IBM'ers poles apart on Google Plus

Summary: Two colleagues who work for IBM have expressed experience based opinion on Google Plus. They represent views that are at different ends of the spectrum.

Two colleagues who work for IBM have expressed experience based opinion on Google Plus. They represent views that are at different ends of the spectrum. One has fallen instantly in love with Google Plus, the other is circumspect. One is deeply engaged with the socialised world, the other is deep into transactional systems. Both are super smart. What's going on?

Luis Suarez says:

Starting another week @ work with perhaps one of the boldest moves I can remember in the last four years, perhaps next to #lawwe: moving my Twitter streams to G+' // Just unfollowed 150 folks this morning & moved them to Circles over here; waiting for the other 300 to join and then my conversation days on Twitter are over. Only looking for density of information at this point. Let's see whether I'd regret such move or not. Catching up with the streams now...

If you are on Google Plus and have Luis in one of your circles you can see the stream of conversation that ensues. He is interested in the engagement noting at one point:

...if things continue to grow, like they are, and if G+ doesn't mess things up, it's been a long [time] since I have seen this level of interaction, engagement and participation, as well as growth in numbers than in any other social network. And that coming from the folks who surely understand a thing or two about scalability

Vijay Vijayasankar on the other hand is much more concerned about technical matters. He lists things that strike Vijay as issues including the lack of third party apps, forcing people onto Picassa, search issues and the like, concluding that:

What is the point of a pre-beta when you can guess 9 out of 10 people will provide the feedback that all these things are expected as a minimum?

On the topic of whether it is fit for enterprise, Vijay says:

I saw some well respected analyst friends of mine terming Google plus as “disruptive” and “enterprise class”.  Most of the reasoning seem to be along the lines of how pundits told us how Wave  will change how business processes work in future . After all I have described above, I find it hard to agree .  Well, if they mean it as a future dream – sure, that is possible. At the moment, it is not enterprise worthy in my opinion. Forget “facebook for enterprise” for now – it needs to mature a lot more. And for long term viability in enterprise – facebook equivalency is just tablestakes. If facebook for enterprise is the vision – i would give facebook the most chance of making it, and not google plus.  Duh !

One of those analysts would be me. I see things very differently.

More to the point, do you see the fundamental difference in belief systems at work here? Luis has issues - as we all do - with what Google is attempting. Regardless, he is getting on with it to see where it goes. I'm very much in that camp. Nothing that went before has intrigued me so much and sparked (sic) so many thoughts about how Google Plus might be used in an enterprise context. None of what I might wish may come to pass but it is making me think. And like many others, I value the quality of interaction.

Vijay on the other hand seems to be taking a much more mechanistic view. That's not a negative statement but simply how I parse his comments. But it is Vijay's last point that is of greatest interest.

Last thought – just like “old generation” enterprisey companies find it hard to understand the business model of  “new generation” consumery companies , I think the new guys have the same problem in reverse too.

At the risk of being accused of mind reading, this is what I believe is at the heart of Vijay's concern and which represents the enterprise battlefield of the future. For Vijay, Google just doesn't 'get' enterprise, something with which I would have agreed, prior to seeing Google Plus. Even now I consider myself out on a limb in hoping that the enterprise penny has dropped for Google. For me there is something else going on here that right now I only see in outline.

I don't care whether Google Plus beats out Facebook, draws attention away from Twitter or any other social network because I will move to where the action is taking me. I care about the quality of information I can get from trusted sources I know today and may come to know in the future. I care about having choices in the way I interact that reflects the variety of media at our disposal but I don't want to be running around among applications. I care about being able to restrict conversations to people for whom it is important yet still want to broadcast from time to time. I want to bring people in and out of conversations as the occasion demands.

Like JP Ranagswami, I want to effortlessly filter in the same manner I do in the real world and not worry about what I might miss going on in the firehose while at the same time handling the in-moment requirements I have today. And I want it all archivable and searchable so that I can go back and reference what went before because history matters and memories are short.

In other words, I want Google Plus to be a digital reflection of my world as I experience it and wish to express it but not in the transactional sense that Vijay is alluding to. If it can. That, I sense, is where the enterprise needs to recognise the reality of what's going on and where the biggest challenges lay.

Topics: Social Enterprise, Apps, Google, IBM

About

Dennis Howlett is a 40 year veteran in enterprise IT, working with companies large and small across many industries. He endeavors to inform buyers in a no-nonsense manner and spares no vendor that comes under his microscope.

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28 comments
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  • RE: IBM'ers poles apart on Google Plus

    Yours is a sophisticated view of collaboration that is much less tool-centric than what I've heard from other pundits. That's good.

    Dennis D. McDonald
    Alexandria, Virginia
    http://www.ddmcd.com
    ddmcd
    • RE: IBM'ers poles apart on Google Plus

      @ddmcd - thanks but I'm not sure I've managed to express it terribly well. I have that 'looking through the glass darkly' feeling at the moment
      dahowlett
      • RE: IBM'ers poles apart on Google Plus

        @dahowlett My complaint with social networks in the past has been how badly they simulate real world relationships which are complex, changing, and messy. Google+ is making a better run at representing the realworld than anyone else I've seen. It's not perfect yet, of course, and I can't imagine how they will be able to permeate their entire portfolio in a way that is seamless and easy to use. But it's a good fight and I wish them well. For some reason, I also have more trust in what they are doing than others who have tried in the past. Hope they sustain it.
        ddmcd
  • I see the disconnect now

    Dennis,

    I am in between both camps right now, I am not like Luis or You (fully committed to see what happens), nor am I am staying back. I simply have the "enterprise approach" and the reason G+ is not enterprise-ready.

    You say

    "I don?t care whether Google Plus beats out Facebook, draws attention away from Twitter or any other social network because I will move to where the action is taking me. I care about the quality of information I can get from trusted sources I know today and may come to know in the future. I care about having choices in the way I interact that reflects the variety of media at our disposal but I don?t want to be running around among applications. I care about being able to restrict conversations to people for whom it is important yet still want to broadcast from time to time. I want to bring people in and out of conversations as the occasion demands."

    And I believe this is at the heart of the enterprise-adoption problem. Enterprises are not like you and Luis: dynamic, flexible, and willing to try something new that is appealing. Well, the organization overall is not, while there may be some "skunkworks" projects here and "proof of concepts" there, it takes an organization some time to make those changes -- and G+ is not even at the beta level yet!

    I like your conviction, and Luis approach, but I cannot take the time to make the move to see if the "there" is there. In the quote from Luis you showed, he expresses some concerns about the validity of the move long-term, and my concerns are probably more.

    I see this as the next FriendFeed, good engagement, better control of social graphs, easier to engage, but I still see this as a very early Alpha product and some of the missing features (good mobile, search and discovery that works, semantics that work, integration beyond Google's suite of products, API that exists, and many more) as deal-breaker for an organization to take on - especially in these days.

    Google may have hurt their chances at enterprise adoption by trying to generate a buzz to stall Facebook's rise (Twitter already took care of that on their own, with their founders leaving and locking horns with developers) and I am not sure if this "hurt" will continue long-term.

    Time will tell, until then - or until some of my larger concerns get addressed - I will remain a passive adopter and be thankful for people like you and Luis and many others to show me the way.

    Makes sense?
    Esteban.Kolsky
    • RE: IBM'ers poles apart on Google Plus

      @Esteban.Kolsky - absolutely makes sense Estaban. I think it is important to point out how profound I see the potential for G+. Provided Google doesn't muck it up. In the meantime, I'll continue to see how it evolves ands be prepared to have egg on my face, It won't be the first or last time!!
      dahowlett
  • RE: IBM'ers poles apart on Google Plus

    I would say lets wait and watch..no harm in trying new things...old one is always there
    vishalll
  • What makes it enterprise class?

    Seriously....what features and components make it "enterprise"? Google just released a ton of services to Google Apps domain users. It managed to break as many things as it putatively fixed. Nor was Google+ included. Google continues to fail to cohesively integrate their tools. The enterprise does not need a 100 butter knives when they are looking for one good steak knife.
    Your Non Advocate
    • RE: IBM'ers poles apart on Google Plus

      @facebook@... i think you are putting too much into what the enterprise wants... they don't even know there is steak being served, less along knowing they need a steak knife yet.

      the butter knives are fine for now, we barely just sat down at the table and are now being served bread and butter -- a steak knife would be too much.
      Esteban.Kolsky
      • RE: IBM'ers poles apart on Google Plus

        @Esteban.Kolsky I think you are not giving enterprises due credit. They have a steak in front of them and need to cut it up. Google is only providing butter knives to perform the task at hand.
        Your Non Advocate
      • RE: IBM'ers poles apart on Google Plus

        @facebook@ (I cannot reply below your reply - platform limitations) - seriously, you think that the enterprise is aware of what they have in front of them? in a trend that is barely starting to affect the rest of the world and midst the many other problems they are facing -- they already know and understand the power of collaboration and social?? they already have their plans and strategies in place and just need a tool to help them deploy them??? i talk to many, many, many different organizations everyday - and over 80% of them have not yet even invested in thinking about what to do beyond pilots, proof-of-concepts, and trials.
        Esteban.Kolsky
      • I have a different view

        @Esteban.Kolsky I am a consultant for Fortune 500 companies. Although many companies may sweat the minor details, I have found most have engaging internal collaboration strategies and social media. Sure, there are probably quite a number of IT groups that are mired in the past, thinking if they install Plone and run a blog they are somehow collaborating. But, overall, the business gets it and look for ways to communicate effectively.
        Your Non Advocate
    • RE: IBM'ers poles apart on Google Plus

      @facebook@...

      Why should google+ be integrated into google apps for the domain at this stage? It shouldn't... It's designed to be a personal social network and hasn't got business pages yet. It's also designed to be global, and not for an organization.

      As far as all of your analogies, you make too many of them and you have effectively obfuscated your point. Your post says essentially nothing other than "Google Apps does not have Google+ yet and a few features were broken in Google Apps." How about some specifics of what got broken, what tools you want to see, and what tools are replicated... I suppose if you don't actually have a point it's much easier to talk about cutlery, because atleast a knife has a point, unlike your post.
      snoop0x7b
  • Different perspectives

    First off - other than the fact that I work for IBM, this blog Dennis refers to is my personal view, and should not be taken as IBM's view on the matter. I am not qualified or authorized to represent IBM's opinions here.

    I am neither an analyst (like Dennis) nor am I an expert in social computing (like Luis). I am probably the least active in the social media amongst the three, although I use twitter and write a couple of blogs every month or so.
    So my perspective is formed from my experience working with my clients, and how they perceive something that comes out new. On the vision on G+ - lot of people including me would rather listen to these two guys and not me. My rant is based on "average Joe" using the platform for first time. And it didn't work for me, and "average Joe" does not wait around infinitely for it to get better.

    For me - grand future vision is something I leave to experts like Dennis and Luis. If I am to be impressed - I need tangible proof points that it will work for me and for my clients. At the moment - I think all the enterprise talk of G+ is just based on a hope that Google gets it. I am not sure if Google themselves ever said they are chasing enterprise market either.

    A lot of oohing aahing on G+ - or signal/noise ratio as experts say, is only because in pre-beta, only social media geeks are let in. If Dennis and Luis communicate on twitter, email or phone - I expect a certain high quality. G+ does not make it any better. In other words - if G+ kicks out Dennis and Luis tomorrow - I expect no decrease in quality in the excellent information they share. Wait till every one else joins into G+ - and I expect the "I took the dog for a walk, and bought popcorn on the way" conversation to come in, and then we can get a realistic nature of signal/noise ratio.

    Enterprises sell vision, but buy mechanics. So once the mechanics matches the vision, this "transactionally rooted" dude is going to watch casually from the side lines. I have no issues getting back to G+ if it changes for the better in future, and I feel I will get some value out of it later.
    vijayasankarv@...
    • RE: IBM'ers poles apart on Google Plus

      @vijayasankarv@... Google has said there will be a 'business' version. The point about it working for you is pertinent. As I said elsewhere, I am actively working at it so that you don't have to!!
      dahowlett
  • circles - real vs perceived need?

    First off, Google+ is a much bigger threat to Twitter than any of the other relevant social networks. That is where the value of Circles lies.

    People are very good a tuning out noise, much better than any filter or grouping you can set up and maintain. It is much easier to tune someone out, or if they get hyper annoying to shut them up (defriend, mute, etc).

    There is also the idea of a time and a place, I certainly post different content on FB, LI and Quora. FB gets my social life, LinkedIn my professional life, and Quora my nitty-gritty questions.

    Will Google+ allow me to do all this in one spot, with all the inherent advantages of the aforementioned networks? I doubt it.

    What you can say w/o a doubt about circles is that the feature geeks won and the UX crowd lost. I haven't seen such a geeky interface on a mainstream product in years, there is no way in hell grandma is going to get Google+.

    I get it, the folks at Google had to differentiate and let the cards fall where they may. I just don't have to like it.
    mobile_manny
  • RE: IBM'ers poles apart on Google Plus

    Great post Dennis.
    Having spent 13 years as a sales executive at IBM, it seems to me that the voice missing here is that of a systems person. That's the person brought into a customer to show them how to re-engineer their business processes to take advantage of new technologies. When the IBM PC first came out there was a similar internal dialogue to what you describe here. But in the end it was the systems people who harmonized the two points of view.
    tnemelka@...
  • RE: IBM'ers poles apart on Google Plus

    " I care about the quality of information I can get from trusted sources I know today and may come to know in the future."

    Right there is the problem. I trust Google far less than any other company I can name off the top of my head.

    You can use Google services but all your data are belong to Google.
    mswift@...
    • RE: IBM'ers poles apart on Google Plus

      @mswift@...
      Did you accidently type Google when you meant facebook?

      In other news, facebook has blocked another extention to prevent you from extracting your own data.
      anono
    • RE: IBM'ers poles apart on Google Plus

      @mswift@... <br>I also don't get what people mean when they say Google owns your data. Sure if you have email with them, the data is on their server, but doesn't that apply to any email service?<br><br>Also if you are concerned about ads, which site doesn't have ads? The fact of the matter is the only reason the internet is free is because it is driven by ad revenue. Take that away and you are paying to visit sites. <br><br>So to sum it up, regardless of which corporation you have email/ social network with, they already have your data in their server and they already spam you with ads. The only difference with Google is that they are able to combine the two together to give you relevant ads, where as if you use some other services you might get random annoying ads (at least much more often than you will with Google)
      anono
  • When does anyone do any work?

    As someone who has so far missed out on the Twitter "revolution" I guess I just have one question when I read stuff like this: when does anyone do any work? You know, the sometimes-unpleasant hours of employer-directed heads-down tasks when one generates the income stream that pays one's salary?

    sPh
    sphtest