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Microsoft versus Microsoft: IE9 busts MSDN for a security gaffe

By | June 16, 2011, 11:21am PDT

Summary: Today, a “rogue faction” at Microsoft published a nifty add-in that will make developers’ lives easier. So why did Internet Explorer 9 flag it as a likely security threat? And why should that warning be a wake-up call for developers?

Update 18-June 9AM PDT: The Web Platform and Tools team has replaced the original version of the Visual Studio update described in this post with one that is digitally signed.

You don’t see this sort of thing very often, thankfully.

Today, a self-described “rogue faction” at Microsoft (that’s a joke, of course) released an add-in for Visual Studio 2010 that improves HTML5 and JavaScript support. (Read Mary Jo Foley’s writeup for more details.)

But a funny thing happens if you use Internet Explorer 9 to download the code from the Visual Studio gallery. A few weeks ago, I wrote about the new reputation-based security features in IE9 and noted in passing, “No domain or file gets a free pass—not even a new signed release from Microsoft or Google. Every file has to build a reputation.”

Here’s your proof:

That red shield is a severe roadblock. IE9 makes it particularly difficult to download any file that falls into this category.

At first glance, this seems like a false positive (Tim Anderson described it as “extreme for a download from an official Microsoft site”).

Look more closely at the file and you will see there’s a legitimate reason for the dire warning. It’s a Microsoft Installer file, which means its job is to install a program on your system. And yet this MSI package is not digitally signed. A brand new file that hasn’t been seen in public before and is not digitally signed? According to Microsoft Security, there’s about a 96% chance that that code is malware.

This really and truly is an unofficial release. But it’s hosted on a Microsoft server, where the public should never, ever be able to download executable code that isn’t digitally signed. Period. If that isn’t a companywide security policy, it should be.

I expect that this mistake will be fixed relatively quickly, but in a way I’m glad it happened. It offers a chance to see and learn from the real-world consequences when coders aren’t thinking about security.

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Ed Bott is an award-winning technology writer with more than two decades' experience writing for mainstream media outlets and online publications.

Disclosure

Ed Bott

Ed Bott is a freelance technical journalist and book author. All work that Ed does is on a contractual basis.

Since 1994, Ed has written more than 25 books about Microsoft Windows and Office. Along with various co-authors, Ed is completely responsible for the content of the books he writes. As a key part of his contractual relationship with publishers, he gives them permission to print and distribute the content he writes and to pay him a royalty based on the actual sales of those books. Ed's books written prior to fall 2011 have been distributed by Que Publishing (a division of Pearson Education) and by Microsoft Press. As of November 2011, Ed is a partner in the independent publishing company Fair Trade Digital Exchange, which exclusively publishes his books.

On occasion, Ed accepts consulting assignments. In recent years, he has worked as an expert witness in cases where his experience and knowledge of Microsoft and Microsoft Windows have been useful. In each such case, his compensation is on an hourly basis, and he is hired as a witness, not an advocate.

Ed does not own stock or have any other financial interest in Microsoft or any other software company. He owns 500 shares of stock in EMC Corporation, which was purchased before the company's acquisition of VMware. In addition, he owns 350 shares of stock in Intel Corporation, purchased more than two years ago. All stocks are held in retirement accounts for long-term growth.

Ed does not accept gifts from companies he covers. All hardware products he writes about are purchased with his own funds or are review units covered under formal loan agreements and are returned after the review is complete.

Biography

Ed Bott

Ed Bott is an award-winning technology writer with more than two decades' experience writing for mainstream media outlets and online publications. He's served as editor of the U.S. edition of PC Computing and managing editor of PC World; both publications had monthly paid circulation in excess of 1 million during his tenure. He is the author of more than 25 books on Microsoft Windows and Office, including the recently released Windows 7 Inside Out.

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RE: Microsoft versus Microsoft: IE9 busts MSDN for a security gaffe
xnederlandx 18th Jun
@Samic
IE9 really doesn't like those standards do they :P ?
Sadly, I've seen this warning triggered by Microsoft's own Zune software. sad

Ooops.
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Contributr
In the last 90 days?
Ed Bott 16th Jun
@Cylon Centurion

If that's something you've seen recently, I'd like to know more. If it was before IE9's release in March, then I can chalk up to beta.
@Ed Bott

Yeah, it was with the Release Candidate. You can see it here:

w w w .winmatrix.com/forums/index.php?/topic/31071-lol-at-microsoft-zune-software/
You realize all the people with talent are leaving MS right?
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Really?
General C# 16th Jun
@Hasam1991 Apple fanboi?
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@Hasam1991

As you are not very well informed on many things.

plain
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@Hasam1991
Wait a second....aren't you one of the bunch who always said MS has no talent???

Something fishy going on here.
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They've always had talent
Richard Flude 16th Jun
They just never used it.

I've spent the last two days fixing the latest MCSE stuff up. I'm amazed people still defend windows.

On fresh installs hardly anything works, locked done security settings that are nothing but an inconvenience, links on the MS website that won't work on Windows/IE when they do on Mac/Safari, warning messages and "helpful" hint panels popping up all the time, 3 reboots before a new system is fully patched, several versions of anything from MSDN (x86, x64, etc), bing searches that return old versions of software on MS's own site (e.g. JBDC drivers), malicious software tools updates on server, ...

I'm just scratching the surface of the glaring deficiencies. People that think windows is leading edge need to start using some alternate OSes for a while.
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Rly?
cym104 16th Jun
@Richard Flude
I've personally used various versions of Mac OSX and Linux and none of of beats Windows in usability(Mac) or stability(Linux).
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@Richard Flude

"On fresh installs hardly anything works, locked done security settings that are nothing but an inconvenience, links on the MS website that won't work on Windows/IE when they do on Mac/Safari, warning messages and "helpful" hint panels popping up all the time, 3 reboots before a new system is fully patched, several versions of anything from MSDN (x86, x64, etc), bing searches that return old versions of software on MS's own site (e.g. JBDC drivers), malicious software tools updates on server, ..."

Really? I think you're making that up. On fresh installs, you system should be running a top efficiency. Not crashing and "not working". Unless you're doing fresh installs of Windows XP. In which case, yeah, the amount of missing drivers caused everything not to work.

I've never had this happen to me upon fresh installs, especially with Vista or 7. Everything worked and ran well. I see no "Locked down security settings" causing an inconvenience to me.

And -10 for the crying over rebooting. It happens. Too bad so sad.
@Richard Flude

They've always had talent, they've used it but then stopped and now are back on top of things. Windows 7, Windows Phone 7, Office 2010 and so on are all excellent products.

I've been using PC's since the late 80's with HP offerings and later went to Windows with 3.11, I've used a multitude of different OS's and computers in my time. I remember alpha/beta/RC testing of XP and it was quite the delight as most things worked right out the gate and with a quick windows update everything worked perfectly. With Windows Vista and Windows 7 things only got better and clean installs of Windows 7 now result in everything working out of the gate... At least on any standard PC... The exception would be the Mac which requires bootcramp among other things to run basic PC hardware found in all PC's.

I've yet to find a page that I have any issues opening with IE9 so I'm not sure exactly where you find this problem site... Please post it up so we can take a look at exactly what you're talking about otherwise we'll have to disregard your statement since there is no evidence of such issue.

As it comes to updates... Updates will sometimes require a reboot as certain system files are in use by the OS and can only be modified when not in use hence a reboot will unlock these files. This is true for any OS.
@Richard Flude

The only surface I see you scratching is your head as you come up with more inane statements.

I use Windows 7 x64, Linux (BT5) Gnome...

I wouldn't touch OS X with a ten foot pole. Always the first to go down at PWN2OWN, now gets Malware, endless comments on the Apple forums of the spinning beach ball of death and so on. Their motto "It just works" I've been able to prove wrong for decades. If you plug in a scanner you'd think it would just work... Well it just didn't. Going to Fry's and looking at all the computers offered... I saw a Mother and Daughter shopping, they were looking at the Macs. The daughter said she wanted a Mac as it was the cool thing (trendy) but nothing to backup for productivity as the Mother had asked. The daughter regurgitated a bunch of garbage from the Apple commercials such as "it just works" and "never crashes"... As my friends know I'm quite the cynic and love to have fun with these things... I walked down the Mac isle and walked up to a super fancy iMac on display. Moving the mouse resulted in no movement at all, all keys on the keyboard resulted in no action on the screen. I loudly announced "Hey Hilary! Look at this iMac!!! It's just working!!! Never crashes!!! Wait... What the!? Excuse me sir, is this how Mac's "just work"? The store rep replied... "Hmm, looks like it locked up..." Me: So you mean it crashed? But I thought Macs just work and never crash?"... The Mother and Daughter at that point seemed quite displeased... I went to the other side and started playing Mahjong on a touch screen HP that was half the price... "Hey Hilary! This one seems to actually work and not crash! Oh and it has a fancy touch screen too!!!" Guess who came wondering over asking for my advice? That's right the Mother and Daughter. They had then realized that they'd almost made a huge mistake buying a Apple Crashntoss. They bought a nice Asus laptop with my help and I'm sure she can get some real work done now without crashing.
It means IE9 is doing it's job (while VS/MSDN team isn't).

Think about this: if someone hacked microsoft server, or highjacked a DNS server and redirected your download request to a fake server, the installer's certification would be the last line of the defense.

DNS redirection may not be easy (yet ISP does it all the time) but getting one of those certificate of microsoft.com for application is just down right impossible...

Well, almost impossible if not for the bonehead mistake like Comodo did couple months ago.

Anyhow, brovo for IE9!
@Samic
IE9 really doesn't like those standards do they :P ?
I don't see why this is a problem. It was a brand new release and should trigger the warning. Just because it's on MS's servers doesn't mean it's not malware.

Downloading it required clicking on "yes I'm really really sure" a few times, but I'd rather have this than Chrome's behavior of automatically executing anything you download.
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@spivonious

If it had been signed with a well-known Microsoft certificate it would have been green-lighted right away.
@Ed Bott
For a company with the size of MS, offering almost all kinds of IT products I don't see this a huge problem. It does not matter how much they talk about "sinergy", I believe different divisions work as independent companies.
Let me tell you a little story:
I am from Brasil and my former manager worked at Lotus Brasil, supporting Notes and SmartSuite. He told me that in that time there was a very strong competition between the SmartSuite people and MS Office people and sometimes things got very "personal" specially in events like COMDEX. In one occasion, a big SmartSuite user (a government agency) started to have issues running the system, and it seemed that the problem was in Windows. MS sent a bunch of developers from Redmond to Lotus office in S?o Paulo to indentify the problem. My former manager said that everybody was very friendly, very different from the behavior he was used to see. After some "caipirinhas" in the last day, he asked to the MS guys about that, and how they could work so well with a competitor. The answer was something like "I don't sell MS Office, I sell Windows. I want to make Windows run well with any application. For me MS Office is just another application"...
@spivonious: wow, that's pretty bad, althogh I hate explaining the 'yellow bar' thing to clients, automatically running is just wrong. Someone should blare that all over happy
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Contributr
Chrome doesn't auto-execute
Ed Bott 16th Jun
@spivonious

It downloads automatically but doesn't execute without user interaction.

Safari on the Mac, on the other hand, DOES execute installers automatically using default settings.
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Open safe files in Safari
Richard Flude Updated - 16th Jun
On Mac OS X Safari will open "safe" files, including mounting image volumes. Personally I'd remove this feature, and I disable it on all systems I setup

It does not, however, "execute installers" automatically. Executables are no "safe" and Mac OS X doesn't have the equivalent of windows' "autorun".

Indeed "installers" are not common on Mac OS X, applications are typically being self contained and don't require installation (advance share library system, even supporting multiple versions).

But nice try Ed;-)
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Contributr
Quibbling over semantics?
Ed Bott Updated - 16th Jun
@Richard Flude

You might want to watch some of the videos I've done showing Mac installation packages being opened automatically by Safari.

Hint: the word INSTALLER is very prominent.
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Ed, you are right
Richard Flude 16th Jun
Safari does treat mpkg as "safe". These Metapackages will run a program called "Installer". A bewildering decision by Apple.

Apple please kill the "open 'safe' file" option.
@spivonious just clicking on "yes I'm really really sure" doesn't give you any security. You should have to type an admin password, so just anyone that is on the computer can't install a program on your system without your knowledge. That would be security, this is just an inconvenience.
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â??rogue factionâ?? ?
ScorpioBlue 16th Jun
Sounds more like the right hand didn't know what the left hand was doing.
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I agree. We have seen this happen
Mister Spock 16th Jun
@ScorpioBlue
within large companies like Apple and Google, also.

The interface between divisions must be strengthened in these companies as they grow in size.
plain
dude,

This isn't about Apple or Google. Read the title of the article. And stop deflecting from the topic at hand.
@Blind.....
Touchy.;)
Spock was I suspecting just pointing out this is a not uncommon failing by other large similar enterprises....

Wow plain
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Nothing like learning your lessons in public to make them stick!
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Message has been deleted.
james347 Updated - 17th Jun
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Oracle rarely, if ever, signs their downloads. Stuff is usually crammed into .zip files. It could be anything.
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Oversight
shanselman 16th Jun
It was an oversight on our part. We'll remedy it with our own certificate (rather than a Microsoft one).
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Thanks, Scott
honeymonster 16th Jun
@shanselman
So you are going rogue?

Offtopic: When will someone at Microsoft set the record straight on .NET / Silverlight future? The blogosphere is all up in arms about MS dropping Silverlight. Yes - it is quoted as a fact now even though it was a weak rumor started by a reckless blogger who speculated why Silverlight wasn't mentioned along with "tiles".

My theory is that tiles will further blur the distinction between web and desktop - allowing websites to mark up (microformats?) a section/div/page as a "tile" - a la webslices. Which makes perfect sense given how IE9 already (somewhat clunky) allows sites to be "pinned".

Thoughts?
@honeymonster The Rogue Faction thing was a joke. Folks need to remember my blog is my blog, not a press release factory. wink If ZDNet keeps writing stories from crap I blog I will need to make my blog less fun.

I can't speak to the Silverlight thing until the Build Conference, but you can feel free to read my opinion piece on SL vs. HTML5 on my blog.
@shanselman
The Rogue Faction thing was a joke. Folks need to remember my blog is my blog, not a press release factory.
Thanks Scott, I certainly took it as a joke. It is frustrating how some people insist on finding evidence of controversies in what is not said. If every blog entry and every keynote have to assign equal weight to all related topics nobody would read/attend because the message would get buried in trivia.
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Kudos to IE9
slingzenarrowzuvowtrayjissforchin 16th Jun
There was a time when is was popular to say that anything downloaded from Microsoft was malware. It was never a reasonable thing to say, of course, but the motivation for saying it (legitimate concerns about the security of certain Microsoft products) was not completely without justification.

But that was then, and this is now. It seems to me that even the Microsoft haters have to concede that IE9's performance in this case is right on target. It certainly provides solid evidence that Microsoft has come a long way in its efforts to take security seriously. Good for IE9!
Nice to know that security has made Microsoft agnostic, not giving a pass to something just because it is a Microsoft product or comes from a Microsoft domain.
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We in the Ubuntu Linux community are accustomed
Dietrich T. Schmitz, *~* Your Linux Advocate 16th Jun
to having everything which installs be digitally signed (GnuPG keys).

That is how we keep from installing rogue software in the first place.

Ed, does MS have any plan for setting up a repository of sorts? I realize that third-party app vendors would need to participate but nowadays would it not be a good idea for them to consider this? Apple does for the Mac.
I would love to see a signed MS repository, complete with both command-line and gui interfaces.
@bcmoore87

Command line? Lol, I didn't know this was 1970 wink

Microsoft pretty much has regulated the CLI to the bottom of the barrel. I wouldn't expect to see anything new with a CLI anymore.
@Dietrich T. Schmitz, *~* Your Linux Advocate

yes if you saw the windows 8 video you would have seen the app market place and Microsoft also has their website where you can look at software and this is about windows not linux so stop with the freaking linux crap on a windows post please no one freaking cares.
@Dietrich T. Schmitz, *~* Your Linux Advocate
Not gonna happen. Far too many signed, free and fantastic apps for Windows. There is an option not to 'autorun' in IE9 although I don't use it.(IE9 that is)

And no, I am not a Windows freak. I happen to love Ubuntu and probably use it 50/50 with Windows. If you don't count work, it's more like 75/25 in favor of Ubuntu to save the insults. But the truth is, repositories are setup for Ubuntu to make finding functional software for that OS easier to find.

Sorry MAC enthusiasts. I bought a POS Macbook 2009 used so my daughter could use it for her ipod touch. Kid's only 12. But when she's done syncing and charging, even she would rather use Windows/Ubuntu with the exception of Photobooth. Mac OSX more functional? No. More of an evil dictator than MS could ever dream to be.
@Dietrich T. Schmitz, *~* Your Linux Advocate
One last thing, Apple has a repository of what exacty? App developers that they can profit on? I realize it's based on a bastardized Linux Kernel, but come on. Let's not give credit where it's not due. All their repositories are is basically bloatware they have chosen not to pre-install. You can't compare it to the Linux repositories except that is uses the same principal to install, but it's mostly it's own software or software developed by its own non-independent writers.
@ssc@...

Fanboi much the OSX kernel is based of BSD not linux...
@Knix96

Linux and BSD both come from Unix. Yes there are differences. I get it. But we're not talking completely different universes.

So my bad, I referred to the wrong kernel. But there are plenty of similarities drawn between the kernels of Linux and OSX. And they are pointing to the similarities with Unix. You really want to get that into semantics?

Where does Fanboi come from exactly? Anytime anyone has something to say anti-apple? anti-linux or anti-windows?

I tend to find that people who label others 'fanboi's' regardless, make no contributions, have no decent arguments to the real point, so it's easier to use a label.

If you like Apple/Mac, good for you. Same with BSD, Unix, Linux and all the off-shoots. If you like Windows? Same thing.

Does it help your shortcomings in other areas to throw out fanboi lables when you know absolutely nothing about a particular poster?

So tell me again, which is it that I'm a Fanboi of? Windows because I have no choice at work? Windows because I occasionally use it at home? Linux because I use it as primary? Or Apple because it's the first company's products I've worked with that are really pushing the facist envelope?

And if you are a fan of BSD or Unix or Linux, you should be disgusted with what Apple is doing. Unless of course you are an iTunes fan. And if you are? Who's the real 'fanboi' here?

You brought it up.
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I have lost track of the Microsoft stuff that is not digitally signed.

But then again, with stolen and hacked root certificates in recent times, digital signing is not 100% reliable. All it does is potentially increase your confidence.

Sadly there is no such thing as 100% trust.
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Contributr
Examples, please?
Ed Bott 17th Jun
@tony@...

If you have examples of executable code available on a Microsoft-owned server that is not digitally signed, please let me know. I am very interested in seeing those.

I haven't found any lately.
An article much ado about nothing. New code still in testing gets marked as malware. Nothing to see here.
Don't know if this is related, but I've used IE9 to try and make tags. I'm notified that a "required" password is required when I attempt to save the tag, but no field is shown. Tech support has suggested I attempt making tags on another computer. How absurd can things get?
I believe this installer file is for developers, in that case these are experts who can make a judgement call on executable files

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