Google calls Microsoft-Apple collaboration on Nortel patents anti-competitive

By | August 3, 2011, 1:06pm PDT

Summary: Google is accusing the coalition that recently purchased 6,000 Nortel patents as engaging in an anticompetitive strategy.

The gloves are officially off, as of a Google blog post on August 3: Google is accusing the coalition that recently purchased 6,000 Nortel patents as engaging in an anticompetitive strategy.

Those fighting words came from David Drummond, Google Senior Vice President and Chief Legal Officer. The blog post — entitled “When Patents Attack Android” –follows on a report by the Wall Street Journal late last week that the U.S. Department of Justice was scrutinizing the purchase for potential anticompetitive angles.

The Nortel patent purchase was finalized on July 29. Microsoft is part of a consortium that purchased for $4.5 billion about 6,000 patents from the bankrupt Nortel (which, at one time, was a Microsoft strategic partner). Comprised of Microsoft, Apple, Ericsson, EMC, Sony and RIM, the consortium beat out Google for the bundle of Nortel telecommunications-focused patents. Apple contributed the lion’s share ($2.6 billion) to the consortium’s patent pool. Microsoft originally signaled it wasn’t going to bid on the Nortel patents, as it had a comprehensive patent cross-licensing deal in place which officials said covered the patents that were on the block.

From: Drummond’s blog post:

“Android’s success has yielded something else: a hostile, organized campaign against Android by Microsoft, Oracle, Apple and other companies, waged through bogus patents.

“They’re doing this by banding together to acquire Novell’s old patents (the “CPTN” group including Microsoft and Apple) and Nortel’s old patents (the “Rockstar” group including Microsoft and Apple), to make sure Google didn’t get them; seeking $15 licensing fees for every Android device; attempting to make it more expensive for phone manufacturers to license Android (which we provide free of charge) than Windows Mobile; and even suing Barnes & Noble, HTC, Motorola, and Samsung. Patents were meant to encourage innovation, but lately they are being used as a weapon to stop it.”

(The $15 per phone figure is not confirmed and may be more like $5 per phone, but that’s just an aside)

Drummond said the goal of those who purchased the patents it to make Android devices more expensive for consumers. The implication is the Android phone makers will have to pass on patent royalty fees they are paying Microsoft and Apple to customers because they’ll no longer be able to get the operating system for free.

I’ve asked Microsoft for comment on the Google post. If and when I hear back, I will add it.

Update: Microsoft PR told me the company wasn’t commenting on Google’s blog post. But Brad Smith, Microsoft Senior Vice President and General Counsel, just tweeted the following (which is somewhat related, but not directly addressing the Nortel patent issue): “Google says we bought Novell patents to keep them from Google. Really? We asked them to bid jointly with us. They said no..”

So… I guess that’s a semi-comment and not a complete no comment (?)….

Update No. 2
: I asked Google last night for comment on Microsoft’s Novell comment. (Are you confused yet?) I received no response. But today, Google updated its Android attack blog post and included information on Microsoft’s Novell comment. From the update:

“It’s not surprising that Microsoft would want to divert attention by pushing a false “gotcha!” while failing to address the substance of the issues we raised. If you think about it, it’s obvious why we turned down Microsoft’s offer. Microsoft’s objective has been to keep from Google and Android device-makers any patents that might be used to defend against their attacks. A joint acquisition of the Novell patents that gave all parties a license would have eliminated any protection these patents could offer to Android against attacks from Microsoft and its bidding partners. Making sure that we would be unable to assert these patents to defend Android — and having us pay for the privilege — must have seemed like an ingenious strategy to them. We didn’t fall for it.”

(Thanks to FOSS Patents’ Florian Mueller for the heads up on Google’s post.)

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Mary Jo has covered the tech industry for more than 25 years for a variety of publications and Web sites, and is a frequent guest on radio, TV and podcasts, speaking about all things Microsoft-related. She is the author of Microsoft 2.0: How Microsoft plans to stay relevant in the post-Gates era (John Wiley & Sons, 2008).

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Mary-Jo Foley

Freelance journalist/blogger Mary Jo Foley has nothing to disclose. WYSIWYG (what you see is what you get). I do not own Microsoft stock or stock in any of its partners or competitors. I have no business ventures that are sponsored by/funded by Microsoft or any of its partners or competitors.

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Mary Jo Foley has covered the tech industry for 25 years for a variety of publications, including ZDNet, eWeek and Baseline. She has kept close tabs on Microsoft strategy, products and technologies for the past 10 years. In the late 1990s, she penned the award-winning "At The Evil Empire" column for ZDNet, and more recently the Microsoft Watch blog for Ziff Davis.

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steveymacjr1 Updated - 4th Aug
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That was stupid.
William Farrell 3rd Aug
@steveymacjr1
happy
@William Farrell: ... would not be "anti-competitive". ;)))
... and got outbid. Calling it a foul game afterward sounds like a bitter loser.
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Increcibly stupid...
i8thecat3 4th Aug
"Patents were meant to encourage innovation, but lately they are being used as a weapon to stop it.?

Patents are meant to keep scumbags from stealing IP... And should those scum bags steal that IP, then patents can be used to stop the lying, cheating, scum bags. And Google knows that they are the lying cheating scum bags and those tools have the gall to whine about it.... Increcibly stupid... Google can go rot in hell for all I care... Google Sucks...
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Google's claim has merit
richardgarrick 4th Aug
@LBiege

I disagree. I believe Google was trying to buy the patents to keep the owners from making a claim against them. The patent system is meant to encourage risk. Google is arguing that these patents are enforcing the dominance of one group of phone makers over another.

I do not believe trying the buy the patents diminishes the claim.
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@steveymacjr1 I find it hard to take any idiot seriously if they can't get an OS's name correct after nearly a year. If you're trying to push your opinions on others, at least get your basic facts right. This whole "story" is just a sign that Google is panicking (justifiably perhaps) about a potential threat. Any level headed person would not want Android hamstrung as the competition breeds innovation and improvement to all competitors improving to stay alive - the end users reap the benefit. Even so, Drummond should do his research. If the Guy at the top can't do it, that doesn't bode well for the rest of the organization.
@steveymacjr1 It's not Windows Mobile dumbass. It's Windows Phone. If you can't even get the name of the OS right, how can anyone take you seriously.

As a platform, WP Mango wipes it's butt with Android.
@JoeHTH Really it wipes "it is" butt with Android? If you want to be pedantic about semantics other people can do it to you. Also, generally questions end with "?" So when you say to him "How can anyone take you seriously," you need to add a question mark at the end of that. I grade your post an F.

Also WM was the predecessor to WP7... The previous release of WM was WM6.5. I don't really think that distinction matters that much when you consider the fact that they incremented the previous version number.
So does this mean that Google can copy anyone's innovation, give it away for free, make a boatload of money with ads and then cry a river when the innovator sues them? I understand legal action may not be the best way forward, but Google could do so much in Android because it could copy instead of creating from scratch. Nice innovation Google!
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meh
hoaxoner 3rd Aug
@browser.
Buying a patent portfolio simply for the sake of litigating against a competitor, a la Oracle, MS, and Apple is fairly disgusting.
@hoaxoner
So if one can copy Google's search engine code [similar to how Android copied Java], copy their search architecture [similar to how Android copied iPhone] and copy their ad business [similar to how Android copied MS malware ;)] and start a search engine, giving away the ads at 1/10th of what Google is charging, would it be ok with Google? Looks like its ok according to Google's top lawyer. Oh, one of my copycat partner has created a page that looks exactly like Google's [sorry Samsung for using your nickname]
@hoaxoner
someone else's IP the issue here?

Funny how they'll claim what is happening is anti-competitive, yet feel that giving away for free an OS (because they can afford to) that others charge for isn't anti-competitive.

They could have Google license the IPs, which is fine as part the cost that MS charges for WP7 likely goes to cover licensed IP.
@hoaxoner

Let's go back to 2007, when the iPhone was just announced and spy shots showed pre-release Android phone prototypes looking like warmed over Blackberries. Jump to fall 2008. The first Android production Android phone came to market and wouldn't you know, it suddenly had a multi-touch capable, gesture based UI. With each successive release of Android, it has become more an more iPhone-like. Where in the world did Google get the inspiration for Android's touch friendly features? What about Apple's pending patents for all of these features? Similarly, on the hardware side, Samsung has stooped to not only copying the form factor and look of the phone, they've copied the home screen icons, accessories, and even the product packaging. Where does the copying stop?

Patents exist to promote innovation by protecting those who actually invent stuff. Patents protect these innovators from copycats like Google, Motorola, HTC, and Samsung.

Like it or not patent wars are waged on piles of patents. Unfortunately, it's not enough that Apple has 200+ patents protecting every aspect of the multi-touch UI, data detector software, object oriented OS architecture, etc. Apple needs to obtain every patent it can get to build a comprehensive portfolio of old old cellular patents to block the other guys old cellular patents. This will allow a fair hearing on the merits of Apple's new and very relevant iPhone patents, copyrights, and trade dress.
@hoaxoner

One could argue that attempting to buy a patent portfolio simply for the sake of defending itself for possible patent violations is equally disgusting.
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yup
hoaxoner 3rd Aug
@piousmonk
Totally agree. If the innovating company does not act on the patents, there should be no action.
@hoaxoner

and why do you think google was trying to buy them??? For funsies??? They wanted them to try and counteract other legitimate cases from Apple, MS and oracle....

So you think its ok for someone to spend $900m and suddenly can violate 100's of other patents, because they bought some patents of someone else?

All the coalition did was buy them to protect their other legitimate claims.

I hope google gets screwed over royally on it just like MS did, talking multi billion dollar.... If anything google is worse than MS
@daniejam
All major tech companies violate patents from each other. Having patents for cross licencing is basically a common practice. If Google didn't then they would have to pay a fee. Paying for patents that can be used for cross licencing is an alternative to paying that fee.

Anyways, to bring you back from your completely irrelevant rant. The reason this purchase is being investigated by the FCC is because Google's competitors teamed up against Google. If they had gone alone there would be no issue as they were all approved to bid for the patents.
@anono

Where did they say they bought them to screw google over?? Where did you get this insider knowledge??

I think it is however safe to assume they did buy them to stop google acquiring them so they can counter sue... They already have enough infringements on google, so nothing they did is anti-competative, if anything google was the company trying to do that.
@browser.

There's a difference between copyrighted code and patents. Copying search engine code would be copyright violation. If you don't know the difference between a copyright and a patent you shouldn't be commenting on an IP article.

What google has patented are the methods by which they search. You can't patent code.

@pjs_boston

Do you seriously believe a company should be allowed to hold a patent on object oriented low-level APIs? What are you smoking, do you even know what object orientation is?
@hoaxoner So it's "disgusting" even though Google was invited to join the consortium buying the patents - which they declined to do BTW. But it's okay for Google to blatantly copy iOS for it's version of Android?

Cue the Double Standards there fandroid.
@athynz Why would they want to join in that consortium? The whole point in buying those patents was to defend themselves against the people who are members of that consortium... Part of joining that consortium would have required that they license them to the other members, doing so would have defeated the purpose of bidding in the first place, there would be no point in buying the patents to defend themselves if they wouldn't be able to do just that.
@hoaxoner
"Buying a patent portfolio simply for the sake of litigating against a competitor, a la Oracle, MS, and Apple is fairly disgusting. "
And Google wasn't trying to do this by purchasing the Nortel Patents for itself? MS offered them to jointly bid, and they decined...
As Frank Shaw puts it:
"Why? BECAUSE they wanted to buy something that they could use to assert against someone else.
SO partnering with others & reducing patent liability across industry is not something they wanted to help do"
@xnederlandx
Not if they were the target.
That is foolish and a poor investment when doing nothing gets the same result. plain
@hoaxoner ..."simply for the sake of litigating against a competitor"
It may well be, someday, but it is clearly unknown at this point. Or do you have an agenda?
@hoaxoner Do you actually believe that Google would not go after anybody that use anything covered by the portfolio if they had won? Sure, Google tried to purchase to cover their butts but they lost and to me it just sounds like whining now. If it's true that they were offered the opportunity to be part of the consortium then it's ever more childish.
@browser. Not sure if you noticed or not but... Sun's CEO congratulated Google publicly for using that code and A good portion of the iPhone's services were powered by Google Technologies that Jobs and Co abandoned when learning of Android.
@Peter Perry That's a good point Peter. I'll bet Google had an agreement with Apple that Google broke when it entered the smart phone market with an iPhone copy. You should not screw your friends and partners. Apple is very careful about who they partner with and Google did something very bad with that trust. Karma...Google that Drummond.
@Peter Perry LOL! And an internal memo inside Google showed that they knew they were violating patents they didn't own, and went ahead and violated them anyway. That pretty much trumps Sun's CEO. Besides Oracle bought that after that.
@Peter Perry There was no code theft. Get your story straight. Patents are different from copyrights. The copyright portion of Oracle's lawsuit was already dismissed on the basis of the fact that they were found not to have copied any actual Java sourcecode.

It's funny how you don't know the difference between a patent and a copyright isn't it?
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I had not heard about this:
Pete "athynz" Athens 4th Aug
@Peter Perry A good portion of the iPhone's services were powered by Google Technologies that Jobs and Co abandoned when learning of Android.

Do you have a source for this you can link to?
@all the idiots talking about "legitimate" cases of IP "infringement". It is up to the courts to determine the legitimacy of any patent or copyright claim. Any patent or copyright application must be tested in court before it can be determined to be "legitimate". All of these ongoing cases have yet to be determined by the courts to be legitimate. Most often deals are struck based not upon the legitimacy of the patent claims but based upon the cost of litigation. The consumers are the ones who lose in these disputes because no matter the cost it is ultimately the consumer who pays it.

There is nothing wrong with Google attempting to protect itself by amassing a patent portfolio in order to protect itself. If it weren't for the massive patent portfolios being used against Google by its competitors they wouldn't need to take such actions. If you think Google is reprehensible for trying to buy up patents to protect themselves, why is it OK for Oracle to buy the Java patent from Sun only to launch suit against Google for patent infringement? Sun themselves never initiated a lawsuit in the several years of attempted negotiations with Google. Google's position is that they used no proprietary code They created their own SDk that generated code to run on the Java platform that Sun had open sourced and therefore were not in violation. It will take a lot of time and money for the courts to decide this issue that only became an issue when Oracle purchased the the patent expressly for the purpose of launching the lawsuit that Sun themselves never did.

Google did not join the coalition to jointly buy up the Nortel patents because the coalition was formed specifically so that Google could not buy and use the patents to protect themselves. Basically, all of Google's competitors got together and pooled their resources to prevent Google from getting their hands on a patent portfolio that might have given them some bargaining power in the patent war they are currently waging on Google and no one company would have to bear the cost.
@browser. Buying a patent to sue someone isn't innovation. And patenting obvious things and hoping that the patent office will overlook how stupidly obvious it is is unethical.

Apple is suing HTC over recognizing email addresses and phone numbers in strings of text in order to provide buttons to email or call that person... How stupidly obvious is that. That's one of the two patents that HTC is allegedly infringing on.
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Not obvious enough...
i8thecat3 4th Aug
Get a clue snoop0x7b

No one did it before Apple so it wasn't all that obvious... Hindsight is 20/20 and sure it seems obvious now, but then again, so does indoor plumbing and refrigerators. Innovation is pure foresight. HTC didn't innovate, they coppied. Apple did all of the innovation on that one. If Apple knew to pattent the hell out of everything back in 1984, then windows would have never got a start. Apple learned that lesson too well and they are not about to make it again. Current smart phones are iPhone wannabes coppied directly from Apple. No one else is innovating, they are too busy ripping Apple off to innovate. Let them all burn in hell. If they want to compete, then they need to innovate and bring something to the table... They are all worthless parasites.
@i8thecat3 Are you shitting me? Regular expressions? They've been around since the late 70s... People have been doing things like (disclaimer this is not a real email address regular expression) s/([A-z0-9]@[A-z0-9]\.com)/EMAIL ADDRESS: $1/g since before the internet... They didn't invent processing strings like the patent implies. You can go on thinking that, but it's just ridiculous that anyone should have to pay a licensing fee to process a string and recognize an email address. It's incredibly obvious and the USPTO missed a ton of prior art on the subject... Fortunately, HTC is challenging the validity of that patent.

If you don't think doing something like that is obvious... Well I'm not going to say what I think of you, but you can guess. Regular expressions existed before that patent and have been used for years to parse bodies of text for a pattern. This is a great example of a patent with a huge amount of prior art AND obviousness that will probably be invalidated in HTC's upcoming invalidation case.
@i8thecat3 Just because "no one" did it does not mean it wasn't obvious... or that "no one" did it. The technology to recognize text strings is as old as data processing.

Iphones are not innovative but they were certainly obvious. Palm computers with touch screens were around before cellular technology had the bandwidth to provide high enough data rates to allow for "smart phones". Smart phones were just the obvious evolution of a palm computer.

If Apple could have patented the wheel and fire back in the stone age or before you'd still have the same argument? Not likely we'd have progressed far enough for you to espouse your ill conceived opinions to such a wide audience if they had.
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Riddle me this snoop0x7b... Why does Apple own the patent??? Do you even know what computing was like in the late 70's brainiac??? So you are claiming that there were punch cards to process a string and recognize an email address when email addresses didn't even exist??? Dude... Seriously... Get a clue and buy a vowel... Sheesh... Talk about clueless...

And techadmin.cc... By your logic Brainiac, the Newton was obvious too??? If iPhones were soooooo obvious, then why wasn't anyone making anything like it and why is EVERYONE making a knockoff of it? It's like you guys have no ability to remember anything.... Before Apple, the most innovative thing in phones was the sidekick and crackberry. The first Roid phone was a crackberry wannabe. And that was just a few years ago... And Palm was already dying long before the iPhone and that too was painfully obvious. It's like you both are living in a fantasy world of denial and make believe. Get over it, you are fans of Apple innovation and stuck in denial as a fan of a wannabe rip off. You tools would still be talking on a POS Nokia or a Razor if it wasn't for Apple... That too is obvious.

When Google finally gets shafted for the rip off scum they are, then you will probably be talking on a mango that pays a ton of royalties to Apple.
@i8thecat3

Regular expressions were invented in the 1950s by Stephen Cole Kleene. Good job googling it and finding out that I was indeed right, oh wait you didn't, I did that for you. My claim was that regular expressions existed and that Apple's patent is redundant because it isn't just about email addresses. The email address in my post was there as an example of how that existing technology is being applied in this case. Apple's patent doesn't stipulate email addresses, and even if it did, it would still be obvious. But way to actually think about what I was saying.
@browser.
"when the innovator sues them"? The innovator is a defunct corporate entity. The innovation was purchased to exploit and control. Patents are not playing cards! Why does any company need to purchase someone else's innovation. Is the act of purchase not the COMPLETE OPPOSITE of innovation?
@CanuckHockeyCoach

Exactly, patents should die with the innovating entity or a proscribed time period, whichever comes first.. Would negate a TON of patent lawsuits and free up the courts for other cases that it is backlogged on..
@browser. Learn a little about technology and then come back when you have something useful to say.
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William Farrell Updated - 3rd Aug
how lame and pathetic. Seems like everytime I think I've lost all respect for google someone comes out with some completely misrepresentative load of crap like this and I find I have actually lost a bit more...
@Johnny Vegas
After you saw your fellow employee completely get humiliated by Ballmer for using a competitor's product, how could you possibly have any respect for MS competitors?
All the BS Aside, Google is right, this is a gang rape of the patent system and if Google gets the 4G patents they are seeking do you really think the others will not cry foul?
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Even worst for the SMEs
Richard Flude 3rd Aug
Our cries aren't even heard.

What were those talkbackers saying re my claim patents have become the anti-competitive weapon of choice?
@Peter Perry

Google may be right, but the system was in place (broken or not) looooooong before they were even a company. These are not some newfangled rules designed to thwart Google's aspirations for global dominance.

The reality is that Google has a serious case of "not-invented-here" syndrome and seem to have little issue with taking the work of others and presenting it as their own. The irony, of course, being that their search algorithm was born from a technology that is patented.

With Android they may have painted themselves into a corner and I feel no remorse for them.
@Rich Miles
It's not about the system. It's about whether competitors teaming up against Google is anti-competitive.

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