU antitrust regulators are concerned that Oracle, which has a large business in proprietary software, will not be a good home for Sun's open-source MySQL database business. According to the report, Oracle is unyielding, offering no concessions to deal with the European Commission's concerns.
That stance could lead the regulators to issue a formal complaint objecting to the deal, and that move could occur within days, according unnamed sources in the story. Neither the EU or Oracle commented for the story.
For more, read "Oracle not yielding to EU with Sun buy, says report" on CNET News.
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This is how you deal w/ evil socialists. If only every other US corp could follow the same route.
why EU can stop or affect a deal inside usa ..... or is the deal is global ....
Also we EU dont fork MYSQL into something purely EU ... and tell Oracle to go to hell. If the main concern is MYSQL ...Under GLP they can fork it ....
Also EU should no be able to affect stuff in a other sovereign country ( i know if its good for one its good for the other )
Also we EU dont fork MYSQL into something purely EU ... and tell Oracle to go to hell. If the main concern is MYSQL ...Under GLP they can fork it ....
Also EU should no be able to affect stuff in a other sovereign country ( i know if its good for one its good for the other )
With globalization, companies are bound by the laws of the jurisdictions in which they operate. The EU has taken the lead in anti-competitive investigations since the US abandoned that role during W's administration.
clean my monitor after reading that one. I really shouldn't drink coffee while reading your posts.
funny too, then saw who posted, and "it" was serious.
Who let this crazed extremist member of the cult of Stallman out of "l'asile du pingouin" aggain?
PS: The only compagny that EU wont toutch is EU compagnies and Apple, the rest including compagnies that deals in FLOSS are freegame.
PS: The only compagny that EU wont toutch is EU compagnies and Apple, the rest including compagnies that deals in FLOSS are freegame.
they gave $1B to IBM for the Windows vs. OS/2 actions... and they gave Sun $1B for the MS office vs. Open Office. They fined Intel $1.45 B for anti-trust.... this year...
They are treating Oracle the same way... keeping them from being monopolistic.
and FYI... they are currently investigating IBM on mainframes, too...
They are treating Oracle the same way... keeping them from being monopolistic.
and FYI... they are currently investigating IBM on mainframes, too...
I don't think so. It's been an extremely successful 'project' so far. By now it has a bigger GDP and a bigger population than the USA GDP and population. And they will grow even further - by including the remaining eastern European states, and possibly even Turkey. I'd say Europe is doing quite well.
The financial crisis was a USA thing btw. loan loan loan loan loan ....--> crash.
The financial crisis was a USA thing btw. loan loan loan loan loan ....--> crash.
And they can defend themselves and we no longer need to support their lazy a**s? Excellent!
Go back to your Vista.
Because you have been spanked!
It's called being the wiser party. Sometimes the best thing to do is not to discuss things with fools.
Like... in this case
Like... in this case
Open source doesn't mean open range - Sun owns the copyright for _all_ of its OSS products:
- OpenOffice
- MySQL
- Java
Meaning that there is NO WAY one can get MySQL's code, branch it, and distribute it under anything else than GPLv2 or later.
Which is very bad for MySQL, since a lot of the development was found from a proprietary version of that code base sold to clients with a support contract. Moreover, MySQL can use binary database engines that can be distributed and used along with the proprietary version, but that the GPLv2+ explicitly prevents linking against - as such, if Oracle takes ownership of MySQL, these proprietary branches are effectively closed, people can't get them any more, they need to buy Oracle's product instead, and they no longer have the option of reverting back to the Free software version.
Effectively locking down the market.
One of the things Oracle could do, would be create a foundation, give stewardship for these projects' copyrights to this foundation, and be done with it. But they won't, since one of their goals in buying Sun off, is squash down one of their main competitors.
Thus the investigation. That it didn't take place in the US is disgraceful, in fact.
- OpenOffice
- MySQL
- Java
Meaning that there is NO WAY one can get MySQL's code, branch it, and distribute it under anything else than GPLv2 or later.
Which is very bad for MySQL, since a lot of the development was found from a proprietary version of that code base sold to clients with a support contract. Moreover, MySQL can use binary database engines that can be distributed and used along with the proprietary version, but that the GPLv2+ explicitly prevents linking against - as such, if Oracle takes ownership of MySQL, these proprietary branches are effectively closed, people can't get them any more, they need to buy Oracle's product instead, and they no longer have the option of reverting back to the Free software version.
Effectively locking down the market.
One of the things Oracle could do, would be create a foundation, give stewardship for these projects' copyrights to this foundation, and be done with it. But they won't, since one of their goals in buying Sun off, is squash down one of their main competitors.
Thus the investigation. That it didn't take place in the US is disgraceful, in fact.
The US has been notoriously bad about dealing properly with anti-trust and monopolistic business practices because it allowed lobbyists to have as much if not more say than the constituents the congressmen supposedly represent in determining law. It is how the credit card companies managed to get time to raise their rates before being capped in February and how insurance companies have held up health care reform. I am American and I am equally ashamed.
Isn't MySQL in Oracle's case comparable to Eclipse in IBM's case. Couldn't Oracle just release MySQL very much like IBM did with Eclipse?
The EU will only become a stronger competitor to the US as time goes on. That's a reality. Because of Globilization they have the ability to dictate to companies that want to have access to their markets. The UE killed a merger deal that GE was working on. It seemed like a done deal but the EO killed it. The CEO waid he did everything that the US regulators asked him to do, why was that no OK? The EU responsed that they see antitrust diffently and the size and reach of GE they felt would choke out competition. There biggest issue with GE was sheer size. The US isn't concerned with Mega-corporations, but the Europeans don't like it. So in the case of the GE, even though both companies were United States based, the deal died because the CEO of GE knew that if he couldn't access the European Markets (which is significant), there was no point. And that is why this is an issue for Oracle, and this is likely the face of things to come.
The principle if European bureaucrats in Brussels is: IF IT MOVES, REGULATE IT!!!
I am not exactly sure what their concern is. The founder of MySQL created another company and they offer the database for free.
I am not exactly sure what their concern is. The founder of MySQL created another company and they offer the database for free.
It's too bad that Sun/Oracle can't just pull out of the European market. If more companies did this, it could force the EU to stop using their Socialist practices against Capitalist companies. The EU is sticking Sun with a long bladed knife right now, causing the loss of many more jobs. Certainly we can't rejoice in this.
Kudos to the EU for having the stones for actually following through on anti-trust regulation.
Any capitalist who has at least half a brain (and isn't brainwashed by the likes of Rand and Limbaugh) knows that for capitalism to work, there must be competition, and that monopolies eliminate competition, which causes prices to go up, and quality of goods and services to go down. Anti-trust regulation is there to prevent monopolies. Monopolies kill competition, and, ultimately, capitalism and free markets.
But in the USA, the politicians are completely bought off by corporate lobbyists, so they only give lip service to anti-trust regulation.j
And it appears that bureaucrats in the EU aren't completely bought off, and have some stones to stand up to American corporate monopolies. And the good thing is those big corporations need to play in European markets, otherwise cut off half (or more) of their revenues. So if they want to make the big bucks in Europe, they have to play by the EU rules.
So since our spineless, useless, bought-off politicians/regulators pretty much let big corporations do whatever they want, I'm glad the EU is standing up to the corps and slapping them down a bit.
And anyone calling the EU "socialists" doesn't know what socialism is, and is completely ignorant of what capitalism is, and what capitalism requires to exist and be healthy (read: proper anti-trust regulation, among other things).
To these folks spouting off "socialism" remarks - I say go back to spooging your Ayn Rand books. You're probably much happier in her fantasy world cult of selfishness.
All that said, I do want Oracle's acquisition of Sun to go through, if for nothing else to have a healthy, profitable corporate entity backing up Java.
But ultimately, Oracle did buy Sun for, among other reasons, to kill off MySql competition.
Maybe if Oracle can spin off MySql as a foundation, or simply sell it off to other investors, then the whole thing will sail right through. Then everyone is happy.
Any capitalist who has at least half a brain (and isn't brainwashed by the likes of Rand and Limbaugh) knows that for capitalism to work, there must be competition, and that monopolies eliminate competition, which causes prices to go up, and quality of goods and services to go down. Anti-trust regulation is there to prevent monopolies. Monopolies kill competition, and, ultimately, capitalism and free markets.
But in the USA, the politicians are completely bought off by corporate lobbyists, so they only give lip service to anti-trust regulation.j
And it appears that bureaucrats in the EU aren't completely bought off, and have some stones to stand up to American corporate monopolies. And the good thing is those big corporations need to play in European markets, otherwise cut off half (or more) of their revenues. So if they want to make the big bucks in Europe, they have to play by the EU rules.
So since our spineless, useless, bought-off politicians/regulators pretty much let big corporations do whatever they want, I'm glad the EU is standing up to the corps and slapping them down a bit.
And anyone calling the EU "socialists" doesn't know what socialism is, and is completely ignorant of what capitalism is, and what capitalism requires to exist and be healthy (read: proper anti-trust regulation, among other things).
To these folks spouting off "socialism" remarks - I say go back to spooging your Ayn Rand books. You're probably much happier in her fantasy world cult of selfishness.
All that said, I do want Oracle's acquisition of Sun to go through, if for nothing else to have a healthy, profitable corporate entity backing up Java.
But ultimately, Oracle did buy Sun for, among other reasons, to kill off MySql competition.
Maybe if Oracle can spin off MySql as a foundation, or simply sell it off to other investors, then the whole thing will sail right through. Then everyone is happy.
The EU is socialist. Very heavily so. So you can tell anyone who mentions it to go back to their Rand, but that doesn't change the truth. Don't make the EU sound so holy. You're only fooling yourself here. Well, and maybe the other socialists...
Oh, and while I'm reading my Rand as you accuse, you can read your Marx.
Oh, and while I'm reading my Rand as you accuse, you can read your Marx.
Sure will, comrade! hee hee
The EU is certainly more socialist than we are. But that is not necessarily a bad thing.
IMHO, the pendulum swung way too far to the right in the USA, as evidenced by the credit crash.
As a true capitalist, I strongly believe there needs to be some checks and balances, or rules, in place, to keep markets working. Without the foundation that rules lay down, capital cannot be exchanged, because it then has no real value. And again, monopolies kill competition, and thus markets, and thus capitalism.
That said, I certainly don't want the pendulum to swing too far to the other side, because then markets become suffocated by big government.
The EU is certainly more socialist than we are. But that is not necessarily a bad thing.
IMHO, the pendulum swung way too far to the right in the USA, as evidenced by the credit crash.
As a true capitalist, I strongly believe there needs to be some checks and balances, or rules, in place, to keep markets working. Without the foundation that rules lay down, capital cannot be exchanged, because it then has no real value. And again, monopolies kill competition, and thus markets, and thus capitalism.
That said, I certainly don't want the pendulum to swing too far to the other side, because then markets become suffocated by big government.
I don't know if you've ever lived in Europe... You may be confusing socialism with welfare. Anyway, I find it ironical that a so-called socialist entity (the EU) is defending principles dear to capitalism (no monopolies, etc.). Also, for a "socialist" entity, the EU (or more precisely its member states) enjoys more individual freedom than the US, in particular in terms of freedom of expression (Note: I lived 37 years in Europe, 22 years in the US... yes I'm old, but I know both systems pretty well from real experience!)
I was in total agreement with your post until I reached the line "But ultimately, Oracle did buy Sun for, among other reasons, to kill off MySql competition". Oracle bought Sun to own the whole stack (from hardware infrastructure all the way up to apps, hosted or resident). I don't think Oracle wants to kill MySQL. Interestingly, Oracle has released a lot of their products into the open source world (EclipseLink, Trinidad, contributions to Glassfish, etc.). Oracle is not "evil", well, not quite. They are the only company able to preserve the existence and ensure the future of the Java platform (everything at Oracle is predicated on Java (except the db, of course :-)).
There different perspectives are definitely going to play a role as to what is or is not a monopolistic union. Oracle owning MySQL isn't necessarily going to remove choice from the purchasing public. Last I heard Big Blue still has a formidable database program themselves as an offering, for example. The EU wants control of whatever they can get their hands on. That is the nature of their government.
Nah, I think you're seeing ghosts that are not there my friend.
The simple fact is that the EU antitrust regulators WORK (well, at least compared to the bought & paid for useless US trust regulators). So that's why they pursue this.
Antitrust laws (and enforcement) are a good thing in a capitalist environment. Without that, (near-) monopolies arise that lead to reduces innovation, less selection, and higher prices for consumers.
The simple fact is that the EU antitrust regulators WORK (well, at least compared to the bought & paid for useless US trust regulators). So that's why they pursue this.
Antitrust laws (and enforcement) are a good thing in a capitalist environment. Without that, (near-) monopolies arise that lead to reduces innovation, less selection, and higher prices for consumers.
What's your problem then?
And so, again you are wrong.
You've repeatedly accused the EU of being socialistic.
Follow me as we read this together axe: F. A. I. L.
HAHAHA. What a loser you are.
Follow me as we read this together axe: F. A. I. L.
HAHAHA. What a loser you are.
HI,
I dont know the total trade secret behind this whole scenario, but I know one thing.
Sun wanted a bail out and Oracle offered it. Jesus, this people wont let some one come out of the problems.
EU has become like nagging wife I feel.
Placing the finger in places where they should not.
It is all real funny.
I dont know the total trade secret behind this whole scenario, but I know one thing.
Sun wanted a bail out and Oracle offered it. Jesus, this people wont let some one come out of the problems.
EU has become like nagging wife I feel.
Placing the finger in places where they should not.
It is all real funny.
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