Tech Broiler

Jason Perlow and Scott Raymond

Google: We don't need Chrome OS, we want cloud login for PCs

By | December 9, 2011, 1:00pm PST

Summary: The concept behind a unified login and cloud integration is sound, but not with a limited desktop OS.

For about six months, Google’s Chromebooks have been available in the retail channel. And compared to sales of tablets, they’ve been essentially a dud in the marketplace.

Also Read:

Personally, I’ve had mixed results with Chrome OS. On one hand, I’ve found the software pretty resilient and maintenance free. After I was done beta testing the CR-48 myself, I gave it to my mother-in-law. She LOVES the thing.

As in, I haven’t had a single major technical support issue with her using it as her primary laptop. And believe me, she uses it a lot, for access to her Real Estate MLS to word processing with Google Docs and of course regular web browsing and email.

On the other hand, what Chrome OS is actually able to provide the user today is limited compared to a general purpose desktop OS.

In earlier pieces I have advocated the use of thin computing devices that were primarily cloud terminals.

Eventually, I see us getting there, but not until high-speed bandwidth is pretty ubiquitous and we’ve made a transition off the x86 platform for most end-users and onto ARM and other embedded SoCs. That’s a sea change event that is going to take probably ten years.

Also Read:

The problem is, Chrome OS doesn’t have ten years to take off. And Android is already pretty much the only embedded platform other than the Chrome browser itself that Google can effectively concentrate on for the time being and keep developer attention with.

My suggestion is that Google takes a lemon with Chrome OS and makes lemonade. The technology behind Chrome OS is sound, but nobody wants to buy an overpriced netbook now when they can buy an iPad or an Android Tablet instead. If they had cost $100-$150 nobody would be complaining.

The problem is that even that with the holiday price cut, they are still $299. That’s nuts.

So what do you with Chrome OS? Well, I think we have to think of it more generically in terms of a cloud authentication framework that is coupled with a high-security, “jailed” or virtualized tamper-free web browser that would replicate the core functionality of Chrome OS.

To me, the real value play of Chrome OS is not so much the operating system itself, but the unified Google login and how it integrates with the browser and Google’s services. But really, Google could make this work with any operating system — Windows, Mac, or any version of Linux.

Heck, they could even put this in WebOS via an open source contribution.

Unified cloud logins are coming to Windows anyway. If you’ve played with the Windows 8 developer preview, you know that you have the option of logging in via local authentication, Active Directory, or Microsoft Live.

I don’t see Microsoft Live being able to effectively monopolize cloud logins on Windows.

If we know anything about the EU and how Microsoft tried to force Internet Explorer down their throats and what a headache that caused for them, then I think that Microsoft would be amenable to users installing a “Google Browser and Authentication Pack” for Windows, which could be marketed as “Chrome OS for Windows”.

Essentially, Chrome OS would be deconstructed as an OS-agnostic pluggable authentication mechanism plus a hardened browser/app platform.

Similarly, I could see a “Chrome OS for Mac” being offered for download as well. Apple could certainly try to require Mac users use iCloud as the sole cloud authentication mechanism at some time in the future, but I don’t see that flying very well with Europe either.

Would you like to be able to sign on to your PC or Mac using your Google credentials and integrate it with Google’s services and the Chrome Browser? Talk Back and Let Me Know.

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Jason Perlow, Sr. Technology Editor at ZDNet, is a technologist with over two decades of experience integrating large heterogeneous multi-vendor computing environments in Fortune 500 companies.

Disclosure

Jason Perlow

My Full-Time Employer is IBM. I write as a freelancer for ZDNet.

Disclaimer: The postings and opinions on this blog are my own and don't necessarily represent IBM's positions, strategies or opinions.

I own no investments or direct financial instruments in the companies I write about.

Biography

Jason Perlow

Jason Perlow, Sr. Technology Editor at ZDNet is a technologist with over two decades of experience with integrating large heterogeneous multi-vendor computing environments in Fortune 500 companies. A long-time computer enthusiast starting the age of 13 with his first Apple ][ personal computer, he began his freelance writing career starting at ZD Sm@rt Reseller in 1996 and has since authored numerous guest columns for ZDNet Enterprise and Ziff-Davis Internet. Jason was previously Senior Technology Editor for Linux Magazine, where he wrote about Open Source issues from 1999 to 2008.

In his spare time, Jason is an avid amateur chef and food writer, where his work reviewing New Jersey restaurants has appeared in The New York Times. He is also the founder of the popular food web site eGullet and blogs about restaurants and cooking at OffTheBroiler.com.

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RE: Google: We don't need Chrome OS, we want cloud login for PCs
codecrackx15 19th Dec
@jperlow Amazon is consistently sold out since the price drop and actual sales numbers have not been released so this proves you very wrong.
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It's a failure of HTML5
LBiege Updated - 9th Dec
So many tech writers bought into the HTML5 hype w/o taking a deeper technical look into if the "platform" really is as robust as advertised. Notice Android devices on the other hand score far better simply b/c they are based on a more solid Java platform.
@LBiege - HTML5 is as robust as it is unfragmented between providers. grin

Silverlight and Flash aren't dead yet, and given how one side says "Flash is bloated", one can easily say "Smartphones and tablets are underpowered" (which won't help Apple, given they are not known for "power without the price" to begin with...)
Jason-

I gotta be honest, I'm not even quite sure what you're advocating here. Doesn't logging into Google already give you a unified login for Docs, Gmail, YouTube, etc? I'm not sure what adding a Chrome Browser with unified Google login does that IE pointed to www.google.com doesn't already do? Maybe I'm just missing the point.
@swmace I'm not talking about integration at the browser level. I'm talking about using it as an authentication mechanism at the OS level.
@jperlow

What would be the purpose? How would your OS change? I can use my gmail account as my live id and login the same (For Windows 8). I don't get what you are trying to accomplish on the OS side. If you are saying that because you can authenticate with google, your OS does something different and you just use Chrome? I'm with swmace on this one.

If you are just talking about logging in with your google authentication, I don't see how that makes it any better than just regularly logging in (for Windows 8 at least) and using Chrome...Windows 8 saves all of your passwords and all of that stuff so once you login with your Live ID (which can use your google email) all the stuff that you use will be logged in.

Now if you're talking about changing the OS around because you used a google authentication, then, no, it's not going to happen.
@jperlow

It's there.

Control Panel\User Accounts and Family Safety\Credential Manager

Problem isn't that it doesn't exist. Problem is that nobody uses it. Only Microsoft and Xmarks use it on my system.
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Agree with zwmace and zedox
Arun (sreearun) Updated - 9th Dec
I agree with @swmace @zedox.

I don't really understand what you are trying to advocate here.
Nice linkbait headline you got there. Ugh.
No thanks, I'll just stick with my Chromebook. It's an awesome product as is, but I want Google to continue making it better with hardware and software improvements. After using it for a week, I put my Windows laptop away, probably for good. I haven't touched it in months and don't miss it at all. I can do everything I need and want to do with a computer much faster and with less maintenance using a Chromebook, and I'm a power user.
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Our experience with 2 Chomebooks
Mister Spock 10th Dec
@garylai
had our testers pulling their Windows (and MacBooks) out of their closets every other day as the Chromebooks were quite lacking in too many features and capabilities.
plain
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Agree as a pc device...
rhonin 11th Dec
@Mister Spock

Does work well as an instant-on internet connection for central household use.
Your article is so contrived, I can't help thinking that the thing you really want in a PC is already available in a Chromebook. Authentication mechanism? Um, ok. The OS level IS ChromeOS in this case. Do you think you'll see this with iOS, Windows, and the like? Certainly not anytime soon. What else are you looking for besides what's offered in a Chromebook? It's OK if it's not your cup of tea but don't relinquish this OS device as something that's only suitable for the baby-boomer generation. Stick with your full-fledged, do-it-all OS (which you probably use for surfing, email, etc. 90% of the time) and leave the Chromebook for those who simply want to cut to the chase.

I am planning on purchasing a Chromebook next month at a price that is more "soup" than "nuts". Next time, speak for yourself and avoid using the word "We". I think I - and others - can speak for ourselves.
@omahapianist The sales numbers do not reflect an acceptance by the masses of the Chromebook platform. Plain and simple. It's not a business that Google can really justify itself being in and its partners manufacturing the devices can't justify sustaining either.
@jperlow Amazon is consistently sold out since the price drop and actual sales numbers have not been released so this proves you very wrong.
"Eventually, I see us getting there"

I don't. There's a reason we're not using dumb terminals anymore. They're dunb.

Not to mention all it is is a browser - which every computer and device already has. Why buy something that does less than everything else out there?

There are zero advantages to such a device. They couldn't even sell it at a low price, which would be its only selling point.

"The technology behind Chrome OS is sound"

There is no technology in Chrome OS. Not anything you can't get with everything else.

"To me, the real value play of Chrome OS is not so much the operating system itself, but the unified Google login and how it integrates with the browser and Google???s services."

Except they're already doing that - when you log into any of Google's services, you log into all of them. And oh, yeah, Microsoft does the same. Don't need to buy a whole ChromeOS machine to get that benefit.

And if you're talking about OS level integration, Microsoft has had that long before Google did. They have APIs to attach the OS login to an app login.

In Windows 7:
Control Panel\User Accounts and Family Safety\Credential Manager

Interestingly enough, I have a Windows Live token hanging around in there. Probably to maintain the logins for the Windows Live products I use, like Windows Live Photo Gallery.

So yeah, Google really is late to the game here. Even the OS level authentication is late to the game. There is no technology in Chrome OS that nobody else has.

What I think is REALLY interesting is things like Mozilla's Browser ID, which identifies not just across a single website, but across the entire internet (or at least everybody who is accepting Browser ID logins).

"Essentially, Chrome OS is deconstructed as an OS-agnostic pluggable authentication mechanism plus a hardened browser/app platform."

Except that it's not. It's specific to Google. Who else used it?
A unified authentication for Chromebooks, in house Windows virtual desktops, and Windows/Unix/Linux server based services would be a nice thing. Google should work on this as a priority. Microsoft will fight this with every dirty trick in the book in order to maintain its monopoly lock-in, so the onus is on Google to push and litigate this.
@Mah Eh, if you want all that, just grab a Windows system.
@CobraA1
That's useless because it won't log you into Google or other cloud services. What is required is a server box in the office that will accept Google's two stage authentication to get you into your Windows systems as well.
"That's useless because it won't log you into Google or other cloud services."

Works fine here. Enable browser cookies.

"What is required is a server box . . ."

. . . which is not what ChromeOS was really designed for.

". . . to get you into your Windows systems as well."

. . . why? Why should the Google login get you into Windows, rather than the Windows login getting you into Google? Does it really matter what the first login is?
@Mah
and are inventing new dirty tricks everyday. Why would Google be pushing this if not for their own benefit, as what they are asking to do has been availiable from others for quite some time.

And on what grounds does Google have to where they can litigate something into a competing product?
@Mister Spock
Simple - Microsoft uses the Windows authentication system as a means to lock in customers and lock out competitors. Windows AD authentication is a form of Kerberos/LDAP authentication as used on Unix systems but with broken compatibility to keep systems from interoperating except under control of a Windows AD server. Google would I imagine want a level playing field for Chromebooks to be used with virtualised Windows desktops in an Enterprise. Logging in once into the Chromebook and again to the Windows desktop is a pain, so having a Google authenticator device in an office to talk to the Google authentication server and then log you into the Windows desktop via a stored password on the authenticator device would make sense.

What grounds does Google have where they can litigate something into a competing product? Well, they will not be litigating something into a competing product - they will be litigating using anti-trust law against monopoly abuse by breaking interoperation in order to disadvantage competitors. Microsoft is a serial offender and a felon with repeat convictions when it comes to anti-trust violations, and as we speak, Novel is in court suing Microsoft for anti-trust violations with regard to breaking compatibility with the Windows 95 API details given to WordPerfect which was the then dominant WP application, in order to delay entry into the Windows 95 app market and so exclude it from the market to allow MS Word to take over as the dominant Windows WP application.
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@Mister Spock ... Google can function with aggregated data, without loading the customer with ads. Microsoft is the problem, look at all the garbage with Microsoft products like Hotmail. You sign your life away with the EULA and you get Microsoft products shoved in your face at every turn. Microsoft locks the user in with their OS, uses an elastic cord and continually punches the user. Similar to how XP users were denied IE9 while Chrome and Firefox still support them.

Big bad Google talk, no specific examples. Everyone's privacy was compromised by Google, but don't ask them for their specific problems. How did Google specifically play dirty tricks on you?

If Google is so bad, why is Bing losing $1 billion a month?

Google is built on Linux and that's why people use it. Reliability and Security. I have 67,735 Gmail emails. Did I every have a privacy violation or reliability issue?....NO!
@jperlow : Embedded in your piece is the real answer to your question:

After I was done beta testing the CR-48 myself, I gave it to my mother-in-law. She LOVES the thing.

For the past 9 months, I have watched techno pundits bash the Chromebook concept, while people like your mother-in-law love it and techies like you heave a sigh of relief and say, "I havent had a single major technical support issue with her using it as her primary laptop." Like @garylai, I have the technical abilities to install, use, and maintain any OS, but I prefer to use my Cr-48, underpowered as it is.
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Contributr
@S_Deemer You won't get any argument from me that ChromeOS is great for people who want a zero maintenance system and do task-oriented computing and basic online types of stuff. If you read some of my earlier pieces linked in the Also Read links you'll see I am a huge advocate for this type of computing model.

But the fundamental problem with chromebooks is that they cost too much money. Only a tiny percentage of the consumer population is latching onto them right now. Only about 10,000 of the devices have been sold to date, if that. Most of the units in the field right now are the free CR-48s which don't count towards revenue generation. $299 is too much for this kind of a device, never mind the $350 they were selling at prior to the holiday promotion. $199 is about the most they should be charging for this device.

The biggest obstacle to getting Chromebooks to $199 is that the products are currently based on x86 technology. The Atom isn't as efficient component cost wise as an ARM SoC. Maybe this year they can attempt to make a ARM-based chromebook. At $199 maybe more of them will move, but I can't say for sure that people wouldn't prefer a tablet instead.
@S_Deemer
I agree with you. Most PC journals, blogs and magazines are written by computer enthusiasts for computer hobbyists - the type who like overclocking, custom builds, comparing tech specs and build prices etc. Windows PCs are machines built for computer hobbyists who love tinkering with their PCs and configuring and maintaining their PCs. Chromebooks have no value for them, and most of them just don't get it.

On the other hand, if you are a non-technical end user, or a tech professional whose job it is to maintain desktops, Chromebooks are definitely for you, assuming you have suitable connectivity and assuming the applications you need are available in the form of web apps, extensions, Native Client plug-ins, or via Citrix Connector.
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Copy Microsoft, right!
oraman 10th Dec
It's simple. What Jason is saying is that Google, not having the ability to innovate, should copy Microsoft, as they do other tech companies. The only problem is they don't have a platform.
@oraman If anything Microsoft is copying the Chrome OS approach in Windows 8 with Windows Live logins. All I am saying is that the Chrome OS authentication services should be made available to all operating systems.
I think it's powerful idea - and one that I'd be surprised if Google and others haven't taken seriously already. For a moment, keep the Chrome OS device strategy and MS intentions aside.

A mechanism for any cloud service to offer a unified logon to a remote device has several advantages:
    Ability to set local system variables for tighter service integration

    Disk Storage services that are tightly coupled with cloud.

    Customizing user interface elements (app lauch, access to home-grown app market, ad-delivery engine)


And it's an essential ingredient in targeting different audiences of cloud platforms

For end users:
    Certificate-based logon for the vendor's family of apps

    Integrated cloud file services

    Background update services for apps

    Easy sync between devices

    Experience portability between devices (unify look-n-feel, preferences, bookmarks & media)


For the enterprise:
    Single-signon for employees

    Ability to provision users centrally

    Apply organizational policies

    Provide a middle-layer services for integrating popular productivity apps like Outlook


In the end, we swing back to questions unanswered:
    Would Google spend energies on developing platform of cloud connected app platform on rival OS's or focus on Chrome OS as integrated hardware + software platform? Is it necessary to see it as a either-or proposition?

    Will MS be able to wall off their garden without getting the powdered wigs in a twist (particularly in Europe)? What will it mean for the Windows platform?
@spmohapatra

"Ability to set local system variables for tighter service integration"

I think you're confused as to what a system variable is.

"Disk Storage services that are tightly coupled with cloud."

Provided by HTML 5, available to all current browsers. Used by top vendors such as Google and Microsoft, not really used much by anybody else.

"Customizing user interface elements (app lauch, access to home-grown app market, ad-delivery engine)"

I think you mean shell APIs, not UI elements.

"Certificate-based logon for the vendor's family of apps"

Provided by OSes everywhere, used by nobody.

"Integrated cloud file services"

Supplied by HTML 5, used by top vendors such as Google and Microsoft, not used by anybody else. Why, I don't know, but it seems most people are afraid to integrate the new technologies into their web apps.

"Background update services for apps"

Would make more sense if there were background apps. Which is available to regular apps, but not really to web apps.

"Single-signon for employees"

Everybody wants single sign-on. Nobody wants to integrate it into their own web service. I'm betting on BrowserID, but I'm not holding my breath for websites to use it.

OSes already have single sign-on. Few devs actually use it. Only Microsoft and Xmarks have used Windows' own credential manager on my system.
So, you're asking that CromeOS become Chrome with a login option? Sounds reasonable, but not nearly as compelling from a usability and security standpoint.
$299.00 is the sweet spot. The Acer has consistently been sold out on Amazon since the cut and when they do get some in they usually sell out in a few hours. The only people complaining about the Chromebooks are those that want to use them for more than they are marketed as. Those of us that have transitioned to the cloud love them. The way they are selling... proves most doubters wrong now too.

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