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Between the Lines

Larry Dignan, Andrew Nusca and Rachel King

System76: Bringing Linux to the desktop, 1 stupid-fast computer at a time

By | December 31, 2010, 1:47am PST

Summary: Sure my System76 test machine is a screamer, but will high-end consumers buy in to Ubuntu, even if it’s pre-installed?

Readers of my Ed Tech blog will know that System76, an OEM dedicated to selling Ubuntu-powered laptops, desktops, and servers recently sent me a pair of their netbooks to test for use in student computing. While the hardware was stock netbook (Atom processors, Intel graphics, etc.), the computers reminded me how much I liked Ubuntu and offered a glimpse of how easy a transition to Linux could be if it simply came pre-installed on a high quality machine from a reputable manufacturer. After all, no matter how easy Ubuntu is to install, the average consumer (or business, school, or government agency for that matter) simply isn’t going to start downloading ISOs and blowing away pre-installed copies of Windows 7.

The netbooks were perfectly nice,and represented a solid choice for schools because of their abundant free software and competitive prices when compared to other netbooks with similar specs. However, System76 also sent me a high-performance, consumer-oriented laptop to evaluate in the broader context of desktop Linux.

I use Ubuntu regularly, primarily as a server OS, and it’s been my primary desktop OS at various points since version 7. However, being the geeky sort of guy that I am, I don’t hesitate to either fire it up in a virtual machine or just burn a CD and wipe out any of the various computers that tend to float around my house and install the operating system. This is all well and good for geeky sorts of guys (and I mean “guys” in a very gender-neutral sense) or for businesses that either need or want to use Linux.

Most people just go to Dell, HP, or Apple, though, buy a computer, and use whatever OS came with it until it dies. What can System76 offer to make consumers order a $1500 laptop and use Ubuntu on it until it dies?

The computer pictured above is their Pangolin Performance model. A base price of $845 gets you an HD+, 15.6″ LED screen; a Core i5 processor; 2GB of RAM; discrete ATI graphics; a 250GB hard drive; a DVD burner; Bluetooth, 802.11b/g/n wireless; a 6-cell battery; a modem; an integrated webcam; 64-bit Ubuntu 10.10; and plenty of ports (everything from HDMI to eSata). A similarly configured (although lacking the System76’s numeric keypad) HP Dv6t running 64-bit Windows 7 Professional will cost you just under $1000. At the moment, HP is offering a free upgrade to 8GB of RAM and comes standard with a 640GB hard drive, but clearly the prices are competitive.

Pricing stays competitive as you start adding options. My test machine was upgraded with a 1.83GHz Core i7 quad-core processor, 4GB of RAM, and a 40GB solid state drive and rings up at just over $1500. You can’t even get a quad-core MacBook Pro, let alone touch a 15″ MBP for $1500.

This is, in fact, where things start to get interesting, both for geeks like me and for pro-sumers and power users. Long story short, my test laptop screams. It boots in about 15 seconds, applications launch instantly, and even with only 4GB of RAM, I can’t get it to bog down on my usual stack of browser windows and countless tabs. My MacBook Pro? Two different browsers, 3-4 windows each, with 8-10 tabs a piece tend to get it down.

Of course, the higher clock speed on my Mac favors single-threaded applications, but I’m going to miss 4 hyperthreaded cores when I send the Pangolin back. I’m also going to miss the SSD, despite it’s small size.

My point is that for a very reasonable price, demanding consumers can have a rock solid machine that will handle anything they throw at it (at least in terms of performance).

Next: So what’s the catch? »

Topics

Chris Dawson writes ZDNet's Education IT blog. He is a freelance writer and consultant with years of experience in educational technology and web-based systems. In 2011, he became the Vice President of Marketing for WizIQ, Inc., a virtual classroom and learning network SaaS provider.

Disclosure

Christopher Dawson

Christopher Dawson is the Vice President of Marketing for WizIQ, Inc., by day and a freelance writer and educational technology consultant by night. Well, most of his colleagues at WizIQ are based in India, so really he's working with them whenever he can stay awake. He has worked for his local school district as a teacher and technology director, for the Johns Hopkins University School of Public Health, and for Biogen, Inc. (now Biogen-IDEC, Inc.). He has also consulted with STATNet and Cytyc Corporation and retains close ties with X2 Development Corporation (now owned by Follett Software, the supplier of the student information system he administered for several years). Follett is paying him a monthly honorarium to act as a presenter for their "SIS Voices for Student Achievement" community (he produces occasional blog posts and hosts a monthly webinar on the use of student information systems to inform data-driven instruction and school-wide change. He regularly purchases and/or recommends Dell hardware. This is because Dell makes good hardware and has truly committed itself to education in innovative ways, particularly with their "Connected Classroom" initiative. It isn't because he has dealings with the company through his role at WizIQ (which he does) or because they have provided him with long-term loans of a variety of equipment for in-depth testing (which they have). Intel (reference designer for the Classmate PCs he has implemented in his local schools) has provided him with long-term loans of Classmate PCs for testing, as have Dell and Lenovo with their educational offerings. He may report on any of these companies as his experiences with them have direct bearing on educational technology; positive reports are not necessarily an endorsement and he receives no direct financial compensation from these companies or any others. Intel paid all expenses for his attendance at the 2009 Intel Classmate PC Ecosystem Summit which he attended as the sole representative of the technology press. He was invited to attend in 2010 but his wife would have killed him if he spent 3 days in Vegas geeking out and left her home alone with a new baby. Acer provided him with a 50% discount on an Aspire One netbook in early 2009 after he tested it for 30 days through their educational seed program. He liked the netbook at the time but it has since broken and sits unused in his office. Canonical sent him Ubuntu lanyards, t-shirts, and mousepads for his kids. He stole one of the lanyards and proudly hangs his keys from it and occasionally features his 8-year old wearing an oversized Ubuntu t-shirt on his Facebook profile. Gunnar Optiks sent him a pair of computer glasses to evaluate for a holiday gift guide. He is wearing them now as he types this because they never asked for them back and they rock out loud. Seriously - they work brilliantly and make it much easier to spend 20 hours a day staring at an LCD. If they ever asked for them back, he would fork over the $99 and buy a pair. Microsoft gave him 2 free copies of Office 2010 professional, a desktop clock, and a useless book on Office 2010 when he attended the launch of Office/Sharepoint 2010. He occasionally uses the SharePoint lanyard they gave him instead of the Ubuntu lanyard for his keys, but feels dirty afterwards. Adobe provided him with a pre-release version of the CS5 Master Collection for evaluation and ultimately provided a full, licensed copy for ongoing testing of educational applications of this admittedly expensive software. Like the Gunnars, if the license expires or they come out with CS6, he'd actually go out and buy it himself. Which is saying something, because he's actually pretty cheap. Any other companies wishing to send him cool things to evaluate, wear, or otherwise adorn his kids are more than welcome to; he promises to disclose it here if he keeps any of the stuff. Finally, because WizIQ is a virtual classroom and learning network provider, Chris, as VP of Marketing, frequently interacts with, seeks out deals with, and directly or indirectly competes with a whole lot of LMS, SIS, and other Education 2.0 companies. In general, he'll limit his reporting about these companies to news that does not impact his relationship with them or with WizIQ. If he reports on them, it's because what they are doing is newsworthy or worth the attention of his readers and not because he's trying to broker some deal, damage competition, or otherwise advance his position in his day job. LMS and SIS companies, along with other online learning communities, are a pretty important part of Ed Tech. If he stops reporting on them completely, there won't be a whole lot left. He'll be sure to call out any overt conflicts of interest if they are unavoidable. Finally, Follett Software Company pays him a little tiny honorarium every month to present on their SIS Voices webinars and to write the occasional blog or discussion thread for them. Since Follett recently bought X2 (maker of an awesome web-based SIS that Chris just happened to have used, served in advisory groups for, and frequently reported on), this is probably also worth disclosing.

Biography

Christopher Dawson

Christopher Dawson grew up in Seattle, back in the days of pre-antitrust Microsoft, coffeeshops owned by something other than Starbucks, and really loud, inarticulate music. He escaped to the right coast in the early 90's and received a degree in Information Systems from Johns Hopkins University. While there, he began a career in health and educational information systems, with a focus on clinical trials and related statistical programming and database modeling. This focus led him to several positions at Johns Hopkins, a couple-year stint in private industry, teaching high school math and technology, and 2 years as the technology director for his local school district. Most recently, he started his own consulting business and is now the Vice President of Marketing for WizIQ, Inc., a virtual classroom and learning network provider. He lives with his wife, five kids (yes, 5), 2 dogs, and a hateful cat in a small town in north-central Massachusetts. Although he is no longer teaching, his roles with WizIQ and ZDNet allow him to continue helping students and teachers add value to education with technology rather than merely adding to the bottom line.

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RE: System76: Bringing Linux to the desktop, 1 stupid-fast computer at a time
birumut Updated - 17th Jun
Well done! Thank you very much for professional templates and community edition
sesli sohbet sesli chat
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Ok, so the Linux zealots can stop whining about how they cant buy a laptop with Linux preinstalled.

But do you really think many people will move to this? You can get laptops with Win7 Home for less than $1000 so there really isnt much of a price difference.

If Ubuntu did some marketing and advertising, perhaps they could get some interested in trying it, but until then, there will be little interest.
@otaddy Well, there is a lot of software available for Linux, enough now that perhaps the question can be posed: What actual benefit does Windows bring?

Now for gamers, sure I'll concede the point - and weird "workarounds" aren't going to cut it - if you want to play games you don't necessarily want monkey around getting them to run. Sure, if games aren't a focus then you can get many to run on Linux - but if you bought your computer to play games (and nothing wrong with that) then you are better off sticking with Windows.

But otherwise, well I don't think it's as clear cut anymore. If you're installing OpenOffice.org - what benefit does running it on Windows bring?
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How about...
wolf_z 31st Dec 2010
@jeremychappell

1) You can get Win 7 problems fixed *anywhere*, just about by anyone. When you have problems to begin with, which is rarely.

2) No worries about hardware support.

3) No worries about running app XYZ, no funny interactions between applications, no *fiddling* to make things work.

Oh, did I mention *no fiddling*? happy Most folks don't want to know. Linux works fine for dedicated devices like DVRs and the like, but not when you actually have to *use* the OS for other stuff...

Granted Ubuntu makes Linux about as easy as it can be--but that's the rub. Win 7 or OS X level easy it is not, and the creators really don't want it to be.

Free is nice--if it does what you want. If you can't make that all-in-one printer work, well, that's a problem. If you can't buy a game off the shelf (or a geneology program, or a cross-stich pattern program, or a cookbook program or...) you're not going to want it.

That's always been the problem with Linux. It's by geeks, for geeks, and always will be. People who love to fiddle, well they enjoy Linux.

But that's a very small slice of the pie, Jeremy.
@jeremychappell

I dont play games on my PC so that is not an issue, but here are the benefits I see:

1. Can run wider range of software from MS Office to Open source.
2. Media support out of the box.
3. Windows Media Center. I use this almost daily to listen to my MP3 collection/view pictures while doing things around the house.
4. Can run all of my Java development tools.
5. Can run cygwin to get unix like commands/functionality.

OpenOffice is worthless. If your office needs are minimal, then GoogleDocs is a better choice. If you need more than that, you are better served with MS Office.
@jeremychappell and otaddy
It is obvious you have no or little knowledge of Linux/Ubuntu.
Linux problems are solved anywhere and are far less likely to occur if you have a system that is compatible (like sys76) than with Win.
Funny interactions between apps is Win "feature", I am not sure why you think this is not a problem...
"Fiddling" in Ubuntu is far less likely than having through registry keys in Win. Well, I know- people just reinstall Win to make it simpler. Loosing several hours in the process and sometime precious data too.
Media support is in Ubuntu out of the box. There are multiple media centers you can use- it is your choice which one you use.
Development in Linux is much easier than in Win (unless you do .NET of course).
I agree on 2 things- games and OO. Though I play nexuiz and this is all I need for now so even this is not an issue for me. OO sucks, but the new Win office releases are increasingly suckish....
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Well...
CFWhitman 4th Jan 2011
@wolf_z
1) You can get Win 7 problems fixed *anywhere*, just about by anyone. When you have problems to begin with, which is rarely.

You can get Windows problems fixed incompetently by just about anyone anywhere. You better know how to back up your own data or else not care much about it. People who actually know what they're doing usually aren't completely mystified by Linux.

2) No worries about hardware support.

Well, that kind of depends on the age of the hardware. Very new hardware sometimes doesn't work with Linux. Old hardware is more likely to work with Linux and not with Windows. There are a few wireless chipsets that never had a good Linux driver, but of course, the wireless in a System76 notebook will be Linux compatible. Part of the advantage of buying from System76 for Linux is that a lot of concerns along these lines will be taken care of for you (just like they are with Windows OEM installations, although you have to deal with the junkware that's also included).

3) No worries about running app XYZ, no funny interactions between applications, no *fiddling* to make things work.

I'll give you no worries about running app XYZ in a general sense (the caveats being that there actually do exist some desirable apps not available for Windows, and some older Windows applications don't always work right in Windows 7). If you have never seen a funny interaction between programs in Windows then you are most fortunate. If you have never had to fiddle to make things work in Windows then you must be satisfied with not having a lot of things work.

You don't have to fiddle with Windows as long as you are willing to accept Microsoft's version of what works and what doesn't and how everything should be set up. Otherwise, you are still going to have to fiddle. Really with a distribution that is pre-installed like on a System76 laptop you have the same general options, with the caveats that Chris already mentioned in the article.

It's true that Linux has greater appeal for me because I am the type that likes to be in control of my system, or at least have whatever level of control I feel like taking. I realize that this a "geek" appeal. I will never be the type that wants my computer to be like an "appliance." Of course I also feel like a general use computer can never really be an appliance. As soon as you make it into an appliance, it becomes a special use computer instead of a general use one. It seems to me that having a software center, like Ubuntu, is about the closest it can come. Of course, Ubuntu's software center is somewhat like a "walled garden," but it doesn't really have walls. If you really want to, you can go outside of it.

Finally, as a geek, Ubuntu isn't always the most appealing distribution to me (although I sometimes still use variations of it for when I'm feeling lazy), but I understand why people who are not as technically oriented would like a pre-installed Ubuntu.
@otaddy
I had heard about System76 from other sources and was checking out its product line the other night. This is not a new company. Nor is the model described above their lowest priced offering.

Your point about the mass market is correct and irrelevant. Here, we are not talking about macro trends in personal computing. We are talking about the use of a test unit by someone who is experienced with Ubuntu.

In your final sentence you hit a salient point, but you miss its importance.

There is some interest in Linux powered systems where the manufacturer has made smart choices in hardware and have tuned the os. System76 could be such a manufacturer and it bears investigation by those who have utility for a Linux laptop.

You are not such a person. Fair enough. I am (especially at a sub-800 price point) and I got something out of the review.
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@DannyO_0x98

If it were marketed and sold properly. (For example, include the multimedia codecs for gosh sakes.) Most users dont care about the open vs proprietary argument...they just want to be able to play their mp3's and watch dvd's.
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@otaddy
The simple answer is, if marketing Ubuntu or any form of Linux succeeds in increasing it's sales, then whoever was advertising will find themselves having to compete with every other computer maker out there who can now build and sell identical Ubuntu products to a more interested public without worrying about recouping any advertising expense.
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Good point.
otaddy 1st Jan 2011
@brendan@...

But if Linux had a lot of sales potential, then I suspect the OEM's themselves would pay to market it.
@otaddy@...
No. They get a kick out of adware they add to each machine, etc. BTW, Dell is selling Linux netbooks, but I hate Dell.
@otaddy The problem is you can't walk into a bestbuy and find a Linux laptop. I was unfortunate enough to have my laptop die while visiting my family over the holidays. There was not enough time to have something shipped before I went back to Japan so I was stuck with what I could buy from a brick and mortar. In the end I got a great ASUS laptop that runs Ubuntu perfectly but I am stuck with a Win7 license that I will never use.
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@zaphod778

Again, if linux had potential, and marketing, then OEM's would offer it.

And you should give Win7 a try, it is quite nice.
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Ubuntu Advertising Team
CassidyJames 3rd Jan 2011
@otaddy I'm one of the leaders of the Ubuntu Advertising team and we do have some advertising in the works. happy We'll be launching a few different ad campaigns this year, but ultimately, users have a greater reach than we do.

While we will work to land advertising deals in as many places as possible, that costs a lot of money, something that isn't flowing out of an open source project. We rely on volunteers and donations, mostly. In the future we'll be trying to land some partnerships with vendors such as System76 to help spread the goodness of Ubuntu. happy

If anyone's interested in joining, donating, or just learning more, our site is http://ubuntuadverts.org
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@CassidyJames

But as you can see, the grassroots approach isnt working. The average consumer sees Windows or Mac as their only choices.
@otaddy ARE YOU KIDDING ME??? There is already a huge amount of interest, do you know how to read????
0 Votes
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Doesnt look that way
otaddy 3rd Jan 2011
@Goldcds

Desktop linux has been stagnating for a long time now. Server and mobile are a different story and not relevant to this article. Can you comprehend what you read? (Only one ? is needed BTW.)
0 Votes
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Bringing AmigaOS To The Desktop
R.L. Parson 31st Dec 2010
"...the computers reminded me how much I liked AmigaOS and offered a glimpse of how easy a transition to AmigaOS could be if it simply came pre-installed on a high quality machine from a reputable manufacturer."
@R.L. Parson
Now that is funny. I am sure ~90% of supercomputers at that time ran AmigaOS.
Which Adobe tools are unavailable on Windows???
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Heavily invested
Dietrich T. Schmitz, ~ Your Linux Advocate 31st Dec 2010
That is subtle but important.
Is being platform dependant an issue that users need to consider?
Why not learn Gimp?
@Dietrich T. Schmitz, Your Linux Advocate... Being able to use the software tools you choose is important - "just learn [another package]" isn't that helpful.

Mac OS X is still Unix...

I run both, and both have their place. If it was my mother; I'd suggest the Mac. My "go to" system is a Mac. However I do have a self built system (a honkin' big one) and that's Linux. My Mac also runs lots of programs that would be more typically be thought of as "Linux" programs, and software that hooks into services being provided by said Linux system. Can't we all just get along?
@Dietrich T. Schmitz, Your Linux Advocate
If this were hobby/recreation time, I would and I have. When it's time to deliver for clients and employers, the budget for adding another cat-skinning method rarely exists.

Specifically, a couple of weeks back I was designing some business cards. I would have used Illustrator, but because of the Apple switch to Intel and there being no business justification for getting CS4 (or 5), I had to use Inkscape, which I've used before. Well, I had to spend some time learning how to do things, found myself wondering why some things that were bone-easy in Illustrator were so difficult in Inkscape (in retrospect, it is probably about the limitations of svg compared with postscript as an underlying page-building mechanism), paid my fare for the ride on the learning curve, and delivered a half-dozen well-received ideas to my clients. Worked four hours and billed two.

I have mixed feelings. I am proud that I solved my problem with no-cost software. I am happy that I am better prepared for the next problem in Inkscape's problem domain. But, really, I wish I could have used Illustrator CS2 and allocated a higher percentage of my time to graphic design rather than reading the manual and searching on line.

You seem to be more than a casual user of Linux, let's put it this way, if, for whatever reason, tcsh became the only shell available (and you were a sh/ksh/bash person), I'm sure you'd do what was necessary and learn csh. While you may not pine for the days when you were using well-practiced and now-second-nature idioms, for a while you'd be wondering if unfamiliarity meant you delivered something less than excellence.

Photoshop crackerjacks aren't automatically gimp crackerjacks. One can't expect high-functioning professionals to slip back into the pack, no matter how temporary, when the costs of the os and the creative suite are already budgeted into the business model.

Footnote: no cats were harmed in the production of this post.
@Dietrich T. Schmitz, Your Linux Advocate

Oh DTS, I'm not a masochist, there's also umteen better and cheaper graphics software on Windows better than Photoshop.

Platform independence doesn't matter for a graphics tool and Photoshop on PC and Mac provides a sophisticated tool that Gimp may become one day.

Do much graphics work do you?
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"I don?t hesitate to either fire it up in a virtual machine or just burn a CD and wipe out any of the various computers that tend to float around my house and install the operating system."

If you have to time to be doing that so often on a whim, then basically computers are toys to you more than tools. It further defeats the purpose of choosing Linux, because all you basically told me is, if you just want a computer as a status symbol, choose one with Linux since you won't be using the OS much. As for your MacBook Pro bogging down, load Windows 7 on it and it won't happen again.
You don't really have to give up any applications when you switch to Linux - just build yourself a Windows VM and put your old Windows apps in there. OK it's not quite a full switchover but it is what is required for a lot of users out here in the real world.
Sounds like some nice hardware, too bad linux cannot take advantage of it. The problem is that linux just isn't capable of such a task because it uses generic hardware drivers. This would explain the sound issue of only playing one sound at a time. Even good hardware cannot make the linux OS usable. You still suffer the same issues, incomplete or abandoned apps, downloading and recompiling code, and non-existant multimedia support. If you want to invest in dead technology then by all means go with System76 and linux.
Same old recycled comments.
Failed attempt at flam-war baiting.
@choyongpil
And yet my comments still hold true today.
  • Flagged
when zdnet posts a Linux related article. Than all Loverock does is put forth his usual FUD and than runs away and hides. He obviously has a vendetta against anything Linux or as many have said before he is a paid shill by you know who. His rambling are always out of context so as to create a disturbance in readers train of thoughts regarding the article informational substance.

If you remember Mike Cox's st-hick about him and his Microsoft reps lunching dates, that was at least funny and would give you a chuckle. People came to zdnet because Mike was funny, but you have to wonder what people really thing of Loverock Davidon constant belittling of anything Linux. I'll bet in the long run it costs zdnet readership.
@Loverock Davidson
Wake me up when you come up with a argument that isn't outdated.
@Zc456

WAKE UP WAKE UP! Now go read my post.
  • Flagged
@Loverock Davidson 1997 wants its comments back.
@anothercanuck
1980 called they want their joke back
  • Flagged
0 Votes
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You're so full of crap!
GoPower 31st Dec 2010
You're of the same mold as the idiot talk radio pinheads, just keep repeating lies and saying stuff you know nothing about.

@Loverock Davidson
@GoPower
not lies, these are from my own experience and that of others as well.
  • Flagged
@Loverock Davidson If you had any experience, which you don't...so go back to writing pro-Linux comments for one website and anti-Linux rants for this site...

Tell us what your experience is with ANY IT system...please...I've challenged you numerous times and every time you've basically run like the coward you are.
@Loverock Davidson
Ever heard of pulse audio? pretty much every major distro comes with it installed, it allows you two play more than one sound at a time and it has been around for a while now, so your comment doesn't hold true today.

And by the way maybe you should go tell the movie industry that they have invested in dead technology, i'm sure they would love to hear your expert? opinion.
@guzz46
Lovey writes the same comments over and over with no support to his claims, None.
He can not stand that others use Linux with no problem.
@Loverock Davidson

"Sounds like some nice hardware, too bad linux cannot take advantage of it. "

FACT: Linux can actually yield better hardware utilization than either Windows or Mac. That's why Bytworks, a local charity that assembles computers for the less-fortunate and trains them in their uses, uses Linux. The computeres are less powerful, so they have to use a more efficient OS: LINUX


"The problem is that linux just isn't capable of such a task because it uses generic hardware drivers. "

FACT: Linux uses device specific drivers if they are available, and generic ones if they are not. Kind of like, well, Windows.

"This would explain the sound issue of only playing one sound at a time."

Actually, no, the explanation you gave would not explain that at all, and even if it could, it's not true. Linux has been capable of playing multiple sounds since ALSA came around ( a long time ago, that is). As I have pointed out to LD numerous times, there are proffessional recording studios that uses Linux as their primary platform. Let me make this clear to LD -
THAT MEANS THEY PLAY MORE THAN ONE SOUND AT A TIME.

"You still suffer the same issues, incomplete or abandoned apps,"

No different than in Windows - if the mfg stops supporting an app, tough luck.

"downloading and recompiling code,"

Completely false.

" and non-existant multimedia support. "

As I said above, this is completly untrue.

"If you want to invest in dead technology then by all means go with System76 and linux."

Fitting abitrary statement to end a incoherent argument.

LD's reasoning is so bad, I really don't believe he likes Windows at all. He's just trying to make Windows advocates look stupid.

Happy New Year!
@Loverock Davidson as usual negative comments about Linux... I guess my idea of Multimedia and yours are different? your comment "non-existant multimedia support" about Linux. Why can I take a encryted DVD and in 45 minutes shrink it and copy it to a standard 4.7GB DVD in Ubuntu 9.10 through an application with a modern GUI and not a bit of coding required. I guess watching avi, divx, wmv, mp4, mov etc etc in VLC player isn't Multimedia and must be something else because Linux can't do multimedia!
I've used Linux for 4 years and never needed to "compile code" as there's always a .rpm, .deb, tar.gz available.

Your rants sound like someone that tried Linux years ago and still base your judgments on those old experiences.
@Loverock Davidson
You are throwing good jokes again Loverock! Good one!
"Most people just go to Dell, HP, or Apple, though, buy a computer, and use whatever OS came with it until it dies."
From what I have observed, this is true.
I have been using Linux for 6 years. After much Distro Testing, I am now using Debian and LInux Mint. As much as I have discussed Linux with friends, no one I know has made a move from mac or windows. People stick with what they know, until something forces a change.
paul http://fixpcblog.com/
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Ubuntu promise yet to be unleashed...
DoomsdayParanoia 31st Dec 2010
I think co-branding with Google will help.

System 76 could sell this as a pre-installed dual boot computer with Ubuntu & Google Chrome OS. I feel if Google pushes this product it could do wonders.

The potential of Ubuntu (& Linux) is yet to be unleashed. This tough economy can help as people look more frantically for value & savings. Once Linux reaches 'critical mass' there will be no stopping it!

Good luck Ubuntu!
I use Ubuntu, know very little about computers, and believe that if open office were as good as Microsoft Office, many more people would use open source. My computer is ridiculously fast, stable, and safe, which is what I believe most people are looking for. Unfortunately the presentations in Open Office look like a 3rd grader put it together.
@lizardwizard

My own opinion about presentations is that we've seen enough of them. Such presentations have unfortunately worsened rhetorical skills, and made some public talks unbearably slow and uninteresting. I know, it has little to do with the subject, but it's a matter that irritates me.

MS Office might be good if that's the way a user prefer to work. Unfortunately few produce decent Word-documents, still they ramble about macros, when they probably should invest some time learning LaTeX and get those documents right.

The strategy behind MS Office has yet another unfortunate drawback: it's promoting closed formats, sometimes by unjust means, something which works against future proof archiving of crucial documents. Again this has little to with Linux per se, but in a way it explains why an option, as the computer offer discussed, to choose and promote other computer strategies and methodologies are a good thing. The market is already damaged enough, costing society enormous amounts of money, something most just accepts as if it's the order of things.

This reply isn't really a reply to you lizardwizard, your post served as a stepping stone.
@KimTjik

LaTex - really? Word processing pass you by?

I remember back before word processors when an IBM programmer told me there was no need for wp because Tex was all you needed.

Glad to know someone still uses it, but sorry the rest of us have moved on.
Tony, Does not sound like you have moved on.
@tonymcs

It's intriguing how "moved on" is assumed to be an absolute positive. New isn't by definition better, and in this case we're not even talking about new and old.

If you choose a word processor instead of typsetting system is up to you. Still if we're talking about the quality of produced documents it can't beat LaTeX and that's also the reason for why LaTeX is widely used as a standard. I understand that you add sarcasm by writing that "sorry the rest of us have moved on", but I hope indeed you don't believe that's the real picture of how high quality documentation is produced, because it's not. If you by "us" mean yourself and people with the same computer habits, fine and it's probably true.

I've seen other changes as well, when developers unfortunately also have been fooled by what is new and hence falsely assumed to be better. Some GUI become very clumsy, with bad keybindings, when for some reason it was decided that the mouse is the centre of computing. We've sent several suggestions to a company about interruption in the work flow caused by flaws in software design. For years it was difficult to get good response (proprietary software and hence no chance to fix it ourselves), but when we this week upgraded to the latest version, several improvements has been made, or you could say reviving of "old" keyboard sanity.

In some cases "move on" is a good thing, but in many cases it's an attached quality to something inferior to already existing solutions. As long as we humans have two arms and legs, ten fingers and toes, two eyes and ears and a mouth, some design decisions will stay more sane than others.
Well done! Thank you very much for professional templates and community edition
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