ie8 fix
madison

Are we ready to declare the "time of death" for the enterprise data center?

By | August 22, 2008, 10:11am PDT

The announcement this week of the launch of Amazon’s Elastic Block Store (EBS) has added another vital piece to the overall cloud computing picture. The EBS announcement is particularly significant since it takes the gloves off when it comes to meeting the demanding needs of enterprise class computing requirements. We can now source our software, computing, storage, and applications where it makes the most overall sense.The Elastic Block Store finally makes it practical, cost effective, and relatively easy to put traditional storage and processing of very large amounts of data in the cloud from a credible vendor.

While Amazon has been offering extremely inexpensive, highly flexible, on-demand computing power over the Internet for several years, up until now their Elastic Compute Cloud (EC2) had a maximum associated storage capacity of less than two terabytes or required the use of their powerful but non-standard storage services, either S3 or SimpleDB. More significantly, though Elastic Compute cloud instances had decent amounts of storage for some organizations, they could not load up and run in a practical amount of time, on-demand. The Elastic Block Store now makes it possible to have dozens, and potentially hundreds, of terabytes of readily-accessible persistent network storage in a traditional format of choice, particularly relational databases, all at commodity prices.

Enterprise Cloud Computing and The Future of the Data Center

The Elastic Block service also considers reliability and backups first class citizens (as do enterprises) and effectively offers all storage in a replicated, RAID-like environment. EBS also has an innovative snapshot capability that allows block storage to be imaged quickly onto S3, so that a time-sequenced set of backups can be created and made available whenever needed for restores.

Amazon’s CTO, the esteemed Werner Vogels, took a deep dive into the Elastic Block Service on his blog this week.

Economies of Scale: The New Cloud Commodity

Amazon has been consistent about the purpose of its infrastructure Web services from the beginning; they are committed to redefining the economics of computing by using their massive infrastructure to achieve best-of-breed economy of scale. In this, they have been quite successful and the numbers tell the story…

The new Elastic Block Service has a similar pricing model to Amazon’s other infrastructure services and you pay only for what is used. At 10 cents per gigabyte per month for storage and 10 cents per million I/Os (cached reads/writes are essentially free), 10 TB of completely utilized storage (i.e. filled with business data) with round the clock use by 5,000 enterprise users performing an average of 10,000 I/O requests per hour would result in a bill of only $4,600 per month. This is a remarkable figure and shows the economies of scale that Amazon is prepared to offer to organizations willing to leverage it.

The advent of a true commodity cloud computing solution that allows the operation of traditional computing applications of choice, a capable backup strategy, major economic advantages, combined with a vendor that has proven stability and a long-term future, and the result is a recipe for serious change in how enterprise computing can be achieved for many organizations.

Jeff Schneider, CEO of SOA firm MomentumSI, posited to me today that recent developments make the writing on the wall clear: We might just be ready to declare the “time of death” for the enterprise data center, and I’m hard pressed to disagree, even if it will take most organizations 2-5 years to realize it.

Now, don’t get me wrong, I don’t expect most organizations to move wholesale to services like EC2 + EBS immediately, far from it. For one thing, enterprises are notoriously slow moving and risk averse when it comes to major IT changes. And certainly there will be a great deal of early skepticism from many quarters about such a strategic shifts, some of which will be valid and much of which will not be. But it’s fairly clear that the classical multi-hundred thousand square foot proprietary data center is a dinosaur of another age, like mainframes are for most organizations today.

Objecting to Outsourcing the Data Center

Though most businesses are quite comfortable in using external utility services for electricity, water, and Internet access — and we even use banks to hold and pool our money with others “offsite” — we are still largely unready to move computing off-premises, no matter what the advantages. The classic challenges stand in the way, including proving out how to secure, manage, trust, govern, and fully exploit the benefits that cloud computing can offer. Worse, we have to do the hardest thing of all, change the way we think and work. Fortunately, the advent of Software as a Service (SaaS) has helped pave the way for Platform-as-a-Service and we’re frequently readier than we think.

One of the core principles of Web 2.0 is “Software Above the Level of a Single Device.” This has taught us the strategic value of 3rd party open APIs, widgets, and many other forms of 2.0 era distributed computing in the cloud. Today, the best applications tend to use resources from the best source, wherever it lies on the network. Whether that’s a Google Map widget using Google’s vast server farm and location data or a SugarCRM instance running on EC2 and EBS matters not. Increasingly, we can now source our software, computing, storage, and applications where it makes the most overall sense.

For several years now, business leaders have wanted to open up their organizations strategically to the cloud. Cloud computing can theoretically make make this more manageable and less impactful on the overall enterprise by providing access to almost unlimited on-demand, partitioned resources so that SOAs can be more federated, distributed, and scalable.

And at this point in the very early stages of the cloud computing era, that’s probably the best way to look at it. Because I’m not advocating that we mindless push all our computing requirements out to the cloud to reap simple economic benefits, the discussion is far more strategic than that. However, we do owe it to ourselves and our businesses to seriously consider the benefits of locating our computing environments in the right place where it makes the most sense with a full sense of the various considerations that impact us. When we do this, however, the equation will inevitably balance out more and more towards outsourcing much of our data centers.

Core IT applications such as HRM, CRM, and ERP as well as line-of-business application may seem like the last that will go to a cloud model. But while they certainly won’t be the first, they may actually not be far behind when IT managers weigh the total overal benefits, particularly during an upgrade cycle. If there will be a lag, it will likely be in the upper tiers of the Fortune 500, where the sheer size and complexity of the IT landscape will impose it’s own delays. Thus, the traditional data center won’t disappear overnight, but it will almost certainly shrink on a regular basis from now on.

Finally, it should be pointed out that software products are often years ahead of the market. This is no different with cloud computing and many vendors have actually been in the space for years now. But the relentless forces of commoditization and competition are having their say as well and cloud computing offers up very substantial bottom-line returns. Throw in an economic downturn and a round of enterprise cost-cutting and the market and cloud computing seem ready to meet.

Be sure to read Enterprise Cloud Computing Gathers Steam to see how the cloud computing/PaaS space is rapidly filling out from a vendor perspective.

Are you looking at cloud computing for your enterprise? Why or why not? And what are you planning to do?

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Dion Hinchcliffe is an expert in information technology, business strategy, and next-generation enterprises.

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Dion Hinchcliffe is an expert in information technology, business strategy, and next-generation enterprises. He is currently Executive Vice President of Strategy at Dachis Group. A veteran of enterprise IT, Dion has been working for two decades with leading-edge methods to bridge the widening gap between business and technology. He has extensive practical experience with enterprise technologies and he consults, advises, and writes prolifically on social business, IT, and enterprise architecture. Dion still works in the trenches with clients in the Fortune 1000, government, and Internet startup community. He is also a sought-after keynote speaker and is co-author of several books on 2.0 subjects including Web 2.0 Architectures from O'Reilly as well as the upcoming Social Business By Design (due Spring, 2012.)
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And why would I suggest to any corporation use remote storage
rdhalsteatzd 26th Aug 2008
Except for the cost I can't imagine any corporation, or individual using remote storage or apps for that matter.

Much of the data I used to handle and the equipment on which it was stored was *required* to be under direct control of the corporation. In this case it was an FDA regulation, but their reasoning should apply to all corporate data.

For the individual the RIAA and MPAA would love to have centralized storage. Never mind it's your personal collection you've stored for backup.

OTOH "Cloud Computing" is a ridiculous term for served applications and storage. It's basically, electronic outsourcing.

I think it will be a long time before major companies are willing, if able, or in many cases be allowed to do so by regulation.

Me? Even on a personal level I'd spend the extra money to "do it myself" and avoid the so called "Cloud Computing" like the plague.
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Cheap
arrowrod 22nd Aug 2008
How is cloud computing cheaper for huge corporations?
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Never mind pesky EULAs and licensing...
HypnoToad 22nd Aug 2008
If it's similar to using Photoshop's web edition, that states anything you use with their product becomes THEIR property, even cloud computing's theoretical silver lining won't bother to show up.

Ownership society. This "standardization" and "assimilation" also puts too many eggs in one basket. Not to mention the LACK OF tweaking it to fit unique needs of various organizations.

Some might call it "socialism" too. grin
centers around the world. Even a large enterprise will have a hard time matching the cost. They will have an even harder time matching the peak performance, and the ability to double the processing power and/or storage on demand for just one week.
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No enterprises are using...
bjbrock 22nd Aug 2008
the cloud for things like this. Only individuals and small companies that don't want to pay for there own internal IT.

In fact, bloggers are the only people even using enterprise and cloud in the same sentence. The enterprise certainly isn't.
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Re: No enterprises are using...
jurquhart 22nd Aug 2008
Hmmmm.

Some time ago, Jeff Barr, lead Amazon Web Services evangalist, noted that their fastest growing revenue stream was from large financial services companies. Sounds enterprise to me.
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Your bank and credit card records
Uncle Caleb 25th Aug 2008
Do you really want your bank and credit card records out there with Amazon?
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They already are!
MobyMud 25th Aug 2008
What a silly comment! In fact, anyone that you have EVER send a check to has all the information they need (unique signature, bank account number, bank routing number) to suck your account dry until you hear that slurping sound. Put it this way... I can fit the name, account number and zip code (all needed to process a charge is the zip code and account number) for everyone in the US on one tiny SD card. I remember back in the day when I was leaving a bank with a 9-track magnetic tape (the one you always see in the movies) I had to have all sorts of permission. Well, those tapes hold only 200 megabytes. So, the chip in my treo can hold 80 tapes! Can you imagine back in 1990 a guy walking out of a bank with 80 tapes? that might get some attention. Now, of course, it is invisable. And the hard drive from a laptop? You can store a full page of information for every living person in the US.
But, why even bother with all that, why not instead transmit the data via Verizon or 3G to a waiting server?
All scary stuff. So, the moral of the story is:
1) Amazon and many other companies already have many credit card numbers, bank accunt info, and much more of yours. The fact that they store that or have bank info directly is meaningless
2) Stealing from a bank is much easier than you could imagine. Most polities and procedures in banks are to make everyone feel good and to generate a certain amount of fear. Someone clever can get the goods, and get it out, without a problem.
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No, they're not.
bmerc 25th Aug 2008
Amazon does not have my bank account number on file. I've never provided it to them. The issue isn't individuals choosing whether or not to give their information to a vendor. It's about enterprises outsourcing their data to third parties.

"Put it this way... I can fit the name, account number and zip code (all needed to process a charge is the zip code and account number)"

You're ignoring the core issue, which is that one must first gain access to the original data itself.
The fact that you are able to store large amounts of data does not itself pose a security risk.

Think about a kid shoplifting. The size of the backpack is not the problem, it's the act of stealing in the first place.

As soon as a malefactor is able to connect to and retrieve confidential data, it's game over.

The question is, who do you trust with your data, ahd more importantly, do you automatically trust a third party just because someone else does?
instance. That is the complete application, not just the platform.
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Application vendors will flock to EC2
jurquhart Updated - 22nd Aug 2008
I wrote a post today that reflects one of the real opportunities created by EBS: the ability of anyone with a Linux application to quickly and easily create a subscription-based cloud offering. Get ready for a flood of press releases with something like "XXX is proud to announce the availability of XXX YYY 2.4, Cloud Edition. This fully functional version of YYY is available on a subscription basis in the highly respected Amazon Web Services compute cloud. Billing is via DevPay, and is YY? per transaction/gigabyte/hour."

http://blog.jamesurquhart.com/2008/08/why-every-linux-application-known-to.html
from open source components.
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Some are thinking too large
Rotkapchen 22nd Aug 2008
Most large companies outsource a lot of their computing to companies like IBM and EDS and those contracts are worth BILLIONS. A large portion of those contracts are simply to provide computers and software to all of their employees.

EDS holds the largest number of Microsoft licenses because of all the images they install for major companies.

What happens to EDS's bottom line when companies get those images directly from Microsoft?

Technologists are making the same mistake that marketers often do. There's more than one way to spin a product around capabilities/attributes.
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not quite
dinosaur_z 25th Aug 2008
Yes, they provide thousands of client desktop/notebooks with MS licenses, but corporate data centers are providing more than just MS licenses on client desktops.

- disaster recovery planning and backup hot sites, for example: when hurricane Katrina was on its way across the Gulf heading toward New Orleans, major clients were relocated to alternate data centers within hours and far in advance of it hitting the Louisiana coast.
- electronic vaulting of vital records - many corporations are required to retain various records 7, 10 years or permanently.
- multiple mainframe images running virtually on the same physical box

Also, corporate data centers are smaller now, because "mainframes" are now as small as servers. I read an article sometime back that, today, if you go into a computer room of a large corporation with both mainframes and servers, you could hardly tell the difference between them.

When I see stories like this about the death of the mainframe, it shows that the writer does not have a very realistic idea of the size and complexity of just one Fortune 500 corporations IT infrastructure.
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Like I Said to Bill
Rotkapchen 22nd Aug 2008
In the late 80's Bill Gates was still just another 'guy' in Seattle. He still showed up to local events as a featured speaker. At one of those events, during a small gathering around him afterward I asked, "When are you going to separate the data your applications create from the applications themselves?" He said, "I don't understand your question."

This is the same situation. Technologists don't understand the question.

The answers are in the question. IT needs to start asking better questions.
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Premature death pronouncement
Bozhidar 25th Aug 2008
Another controversy laid title at ZDnet. Actually, you cannot compare utilities to data storage services, since data storage service is nowhere near the reliability level of utilities. And ofcourse there is much more in reliability of data storage services then there is in electricity or water.

When software will be manufactured with the same quality and security controls as a Volvo, i'll start trusting Data storage as a utility!

I did a text on the subject on my blog
http://www.shortinfosec.net/2008/08/cloud-computing-premature-murder-of.html


Spirovski Bozidar
http://www.shortinfosec.net/
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Are you actually paid...
Media Whore 25th Aug 2008
... to write twaddle like this?

Or do you not pay attention when Google and Amazon have "glitches" that force Google Apps and S3 "off the air" for long stretches, affecting hundreds of thousands of people? And if a backhoe cuts a major fiber condiut, or a fire knocks out a NOC?

Just as my data should stay with me, a company's data should stay with the company.
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They're not paying attention
photog7 25th Aug 2008
MW,
They're not paying attention. None of them can think past their own experience, and they think the Internet is a reliable network. I agree with you. The medical community, for example, cannot lose access to medical charts just as someone is going into surgery because a squirrel chewed the wrong wire in another state. Many of us use redundant servers, redundant memory SIMMs, redundant storage, and even redundant power systems so we don't have to rely on the power company or anyone else. Too many of these comments show a lack of understanding of the term "mission-critical" computing. Very often, LIVES are at stake. There are actually some things MORE important than your credit card data. Medical charts are just one example--there are thousands of large practices and hospitals with IT departments who aren't going to rely on the Internet as a vehicle to storage.
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Are you sure you said this right?
deowll 25th Aug 2008
"there are thousands of large practices and hospitals with IT departments who aren't going to rely on the Internet as a vehicle to storage."

I can see them using rented space off site as a back up in case something really bad happened at their site. Fire or what ever.

I'm a lot less inclined to think smart businesses would be willing to forgo having the active databases at their own sites.

On the other hand I know some data is being stored this way by school systems.

Of course we can normally afford to waid a day or so if we must.
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How Secure Is It?
kingle1 Updated - 25th Aug 2008
I have a hard time imagining that companies with sensitive/secure (read 'personal') data will buy into the cloud wholesale any time soon. By that same token, is Amazon willing to be held legally and/or financially accountable for the loss of credit card numbers or SSNs or other sensitive/secure data from their systems? The liabilities seems staggering...
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RE: Are we ready to declare the
malebrun@... 25th Aug 2008
I think it is pretty humorous to read how folks are worried about security in a cloud data center. It's as if having the data under your own roof under lock and key will keep it "safe." Ha! A good movie - a guy, dressed in all black, dropping face-first from the ceiling to only inches from the floor of a weight-sensitive data center floor in order to sneak off with "files." Like I said, it's a movie. . .

Face it, if your own company's data center is connected to the public via the Internet, it can be compromised. The only way that you can be protected is a closed loop - and then because the info isn't accessible, it isn't very valuable.

It's coming. Cloud computing, a separation of the application and the data, and remote storage of data. It's not only cheaper, but it makes sense.
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More to the point ...
RationalGuy 25th Aug 2008
Face it, if your own company's data center is connected to the public via the Internet, it can be compromised. The only way that you can be protected is a closed loop - and then because the info isn't accessible, it isn't very valuable.

Your data center is connected to you LAN, which has computers with users' names and passwords on Post-It Notes attached to the monitors or "hidden" under keyboards. It's much easier to compromise a company's security through the janitorial service than through the firewall. I've seen smart companies dedicate security resources to escorting cleaning crews through buildings to ensure they are ONLY cleaning.

That being said, the data center will never die in the enterprise. Until all the legacy apps (running on 10 year-old hardware, taking up probably 20 times the space and power they really have to) are gone, there is no way to push their functionality to "the cloud".

The cloud computing model will change the way enterprise data centers are approached and built. Some companies may never outsource their IT to external clouds, but rather will use similar technologies and approaches to achieve better results.
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do not directly hook their mainframes to the internet. They have separate web servers for public web sites and the rest are behind firewalls.

I haven't heard of anyone hacking into a mainframe system in many years. I would guess, the security breaches are into the web servers.
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Once we connect to the internet, or any external network, we are farming out at least some of our data and certainly our applications. we are, none of us, securely fortified in safe houses. if you don't agree, turn off your anti-virus software for a few days.

so, why not at least enjoy some of the efficiency advantages of the MASSIVE computing power available through cloud solutions?
might also lead to energy savings and lower carbon impact. hope so. don't see why it wouldn't
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This makes no sense...
bmerc 25th Aug 2008
"Face it, if your own company's data center is connected to the public via the Internet, it can be compromised."

Anything that a human being can touch can be compromised. That's not the point.

Security isn't about eliminating any possibility of abuse, it's about minimizing the chances.

The notion that because Amazon already has some people's financial information therefore my bank should store everything there is just silly.
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RE: Are we ready to declare the
mr1972 25th Aug 2008
No the cloud isn't ready. This new service is linked to Amazon's Web Service agreement. Here is the second clause:

Amazon Web Services? Customer Agreement

Updated April 16, 2008


PLEASE READ CAREFULLY - THIS IS A BINDING CONTRACT

THIS AWS CUSTOMER AGREEMENT ("AGREEMENT" OR "AMAZON WEB SERVICES CUSTOMER AGREEMENT") IS A BINDING AGREEMENT BETWEEN AMAZON WEB SERVICES LLC ("AWS") AND YOU AND, IF APPLICABLE, THE COMPANY OR OTHER LEGAL ENTITY YOU REPRESENT (COLLECTIVELY, "YOU"). THIS AGREEMENT INCORPORATES BY REFERENCE (1) THE PRIVACY NOTICE ("PRIVACY NOTICE") AND (2) THE CONDITIONS OF USE ("CONDITIONS OF USE") POSTED ON WWW.AMAZON.COM, AS THEY MAY BE MODIFIED BY AWS FROM TIME TO TIME.

BY CLICKING THE "ACCEPT" BUTTON FOR THIS AGREEMENT OR ACCEPTING ANY MODIFICATION TO THIS AGREEMENT IN ACCORDANCE WITH SECTION 2 BELOW, YOU AGREE TO BE BOUND BY THE TERMS AND CONDITIONS OF THIS AGREEMENT. IF YOU ARE ENTERING INTO THIS AGREEMENT ON BEHALF OF A COMPANY OR OTHER LEGAL ENTITY, YOU REPRESENT THAT YOU HAVE THE LEGAL AUTHORITY TO BIND THE LEGAL ENTITY TO THIS AGREEMENT, IN WHICH CASE "YOU" SHALL MEAN SUCH ENTITY. IF YOU DO NOT HAVE SUCH AUTHORITY, OR IF YOU DO NOT AGREE WITH THE TERMS AND CONDITIONS OF THIS AGREEMENT, YOU MUST SELECT THE "DECLINE" BUTTON AND YOU MAY NOT USE THE SERVICES.

Welcome

This Agreement includes the following Sections:

1. The Services
2. Modifications to this Agreement
3. Term, Termination and Suspension
4. Authorization and License to Use the Services
* Permitted Uses Generally
* Restricted Uses Generally
* Accounts and Keys
* Monitoring
5. Authorized Use Policies for Specific Services
* Amazon Associates Web Service?
* Amazon Simple Storage Service? (Amazon S3)
* Amazon Simple Queue Service? (Amazon SQS)
* Amazon Elastic Compute Cloud? (Amazon EC2)
* Alexa? Web Services
* Amazon Flexible Payments Service (Amazon FPS)
* Amazon DevPay Service? (Amazon DevPay)
* Amazon SimpleDB Service? (Amazon SimpleDB)
* Amazon Fulfillment Web Service (Amazon FWS)
* Amazon Web Services Premium Support (AWS Premium Support)
6. License to Use Amazon? Properties
7. Downtime and Service Suspensions; Security
8. Fees
9. Confidentiality
10. Intellectual Property
11. Representations and Warranties; Disclaimers; Limitations of Liability
12. Indemnification
13. US Government License Rights and Export Controls
14. Disputes
15. Notices
16. Miscellaneous Provisions


1. The Services

The services covered by this Agreement include both free services that AWS and its affiliates (referred to together herein as "we" or "us") make available for no fee (the "Free Services"), and services that we make available for a fee (the "Paid Services"). The Free Services and the Paid Services are referred to collectively in this Agreement as the "Services." Each Free Service and Paid Service is referred to individually as a "Service."

1.1. Free Services. The Free Services include the Amazon Associates Web Service, Alexa? Site Widgets, Amazon FWS and all other web services that we make available to you free of charge on the Amazon Web Services-branded or Alexa?-branded web sites accessible from aws.amazon.com (collectively, the "AWS Website"), except those web services for which we specifically provide a separate customer agreement.

1.2. Paid Services. The Paid Services include all web services and any related support services that we make available to you for a fee on the AWS Website, except those web services for which we specifically provide a separate customer agreement. Our Paid Services include, but are not limited to:

* Amazon Simple Storage Service (Amazon S3)
* Amazon Simple Queue Service (Amazon SQS)
* Amazon Elastic Compute Cloud (Amazon EC2)
* Alexa? Web Information Service (AWIS)
* Alexa? Web Search
* Alexa? Top Sites
* Alexa Site Thumbnail?
* Amazon Flexible Payments Service (currently in limited beta) (Amazon FPS)
* Amazon DevPay Service (currently in limited beta) (Amazon DevPay)
* Amazon SimpleDB Service (Amazon SimpleDB)
* Amazon Web Services Premium Support (AWS Premium Support)

If you use Amazon FPS, you may incur fees for transactions that you submit through the Payment Service provided by Amazon Payments, which is described in Section 5.7 below. We may, in our sole discretion, (i) begin charging fees for a Free Service, in which case such Service will thereafter be deemed a Paid Service, or (ii) cease charging fees for a Paid Service, in which case such Service will thereafter be deemed a Free Service.

2. Modifications to this Agreement

You agree that we may modify this Agreement or any policy or other terms referenced in this Agreement (collectively, "Additional Policies") at any time by posting a revised version of the Agreement or such Additional Policy on the AWS Website or our "Developer Connection" pages accessible at http://developer.amazonwebservices.com/connect/index.jspa. The revised terms shall be effective as follows:

* if the revised terms are (a) for any Paid Services which we are adding at the time of the revision, (b) for Amazon FPS and Amazon DevPay (currently in limited beta), (c) for the Privacy Notice, (d) for the Conditions of Use, (e) for any AUP (as defined in Section 4.1.2), (f) for any other general terms and conditions applicable to our services, web sites or other properties, or (g) for any Free Service, then the revised terms shall be effective upon posting (unless we expressly state otherwise at the time of posting); and
* if the revised terms are otherwise for any then-existing Paid Services, then the revised terms shall be effective upon the earlier to occur of (a) fifteen (15) days after posting and (b) if we provide a mechanism for your immediate acceptance of the revised terms, such as a click-through confirmation or acceptance button, your acceptance.

By continuing to use or receive the Services after the effective date of any revisions to this Agreement or any Additional Policies, you agree to be bound by the revised Agreement or any revised Additional Policies. It is your responsibility to check the AWS Website and the Developer Connection pages regularly for changes to this Agreement or the Additional Policies, as applicable. We last modified this Agreement on the date set forth at the top of this Agreement.

Basically Amazon now effectively owns your business information.

The first and most important cloud computing question to answer is Data Ownership. When you outsource your banking to a bank there are legal and social contracts that stipulate you still own your money. FDIC is an insurance policy that guarantees if the bank goes under you can get some or all of your money back. In other words, the bank gets to use your money for their business but if they really screw up, you are not necessarily harmed by their mistakes. On the other hand we can see how outsourcing a companies banking has really worked. When the economy tanks in one sector it ripples all the way through the entire corporate structure but that is another conversation.

On point what legal and social agreements does Amazon give it's customers??
There are no guarantees that Amazon or Google will be here in 5 years. Amazon and Google hope they will be but do you want to bet your business on them? Cool instead of managing a closed LAN you manage your vendor relationships. Now you have less control of your own company and rely on third party vendors for your profitability. How is this responsible to your shareholders??? "Sorry we missed our numbers this quarter but Google docs was down for 48 hours and their tech support staff was on vacation for the long weekend. You under stand don't you??? You still want to invest in our company don't you???"
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RE: Your post
fatman65535 25th Aug 2008
While a long read, it was an interesting one to say the least.

What really burns me up are those who are like lemmings and ready to jump off the cliff by embracing the "cloud".

The "cloud" has been discussed at our place, and I am not in favor of it.

Because the first day we are "down" to a "cloud burst" is the day management will be screaming "do something" and we will be sitting there twiddling our thumbs while the "cloud" decides to 'fix itself'.

That train wreck waiting to happen is one that I will, fortunately, not be present to witness.

That is because I have made my position very clear.

The day you move to the cloud, is the day I QUIT!!!
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Sorry for the legnth.
mr1972 25th Aug 2008
I should have just linked to the Amazon EULA but a lot of people just don't read them carefully enough and they end up agreeing to things they don't really understand.
Most of the new cloud companies all have EULAs that have a similar clause in them. Basically they almost have to for legal reasons. If they want to spin off their data storage business in the future and focus on application hosting, they need to be able to do this with out a lot of lawsuits from their old data storage customers. What happens when Amazon needs cash and sells off it's platform in order to raise money? They simply let everyone know that they are selling part or all of their platform to a third party and if you don't like tough. The third party vendor may have an even more draconian EULA that you need to agree to or their fees may be outrageous. Now what do you do? You look for another vendor and hope you can get your data out of Amazon's/third party's hands and into another vendor of your enterprises choice.

The issues of cloud computing have nothing to do with technology. The tech is already mostly there. It is a legal, social, and economic problem that nobody wants to tackle. It may not even be possible. The world wide web would be impossible to build in 2008/2009. The legal, ethical, moral, and economic issues would plunge such a project into an abyss of infighting and bureaucratic nonsense.
It would be great if a free market could solve the problems of cloud computing but realistically it is going to take governmental legislation.
We will need laws that define what data "is" and who has rights to it. We will need governmental backing of insurance policies that mandate by law tech support response to third party vendor down time.
Legislation to support acceptable security levels, insurance for data breaches that exceed these levels and a continuing examination of adopting new security measures.

Once most of these questions are answered then cloud computing can move forward.
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You know that is an issue. Companies get bought and sold or go under for all sorts of reasons.

Once you have signed on to some of these deals I don't think you can actually sign out because the cost would be staggering.

Kind of like the AT & T statement about web hosting. We want to host your site but the name of the site will be ours if you leave.

I'm not even sure you could get all your data out either.

Some creeps might even try to sell "generic" non personal information based on it.
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It all comes down to economics.
richard233 25th Aug 2008
Yes, really.
There are the simple cost factors where you save money by not dedicating resources to maintain servers (computers, space, power, workforce) vs the cost charged to access the data pool (subscription costs, migration costs, bandwidth) and it will also have to do with the trust factor.
Is the information available to me when I need it.
Is the information secure from those I don't want
to see it and what is my liability if they do manage to access it.

If they manage a system where you can cache the
information locally for the parts that are critical for the reports management wants and
they encrypt the data sufficiently to provide the
CYA factors, and they manage to save enough
money, it will succeed, otherwise it will fail
as miserably as many of the dot coms of the early
2000's.
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It is a decent answer for small businesses and non mission critical applications. It is a good way to further back up data with encryption.

I'm not sure a major company should bet everything on having a good relataionship with another company forever.
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RE: Are we ready to declare the
K4thwright 25th Aug 2008
This blog falls in the same category with other fairy tales I've
heard since computer use became common decades ago: (a)
computers will make it possible for us to live in a paperless
society; (b) I know of a company that was able to replace its
whole accounting department with one person and a
computer; (c) "I'm from the Government and I'm here to help
you". LOL.
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This is another "You'll have a thin client" or "We'll all be using P2P for our storage".

Maybe for John Doe's Tire Company this is a good model but for those that have federal regulations to adhere to this is a No-Go from the start.

I wouldn't even use it for personal use because I don't know who has access to the data, how it will be used, or the integrity of it.
While the cloud concept may work for some smaller
companies (virtualizing your business on Google or
Amazon or whatever service you choose), one thing that is
happening which may be a bit more realistic is that
companies are migrating physical systems to their own
virtualization hosts (be they running WIndows or Linux or...
using VMWare, Xen or some other virtualization system).
This cuts down on the physical number of hosts in the
data center (somewhat like a mainframe does) and reduces
the electrical draw for servers and network equipment
needed. This the placed the requirements on the internal
staff to be versed in virtualization, networking and systems
administration/management skills (resource management,
network management, etc.).

Some may choose to use services like Google or Amazon,
where they are given a virtualized system image (Amazon
uses Fedora, iirc), thus they provide a system for the
consumer (client) that provides all the resources that they
would otherwise be managing locally, but without the
electricity and physical system requirements. The systems
is a s simple as that.
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RE: Are we ready to declare the
phatkat 25th Aug 2008
The reports of my death have been greatly exaggerated.
-- Mark Twain
The data center will remain the mainstay for most large organizations for awhile. I think that some middle and small organizations can migrate to the this model of computing but each organization will need make that decision based on its needs.
The real issue with cloud computing is security. With all of those security breaches we have read about the problem is with security with all of these nodes and how to prevent possible problem in one node affecting other nodes.
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But you're not going to sell your Car.
Same thing for Data Centers.

Those who can afford them will cherish having their own- Those who don't will use public transportation.
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Can AWS gather Point of Sale data for 60,000 cash registers?
<meta name="robots" content="noindex" /> Updated - 25th Aug 2008
Here's my customer's business problem potentially for AWS. Tell me with certainty that AWS can handle this so I can then tell my customer that they no longer need their data center:

I have a customer with 600 stores and about 100 POS (Point-of-Sale devices AKA Cash Registers) per store. That's 60,000 terminals gathering data each day in what we call "Market Baskets" (e.g. records of what's in the retail customer's shopping carts). Therefore, it's mainly tranactional data of products sold that day. I've made it easy for AWS to handle my problem as they don't need to deal with all aspects of transacting with my customers--specifically they don't have to ship me 60,000 of their AWS-compatible bar code tag laser scanners or security tag removal/loss prevention accounting devices. All they need to do is interface with my Point of Sale devices which can each be assigned their own IP address.

Another 2% of everything reported by the POS is product returns. The POS also tracks new credit card applications, gift cards issued, used, or recharged. The only communication that AWS needs to do with these 60,000 POS terminals is contact them at the end of the business day to upload the transactional data securely to our corporate retail data warehouse. From there, we load/update several data marts which then update their hypercube models, generate reports, and then email them to two retail analysts per store (1200 analysts). All of this has to happen between 10 p.m. when the store closes and 8:00 a.m. when the analysts read their reports.

And, one proclaims that AWS is ready today to handle this business problem? Better verify it with Amazon, but if you do, come tell me about it so I can tell the good news to my 600 store retail customer. Oh, don't forget...it needs to work really well during my customer's major sales during Thanksgiving Weekend and every week in December.

After you ask Amazon WS if they can do this (and they tell you politely, "no, we can't do that yet...") ask them if they can help my other customer process banking checks (simply optically scan them, print on the back of them, and then box them and/or sort them & stuff into envelopes to be mailed back to the person who wrote the check.)

And, after you ask Amazon Web Services that question, ask them if they can print payroll checks with ink that can't be removed by a counterfeitor. My third customer will be pleased as punch.

Lastly, I've got a 4th customer that prints insurance Statement of Benfits and then stuffs them into envelopes addressed & postage applied...ready to go!

If Amazon Web Services gets back to you and tells you, "no, we don't have all those capabilities yet"...then write another article for us reporting back as to when they expect to have them.
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I think the big data services could run any software you want but at some point they aren't going to be able to save you much if any money by doing it unless you are doing something wrong. They have to show a profit.
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RE: Are we ready to declare the
ceh4702 25th Aug 2008
Make sure you read the fine print. Looks like lots of room for "That's not covered under the contract!" wonder what happens when a Hard Drive fails. How fast will you be able to do disaster recovery?
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Economies of Scale cut both ways
joey1234 Updated - 25th Aug 2008
If you're a hacker, what would you concentrate your efforts on? A data centre holding one company's information, or a data centre holding 1000's of companies' information?

It only needs to be breached once, and everyone's data security is compromised.

To those who make an analogy with putting your money in a bank, there is a difference. You don't trust a bank's physical security. You don't care. You know that if money is stolen from the bank, the bank takes the hit, not you.

This doesn't apply to SaaS. If they allow your data to be compromised, you're screwed. Unless the hosting companies take liability for consequential loss (and I don't think they ever will), SaaS is basically doomed except for some specific, low-risk applications.
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RE: Are we ready to declare the
franmidi 25th Aug 2008
Security and access to data are the number one priorities of any data center, either local or cloud.

We've seen what happened to TJX with possibly millions of credit card information stolen. Multiply that by the number of companies in the "cloud" and the exposure becomes much greater.

One thing completely left out is any EMP effect. Imagine a terrorist knows where a cloud is located and detonates even a small nuclear device in the sky. The resulting EMP would knock down most electronics and electrical transmission in that area. More thinking & planning is needed before any company releases all processing to a cloud .....
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RE: Are we ready to declare the
gdgtgrl 25th Aug 2008
Something I also don't see mentioned here is that there was a huge outage of S3 a few weeks ago that caused a bunch of web startups to also have an outage. While my company outsources it's data center it's not a cloud. We own the servers - we just don't manage the facilities. Most enterprise systems are mission critical and can't be sent off into a cloud.
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I remember...
Karlkoenig 25th Aug 2008
The death of the mainframe, (never happened). This won't happen either. Just another way for consultants to stir the pot and sell useless un-executable strategy.
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Exactly. Bored Consultant = Bad Info
dunn@... 26th Aug 2008
Somebody at one of the large clueless consulting firms (you know who you are) has nothing on their plate or is pushed by management for a publication.
This is the result.
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RE: Are we ready to declare the
wolfje 25th Aug 2008
what I think there line's In life.
end I f somebody dont see why do ppl just get
along? with something what ppl dont like to have ppl need to choose in what ever ppl like to have or to do!
Except for the cost I can't imagine any corporation, or individual using remote storage or apps for that matter.

Much of the data I used to handle and the equipment on which it was stored was *required* to be under direct control of the corporation. In this case it was an FDA regulation, but their reasoning should apply to all corporate data.

For the individual the RIAA and MPAA would love to have centralized storage. Never mind it's your personal collection you've stored for backup.

OTOH "Cloud Computing" is a ridiculous term for served applications and storage. It's basically, electronic outsourcing.

I think it will be a long time before major companies are willing, if able, or in many cases be allowed to do so by regulation.

Me? Even on a personal level I'd spend the extra money to "do it myself" and avoid the so called "Cloud Computing" like the plague.

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