ie8 fix

How to install Snow Leopard on a brand-new Lion-based Mac

By | July 28, 2011, 2:26am PDT

Summary: Installing Snow Leopard on a Lion machine is harder than you would think. This guide shows you the necessary tricks to make it work.

Mac OS X 10.7, better known as Lion, is an impressive update to the Mac operating system. In addition to its many important features, Apple finally removed one of my longest-running pet peeves and now allows you to drag windows from any side. Yay!

On the other hand, scrolling is backward (unless you tweak a setting), so you win some, and you lose some.

Where Lion can’t be used

I’m doing a specialized video project that requires a certain piece of software that only runs on the Mac. Knowing (or at least suspecting) that Apple was about to refresh the Mac mini, I held off on buying one until the new Lion machines were announced last week. At that point, I pulled the trigger on a Lion-based Mac mini server, and it arrived the next day.

I immediately installed the Canon EOS Utility and discovered…oops! Canon doesn’t support Lion for its DSLR cameras. A quick look at the Canon page shows support only for up to the previous version, Mac OS X 10.6, better known as Snow Leopard.

It’s also not clear how long it will be before Canon provides Lion support for cameras. A quick look at the company’s dedicated Lion-support page lists only printers, multifunction printers, and scanners. There’s no mention of cameras.

Being the intrepid geek that I am, I decided to ignore the version compatibility statements and just try running the EOS Utility software. Sadly, I was thwarted.

The problem isn’t limited to Canon. On July 22, Nikon announced “plans to test” their software for compatibility with Lion, but details about when the software will be compatible were limited to the vague statement, “We will announce our plans regarding full compatibility once testing is complete.”

It quickly became clear to me that, as much as I yearned for windows that can be resized from all sides, Lion wasn’t going to cut it for my particular DSLR processing needs. I would need to back-rev the machine to Snow Leopard.

That is easier said than done.

Next: The Rosetta problem »

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David Gewirtz, Distinguished Lecturer at CBS Interactive, is an author, U.S. policy advisor, and computer scientist. He is featured in The History Channel special The President's Book of Secrets.

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David Gewirtz

At various times during his adult life, David has voted for both Democrats and Republicans, and has been disappointed by both. He is deeply disturbed by how partisanship has come before patriotism in America, which gives him the freedom to pick on both sides.

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David is the executive director of U.S. Strategic Perspective Institute, a nonprofit research and policy organization. He is the Cyberterrorism Advisor for the International Association for Counterterrorism & Security Professionals, a columnist for The Journal of Counterterrorism and Homeland Security and a special contributor to Frontline Security Magazine. He is a member of the FBI’s InfraGard program, the security partnership between the FBI and industry. David is also a member of the U.S. Naval Institute and the National Defense Industrial Association, the leading defense industry association promoting national security.

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Biography

David Gewirtz

In addition to hosting the ZDNet Government and ZDNet DIY-IT blogs, CBS Interactive's Distinguished Lecturer David Gewirtz is an author, U.S. policy advisor, and computer scientist. He is featured in The History Channel special The President's Book of Secrets, is one of America's foremost cyber-security experts, and is a top expert on saving and creating jobs. He is also director of the U.S. Strategic Perspective Institute as well as the founder of ZATZ Publishing.

David is a member of FBI InfraGard, the Cyberwarfare Advisor for the International Association for Counterterrorism & Security Professionals, a columnist for The Journal of Counterterrorism and Homeland Security, and has been a regular CNN contributor, and a guest commentator for the Nieman Watchdog of the Nieman Foundation for Journalism at Harvard University. He is the author of Where Have All the Emails Gone?, the definitive study of email in the White House, as well as How To Save Jobs and The Flexible Enterprise, the classic book that served as a foundation for today's agile business movement.

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Install Snow Leopard (and Rosetta) into Parallels 7 in Lion
MichaelLAX 2nd May
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High Speed University
almabowman 28th Jul
Unemployment numbers are comprised of those that are in the job market for the past 30 days. It does not include those that have not been in the job market in the last 30 days: people who have given up looking; those that have gone off unemployment because it has run out. One solution to unemployment is "High Speed University" check it out
@almabowman You stink.
Degrees are worthless now, especially online diploma mills which spam and exploit peoples hopes.
Congrats on a very fine "how to" article, David.

For sometime, I've known that Lion allows multiple copies of itself to run on the same machine AT THE SAME TIME via the virtualization method. (there was a macrumors article on this subject on July 1st)

I was wondering if Snow Leopard could be run in a virtual machine that was running Lion? If that was possible, the need to use the "Boot Camp" to switch to different OS versions could be eliminated.

So, do you know if that is possible, David? I admit that you are a bigger geek than I am and would know the answer to that question. I humbly bow to your expertise in this matter.
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Contributr
@kenosha7777 I honestly don't know. I know there's been some press about how Lion is the first Mac OS X version licensed for multiple virtual instances, but I don't know if that precludes Snow Leopard from actually running. For my purposes, I'm using the machine solely for this video application and I need all the power the bare metal can provide, so virtualization isn't my first choice.

But I'd be curious if other readers had tried it. If you have, let us know.
or VMWare. Virtualizing Snow Leopard client requires some tricky hacks.
@fr_gough

Thanks. I may need to keep that bit of info ready for a rainy day event.
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@fr_gough - From my understaning and playing with virtualizing Snow Leopard (using VirtualBox), really the only tricky hacks I needed to deal with are display resolution and audio support. Everything else seemed to work just fine.

Note that virutualizing OSX on a Mac machine is the only *authorized by Apple" approach. Any other methods are considered a violation of the software's license (even though it can be done successfully if you do the right searches on the intertubes :)).
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@polly
fr_gough 29th Jul
doing the right searches on the "intertubes" will give you various hacks you have to use to make it work.

Virtualizing Snow Leopard Server on Parallels consists of inserting the disk and clicking Install.
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Talk about not doing your research before you buy... Always verify that the software you need will run on your new hardware.

There is a reason why Snow Leopard won't go on a new Lion gen Mac... Driver support.

Now you may think this is ridiculous, but guess what, it happens in the Windows world too. If it wasn't for the mess of Vista and XP software assurance, do you honestly think you could get XP onto new hardware? I am willing to bet with the advent of Windows 8, driver support for XP and Vista will disappear rather quickly for new hardware shipping with Windows 8.

Apple however, always makes it so that a New OS will go on a little older hardware, but an old version of the OS will not work on the new hardware. You need at least version of OSX that came with the Mac.

You may be able to work around that with a remote install, and target disk, never tried it personally.
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at all on the Lion Mac. It almost certainly won't be possible with the next hardware revisions.
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Contributr
@fr_gough Yeah, that worry was in the back of my mind, too. Certainly, Thunderbolt isn't available, but I don't need that now.
@fr_gough If a Mac ships with Lion but previously shipped with Snow Leopard, it's possible to "roll back". Apple may not recommend/support this but it is indeed possible and a viable option for folks who can not run Lion. For hardware revisions, like Macmini and MacBook Air which shipped ONLY with Lion (never shipped with Snow Leopard), it would be quite risky.
@Snooki_smoosh_smoosh That automatically makes Windows Vista drivers automatically compatible with Windows 8. Microsoft said from early on that Windows 8 would use the same system requirements as Windows 7 or even lower. Going from Windows Vista to Windows 7 was smooth, I used the same exact drivers I used on Vista.

Microsoft made significant changes to driver model going from XP to Vista. Part of the problem too is that driver developers hard code their drivers to look for the OS version. Thats part of the reason why Microsoft is taking baby steps with the kernel version (Windows Visa 6.0), Windows 7 6.1, Windows 8 6.2.
@Mr. Dee - 64-bit versions of Windows starting with Vista require drivers to be digitally signed.When you sign the drivers you specify, from a list of existing Windows versions, what the driver will run on. Since you can't really sign for a future version (with a few exceptions) there is no "automatic compatibility" for existing drivers (they won't work without being re-signed).
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@rbgaynor - That's a good point, however, even with 64bit Windows you can force a signed 64bit driver that "isn't compatible with this version of Windows" to install, you just need to know what the steps are.
@PollyProteus
it more often than not crashes the installation software, however, so you have to install using .inf files and the windows driver/device manager to change the driver from unrecognised/generic to the manufacturer's 32bit driver -- this works in some cases, with simple clean driver setups,
but in others, like many printer/scanner/allinones where (dubious) software tools are packaged along with the drivers it doesn't work at all.
it's a pity Microsoft's driver update doesn't pull the latest and best drivers from the manufacturer automatically, rather than make us use third rate generic drivers - perhaps it will work better in Windows 8...
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@Snooki_smoosh_smoosh
"Talk about not doing your research before you buy... Always verify that the software you need will run on your new hardware."

Talk about not doing your research before you POST!
Snow Leopard runs perfectly fine on the sandy bridge based iMacs and MacBook Pros -- it's the same god damned intel chipset that the new mac airs and minis are using -- same drivers!

Also, Windows has had the same driver model since vista -- and it's not going to change in windows 8 either (ballmer already said this as the above poster indicated).

Are you by any chance a blind mac fanboi who is lead on a string like a puppet by jobs & co!?

Anyways -- I had to put snow leopard on my new mac air -- protools doesn't run on lion and AVID has not said when it will...if ever!? Lion sucks imho -- way to many things that are broken or poorly designed. Snow leopard FTW!

Oh and btw -- it runs fine! The "driver support" is there -- it HAS BEEN there since the sandy bridge macbook airs and imacs were released months ago!
I read original story/post and most of the responses, but still am wondering if it is a good idea or not? I just bought a 6-core MacPro tower, which shipped with Lion on it. I also have an older MacBook Pro (with Snow Leopard 10.6.7), which I could use to downgrade the new MacPro's OS, right? I need to be able to install and run ProTools 9 on the new MacPro, but it's not currently compatible.

- Has anyone else downgraded a new MacPro with complete success?
- What are some of the potential problems of downgrading my 6-Core MacPro from Lion to Snow Leopard?
- Would it void my warranties/Apple Care?
- If I'm able to successfully downgrade, should I completely wipe the MacPro of Lion?

Thank you in advance for your responses!
@Snooki_smoosh_smoosh = iNaive
There are several ways to skin a cat. First, if you have used a previous version of MAC OS such as Snow Leopard, you may have a Time Machine copy of that OS. This can be applied to your new MAC and you may be just fine with that. If you have purchased a MAC product for the first time, you could either load a fresh copy of Snow Leopard on that new system, or just wait till apple has another solution for you. I have reformatted many macs in the past and they make it very easy to do this. All you need is a legal copy of the MAC OS and a little time.
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Hardware support
Joe_Raby 28th Jul
I wouldn't try this with a new SSD Mac.

Snow Leopard was updated to include support for TRIM, but was that option available as an installable update? I'm betting it wasn't. If you have a Mac installed with Lion, you should stick with it. Mac's aren't known for having good backwards compatibility, and if you're worried about that, you bought the wrong type of computer.
@Joe_Raby

Trim support became supported in a Snow Leopard update. For example, my SSD iMac initially had TRIM support disabled but when the last SL update was installed, TRIM support was enabled.

Bottom line .. No worries, Mate.
@kenosha7777

Their own support forum is inundated with questions about this, but their stance is that they only support TRIM on their own SSD's. If you put a third-party SSD in, TRIM isn't enabled. You can use third-party software to enable it. This is true even of Lion.
@Joe_Raby

Your right .. Apple supplied SSD chips are the only known supported devices that will have guaranteed TRIM support under SL and Lion.
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@Joe_Raby
Apple buys their SSDs from samsung and toshiba and they all run custom firmware. The custom firmware does something to the drives that makes them run OK for a long period of time without TRIM. Anandtech has confirmed this if you wanna google it -- prob. has a more technical explanation too along with actual benchmarks of 1-2 year old drives that don't slow down after usage happy


This would only be a concern if you have a 3rd party SSD.
@surge3@...

It all depends on how much use you get out of a drive. If you aren't doing a lot of writes, you could go a long time before TRIM will be needed. When you've already written more than XX GB that your SSD contains, new data will have to overwrite previously "erased" data. TRIM is an OS feature though, wherein those "erased" files have their data space scrubbed. It's called "garbage collection". Some SSD's have their own internal garbage collection mechanisms, but the feature has to be implemented at the controller level, not just in firmware (TRIM is a software handoff that the firmware can be programmed to allow though). The reason these came out was for enterprise companies that wanted to use SSD's in environments that didn't support TRIM in the OS (namely XP). Kingston sells a line that offers this functionality, but they carry a premium price, and for an OS that includes TRIM, they are unnecessary.
@Joe_Raby The prev. gen. MacBook Airs (October 2010) had SSDs too. So there's little reason to assume the SSD alone is any type of distinguishing factor as to whether a Mac will boot into 10.6 or requires 10.7.
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@ktappe

What I meant was that if you had to get Snow Leopard for a new Mac that shipped with Lion, you'd have to buy a retail copy. However, retail copies might not have TRIM support included, and I don't know that Apple would release that as a user-installable update, since SSD-equipped Mac's would ship with a version of Snow Leopard that included drivers and such designed for that configuration.

Also, there's no guarantee that Apple would backport driver support (with TRIM) to Snow Leopard for all of these new mSATA-style SSD's that they are now using. SATA/AHCI drivers may not be a problem to backport (if they even do), but Apple heavily customizes their EFI firmware and such and mSATA is still new, so there is not a lot of incentive for them to do it.
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Mr. Dee Updated - 28th Jul
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Contributr
@Mr. Dee That might actually be subject to some debate. As I recall, Windows 3.0 added drag cursors on all sides of the window, but that was around 1990 or so, during Bush I.

Previous Windows, if I recall (and I wasn't much of a Windows user back then) were tiled interfaces. I think you could resize the full set of tiles, but not individual windows by their sides. Does anyone out there remember?

If I'm right, then Windows didn't have it since Reagan, but certainly since Bush. That said, I still use and generally prefer Windows 7 daily as my primary getting work done OS.
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I haven't looked yet, but...
Joe_Raby 28th Jul
@Mr. Dee

...is Lion going to be required to develop for iOS 5?

Apple has a bad habit of requiring the latest OS to use Xcode.
I thought about this a lot, and then I had a revelation. When you look at the fact that Lion has one standard way of reinstallation - via the Recovery HD partition - you begin to realize that if the regular partition gets nuked, you have to download 4GB worth for the Lion reinstall, which may take a long time and a big hassle when you really need at your computer. If the Recovery HD partition also gets nuked, you have NO way to reinstall. I looked at my own Mac mini to see if there was some hidden install image somewhere on the drive. There was not. It seems as though Apple does a completely scripted install of Lion without the use of a single compressed installation image, which is what Windows Vista and 7 utilize. In essence, Apple's reinstall methodology is more akin to the way Windows XP works, wherein smaller packages are scripted to be placed in certain folders and such.

When I saw that, I thought all hope was lost, until I had my revelation: Lion is only $30 to download.

Now, if you buy a Windows PC and want to order reinstallation media from most OEM's they will charge anywhere from $0 (Dell is the only one AFAIK, and only if the system is in warranty), all the way up to about $45 to cover the cost of S&H. So $30 doesn't look too bad. When you download the image, you can follow the usual instructions of extracting the InstallESD.img and dumping it to DVD or an 8GB USB thumbdrive. I'm sure that you can find an 8GB thumbdrive for less than the $40 extra that Apple is going to charge for it (they are going to charge $70 for Lion on USB). Of course, it also gives you upgrade rights to all of your other Mac's too.
downloaded from the App store pretty easily. Just google for it.
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Exactly my point
Joe_Raby 28th Jul
@fr_gough

Thanks, but I said that already. There just doesn't appear to be any free method to create removeable media (a real install image, not just a backup) from a new Mac that ships with Lion. You either have to pay $30+cost of media to DIY, or $70 if you want Apple to do it for you.
On Windows 7, you can create a system image of either Vista (Complete PC Backup) or Windows 7's system image, you can then attach the image through Disk Management in Windows 7, browse and copy files from the system image. Also, Windows is backward and forward compatible. Most modern machines still support Windows XP or Vista. I can install Windows 7 on a 7 year old machine, Mac OS X Lion can't install on a 7 year old Mac (why, PowerPC).
@Mr. Dee

Win 7 (and Vista, for that matter) could always be installed on a machine 7 years old.

The problem with a 7 year old computer (if one doesn't upgrade the hardware inside first) is that certain features of Vista and Win 7 might not work. (Aero, for one thing)

That being said, your statement is correct.
@Mr. Dee
PowerPC and lion is 64bit.
XP may install on some hardware but lack drivers on some.
Well brings a smile to my face when I hear Mac people discovering technology shortfalls for the first time. Given the percentage of PC platforms in the world running Windows and the speed of adoption of Windows 7 the most stable environment since W2K, if you want to be different and simplify life with a Mac then guess you will have to put up with Job's shortfalls. All those features first discovering on Lion and now Snow Leopard, wow they are all old hat to Windows. Switching OSs never could be easier then the Windows Easy Transfer method in W7. Even reaching back to XP now problem getting immediately back to your old comfortable desktop. And Speed, well try beating W7 boot time with gadgets and addons turned off, rivals linux variants. And with all this you get a Globally support OS. Yes you can keep your little Apple, but I think this just takes another Bite out of it.
Cal Woosnam
i would like to know why you even need this software anyway? what does it offer? i have the same camera and i just have an SD Card Reader that i connect via USB and import my photos. from there, any editing software you could need can be used (iphoto, photoshop, aperature, etc).

is canons utility that great?
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Contributr
@stguitar@... It's not Canon's software specifically, it's that software in combination with a special vertical application project I'm working on. The remote management features of the camera become essential when you can't get behind the camera itself to control it.
This will definitely be a problem for me. I have an Okidata C3300N network color LED printer, and the OS X drivers require the installation of Rosetta to work. Granted that there's an alternative driver that is actually meant for various Unix flavors (which I use on my two Linux boxes), but it's alpha quality.
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RAMChYLD Updated - 28th Jul
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As is often the case with Apple, many details are forgotten or skipped in the name of cutting edge progress (and stopping users from using FileMaker 6 and the likes). Often, all that's needed is a six to 12 months wait, so that Apple gets its stuff right, and that clever minds can find workarounds for stuff that Apple doesn't care about. But for now, as much as I though Snow Leopard was a sleek and cheap upgrade, they would have to drag me with a chain, to get me to buy either Lion or any Lion-equipped Apple computer. Too bad...
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Why going to so much trouble?
rhon@... 28th Jul
I too tried to install a version of Snow Leopard on a brand new Lion Machine. It seems indeed impossible to boot up from a Snow Leopard Installation disk. As I have learned the hard way that Apple has lousy customer care if it comes down to an old OS, I always hold a clone of a hard disk somewhere. So by holding down the option key you can still boot up from your external hard drive with Snow leopard on it. than you format the SSD or Harddrive using your snow Leopard boot up hard disk and look, suddenly it is accepting the Installation disk.
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Contributr
@rhon@... Good suggestion. I don't think that'll work for those who (and I might be wrong on this) have new Macbook Air's with only Thunderbolt, but it would have worked in my solution. Still would have required two Macs (I didn't have a pre-installed Snow Leopard on a drive, I didn't have Snow Leopard at all), plus your approach would have required using an external drive. This worked out to actually be less hardware.

But, if you keep a bootable partition around on a spare drive, that's a darn good idea.

For the record, my old Mac was running the Leopard install from 2008 and I hadn't seen a need to upgrade it. It's not a daily use machine.
why do you need the canon utility? why not just use an SD Card Reader and import via the finder or iphoto? then you could use whatever program you wanted to use for editing and ill bet its a better than what canon makes...
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Contributr
@stguitar@... The Canon utility provides a remote management function for the camera. You can effectively control everything you'd do from dials and the viewfinder on the Mac or PCs screen. When you don't have physical access to the camera, this becomes important.

As I said, this is a specialized application, not just random snapshot taking.
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Congradulations
mikroland 28th Jul
You can now maximize a window! That's only been missing for what, 20 years? Sad.
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OS X. It's called the zoom button, and it will expand the window to fit its contents, or if the contents are wider/taller than the screen, to the width/height of the screen. What Lion does is allow you to put an app in kiosk mode.

As a side note, the only reason Windows users think maximizing to full screen even when the window content doesn't require it is vital is because of the Windows crappy UI that sticks the application menu in the application window.
Very timely article, as I imagine a lot of OSX Lion users may be looking to do this right out of the box. OSX Lion turned my Quad-Core/8GB iMac into an iPad, took away support for my PPC-based Photo Shop app I've been running for years, turned my mouse pagination backwards with no way to correct it, and proved way to "buggy" for prime time. Lion is a flop as far as I'm concerned. It's beginning to look more and more like just a gimmick to force people to sign-up for the App Store to bring up Apple's App Store subscription rate. Pretty lame if you ask me.

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