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Windows 7: The information lockdown

May 22, 2008, 5:11pm PDT | Length: 00:07:34
Microsoft is maintaining a cloak of silence around its next major release of Windows. ZDNet Editor in Chief Larry Dignan talks with blogger colleagues Mary Jo Foley, editor of All about Microsoft, and Ed Bott, editor of Microsoft Report, about the road map for Windows 7, including feature sets, timelines, partners, OEMs, and marketing. The beta for the new operating system is due in late 2008. The bloggers predict that Windows 7 will launch earlier than 2010, its anticipated release date.
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Talkback Most Recent of 28 Talkback(s)

  • Seriously!
    They're not even saying anything when they should be going beyond open sourcing their new product! They should give it away, I mean, that's how everyone makes money isn't it?! Giving away your stuff? I mean, yeah, *I* can't do that because I need to pay my rent, but, come on, Microsoft can do it, I mean they have magical government backing and magic beans, right?!?!
    ZDNet Gravatar
    Spiritusindomit@...
    23rd May 2008
  • I want some of what you're smoking
    Obviously, you are joking.
    ZDNet Gravatar
    JJQ1000
    23rd May 2008
  • You have a BIG SURPRISE coming...
    Larry Dignan, Mary Jo Foley,and Ed Bott You have a big surprise coming if you think the release date for Windows 7 will happen before fall of 2010. Microsoft is at a fix-it stage with Vista, which can only mean Vista SE, All the coding done with Vista would be a waste to toss out and bring in Windows 7 so early on. Rumors out of Remmond, Wa. Wednesday May 21th at a closed door meeting are saying that Vista is just WHAT the public wants in a way of a Operating System, and it will take a little re-tooling to get it so that it will fit both the consumer and corporate side to make each camp happy. SE is currently being tooled to fix the major backward compatibility problems facing Vista. As well as it has been said at several of these closed door meeting already Vista was released WAY to soon. XP should of had SP3 out much earlier to get it in gear. I can't say much more on this subject, but be looking for Vista SE in the very near future.
    ZDNet Gravatar
    mikeholli
    23rd May 2008
  • interesting.....
    it seems to me that it would be ironic for Microsoft to ship a Vista SE OS when they have already laid the groundwork for the Windows 7 release. Sure, Microsoft hasn't been to good at keeping to specific dates in the past; but, nonetheless, it would be pointless. The Vista "coding" you speak of would not be a waste - nothing in the software world is considered a waste. Even when your software doesn't make it in the market; just like Einstein, you have not found "a failure", rather, "one way not to do it". It is always about learning and moving on from mistakes, especially on Microsoft's part. Why do you think they are so successful? They took everything they learned from past OSes and applied it to the best of their ability, considering the pressure put on them for OS releases, implemented it in the next release of their OS. As stated on many blogs, I also believe Windows 7 will be similar to what they say it will be; a more modular OS with a wide set of customizable feature sets that can be implemented on a preferential basis in respective environments. Lastly, as for Vista compatibility with older products, I have had no issues whatsoever running anything worthwhile. If you do have problems with compatibility in Vista, as I have heard some people do, they most often are running not just legacy applications, but "legacy legacy" applications - something they should have moved on from years ago. Vista has better compatibility, considering its structure and array of new features and abilities than XP had at its time. Finally, I would just like to say that I regularly run hardware from a 486 to a PIII to a Core Duo - and everything in between; software from MS-DOS 6.22 to Windows 98 to Vista Ultimate and everything in between. Server OSes and workstation, Linux and Windows - but never, never will I consider operating on an Apple-based OS. They are the true devil in the "PC" world, not Microsoft. Microsoft is similar to the "prodigal son". "He" does something wrong on occasion, but "we" always end up forgiving "him" and learning to utilize "his" work.
    ZDNet Gravatar
    jcpt928
    23rd May 2008
  • Vista SE
    Isn't this the same as Vista SP1 ?
    ZDNet Gravatar
    JJQ1000
    23rd May 2008
  • How about .NET 3.5 SP1 Beta?
    That's got some pretty cool graphical speed optimizations among other way cool things. I don't agree that Vista HAS compatibility problems.. I think people have a problem with third party programs that they have to spend money updating, not to mention old out of spec hardware..
    ZDNet Gravatar
    DonBurnett
    23rd May 2008
  • Out of spec hardware??????
    Very few people buy an operating system. (I'm not talking corporate, here, but the average Joe) Most people buy a new PC, with whatever OS comes pre-installed.

    So that argument about "Old out of spec hardware" is a load of rubbish. I have a 1 year old PC, with Intel C2D E6600, 3 Gig RAM, nVidia 8800GT. This is NOT an out of spec box, yet my initial impression of Vista was negative. SP1 has improved it a little, but there are still some obvious issues with Vista.
    ZDNet Gravatar
    I am Gorby
    25th May 2008
  • That's not out of spec
    but if you notice any significant slowdown (aside from games) going to Vista (assuming you moved that machine from XP to Vista), then there's some other problem.

    Games are slower (and it was much worse a year ago), but in day to day work, I don't see a difference.

    I'm currently working on a problem with my parents PC, which was working fine and then suddenly the disk management went to crap, but it wasn't like that until I installed Ghost/NAV (mom wanted NAV) and some other software. I'll debug the issue later this week, but I've done several other installs with no issues.

    And if you think this is a Vista problem, you're fooling yourself. A coworker has a 6 month old XP Core 2 (1.8ghz) laptop (he got it new) and if he opens a word document from the desktop or virtually anything from within outlook, it's slow as molasses. I'd bet an athlon 64 3000 would kick it's butt.

    But open word up, and it's instantly open. Open the file from within Word, and it's instant. The problem is the install, which is either our IT department or Dell (not sure who did the install).

    Vista isn't perfect, and there are some UI changes I find offputting (did they really need to change the add/remove programs name in control panel?), and I really wish I could get Synergy to start as a service, but I tend to think that Vista runs smoother and feels faster in day to day use.
    ZDNet Gravatar
    notsofast
    27th May 2008
  • Why we don't know much about Windows 7? Answer:
    because Microsoft is in a total confused
    mess and nobody inside has a clue.
    ZDNet Gravatar
    Davewrite
    23rd May 2008
  • Another probably reason...
    It is more likely that Microsoft refuses to make any reference to what they are doing with "Windows 7" because they don't want people to skip over Vista and wait for the next version. They have a vested financial interest in trying to get people to upgrade from XP to Vista.
    ZDNet Gravatar
    JJQ1000
    23rd May 2008
  • The OP is partially right
    Sure Microsoft wants to sell Vista. What company doesn't want to sell it's wares. I don't know of any and I checked really good. wink


    But I think Vista is still a good move now as it's got a lot of what windows 7 will have, as Ed commented the driver model is in place and so on. Truely, nobody could argue Vista has done greatly, but at the same time I don't think you can argue it was because the OS is horrible. The OEMs were so far from being ready for Vista it boggles my mind. Even if MS changed specs to some degree at some point, which i don't know for sure, it was a debaucle. The Intuit example still shines as the best. The most popular 3rd party software would not run on Vista with it's 2006 version. Why? Well, since they got a 2007 version out fairly quickly after consumer release of Vista, I think the answer is quite obvious.

    So, to blame Microsoft or to "come down" on them makes no sense. they delivered on security big time. And if anyone's memory serves, that was THE biggest knock against Windows for years. I think they should be given a thumbs up for not ditching the effort and end up with a glorified XP. That would have been much worse and everyone is aware of that, i know that, but if you read many blogs you'd think Microsoft had no clue. They were instead taking a huge step forward and it had the chance for mixed results all along. The completely change your security model for both apps and drivers was a bold move by Microsoft.

    Those who hate them can not find enough bad to say, but all i know is i've been using Vista Ultimate x64 since early this years and I absolutely love it. No problems. The thing is Vista needs a lot of RAM. In fact you won't notice much of any change moving from the last core 2 duo model at 2.2Ghz, for example, to a penryn model at 2.5Ghz. That is for average use and i'm not speaking for processor intensive apps such as CAD programs.


    RAM is so cheap now that the idea that Vista "costs too much in hardware" is misguided either purposely or otherwise.


    You can get a core 2 duo machine for 1,000.00 now that will run Vista like a champ, especially if you put 60.00 more into it and snag 4 GB of high quality RAM. Of course that would only be worthwhile for a 64 bit version of Vista. 32 bit Vista will run on 2GB of RAM quite well, but bump it to 3GB and you'll be happy.

    And what's not to like? I don't care if the new UI is the only thing I gained since I love it over XP's GUI. But as a former full time programmer and now only programming hobbyist essentially, I find many very valuable reasons I like Vista on top of the new UI, but it seems I'm all on my own with that.


    I've found WAN speeds to be dramatically better. Program stability under high load is outstanding. Memory management, at first looks like Vista is a major resource hog, but it's not and you can change how it handles memory if you decide. But it's designed to learn what you use most. If I look at my memory usage, using default settings, it is using around 1 GB of the 4 GB. But if i then load Office Access, Excel, Infopath, OneNote, Outlook, Powerpoint, Project, publisher, Visio, Word and Visual Studio 2005 and 2008, my memory usage has barely budged. It's simply reserving memory for often used apps. Between that and super prefetch, it gets faster and faster over time.

    With hardware getting better and faster by the day, Vista will be be on 300 million desktops by the end of this year.
    ZDNet Gravatar
    xuniL_z
    23rd May 2008
  • You can buy even more than that for 1000.
    You can get a core 2 duo machine for 1,000.00 now that will run Vista like a champ, especially if you put 60.00 more into it and snag 4 GB of high quality RAM. Of course that would only be worthwhile for a 64 bit version of Vista.

    I'd argue that going to vista 64 with 4GB is not necessary. You'll probably lose about as much memory from the larger pointers as you'll gain from the larger address space. As I recall, I had about 3.5GB addressable memory with vista 32.

    If you're going to x64, go for the gusto and get 8GB. You can do that and still come in at 1000 (or less).

    I built a Core2 machine, with an e8400, 8GB of ram, 500GB HD (640 is now the same price), 520W PSU (overkill), inexpensive GPU (machine mostly for photoshop), Vista Premium x64, Norton AV/Ghost 14 and a P180 case for about 1000 (give or take 50 bucks).

    I certainly could have done it for less, but it was for my parents and they wanted certain features on the MB, that required a 150.00 for the MB...other wise I'd have gotten one for 100 or less. And the other factor was I wanted to build them a super quiet rig (no reason I just did ;)) so 5 slipstream fans added another $50.00 or so.
    ZDNet Gravatar
    notsofast
    27th May 2008
  • Freudian slip!!
    Thanks MJF...don't worry, we all expected it anyway...ahem...yeah...the over-promise, under-deliver thing.

    Actually, though, I think the real reason we haven't heard anything is that *Microsoft* doesn't know what's in it yet. In fact, they don't know what will be in it, because they don't know what *to* put in it! There is no clear path forward for them. I.e. "it needs to work" is baseline...but has been trouble in past versions. But...what compelling new features can they possibly bring to the table? The old question resurfaces - does M$ ever innovate? Usefully, that is?
    ZDNet Gravatar
    techboy_z
    23rd May 2008
  • Microsoft Is Running In Circles
    This is gonna be the most hilarious thing to come out of Redmond since the Windows 98 BSOD on a USB device demonstration.
    ZDNet Gravatar
    itanalyst2@...
    23rd May 2008
  • Will WIndows 7 have "Quick Look"?
    Just as Microsoft copied Apple's interface designs, they will have to come up with features to match or compete with OSX. Whine all you want about Mac users and their pride in the Apple Mac, OSX makes Vista look like an archeological find out of an Indiana Jones movie. Quick Look is a perfect example because it speeds up productivity immensely by allowing the user to quickly see the content of any file without having to launch any software. I can't tell you how much time I've saved because of it. I honestly think that Leopard is one good reason why Microsoft is being more secretive. They don't want a competitor to come out with a stronger product before they do; as Apple did with Leopard. Yea, Leopard had its problems, but what OS doesn't in its initial release? Just look at Vista. Hello?
    ZDNet Gravatar
    3dtodd
    23rd May 2008
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