Tech Broiler

Jason Perlow and Scott Raymond

How to ruin a perfectly good Sunday with Windows Vista

By | December 17, 2008, 10:23am PST

Summary: The HP J4580 Multi-Function Inkjet Printer, Scanner and Fax. The $99.00 multifunction device that was the icing on the cake that ruined my Sunday. I always know when my weekend is going to be ruined. It usually starts like this: Wife: Jason? Me: Yeah? Wife: Mom just called, we need to go to their house on Sunday, she’s [...]

hpj45801.jpg

The HP J4580 Multi-Function Inkjet Printer, Scanner and Fax. The $99.00 multifunction device that was the icing on the cake that ruined my Sunday.

I always know when my weekend is going to be ruined. It usually starts like this:

Wife: Jason?

Me: Yeah?

Wife: Mom just called, we need to go to their house on Sunday, she’s having computer issues. She can’t print, or log on to dad’s laptop downstairs.

Me: Oh @#$%.

Some perspective is required — about a year ago, I got my mother-in-law a new Lenovo ThinkPad. It was pre-loaded with Vista Home, and I have been steadily maintaining it with patches, Service Pack 1 and everything needed to keep it healthy. So I was surprised that suddenly, things had started to go south.

Click on the “Read the rest of this entry” link below for more.

It turned out that it was a hardware problem. Her printer, an older HP 932c, had finally decided to die — rather, the inkjet head was gummed up with dried up ink and her ink cartridges, which were several years old, were also well beyond their expiration date. Rather than try to fix this unit and buy new supplies, which could easily equal a good portion of the cost of a new printer, I thought it was a good idea that we replace her printer. Mom is a real estate agent, and also has to scan and fax, so I thought it was a good idea if we also at the same time pulled her old Fax and legacy Canon scanner out of the mix, and get her running with a multifunction device (MFD).

I myself have had varying levels of success with MFDs. Between my last two companies that I have worked at, I’ve had two different Lexmark-manufactured units (One a Dell AIO and the other an actual Lexmark) and now I’m evaluating the Epson Workforce 600, which is their top of the line wireless MFD (which I’ll talk about in a future post).

While examining my Father-in-law’s PC, I sent my wife and my Mother-in-law to their neighborhood Staples, where they had a number of MFD units in stock. Our choice came down to a Lexmark with built-in wireless which would have been $125 after rebates or a $99 HP J4580. After a quick determination that they really didn’t need the wireless capability, as it was going to be plugged directly into the laptop via USB, we went with the HP. The cheap in-store price without having to go thru the rebate hassle also seemed to seal the deal.

While the women were out of the house, I cautiously approached my Father-in-law’s low-end Acer Aspire laptop. I had him order one of these about six months ago from COMPUSA.com, when it was onsale for under $450. His old Toshiba laptop, which was running Ubuntu 7.10 for about six months had died, and he needed an inexpensive and quick replacement. It was pre-loaded with Vista. I had decided that the time I didn’t have the energy or the wherewithal to wipe the system out with Ubuntu again — I just set him up with his GMail icon and a few minor tweaks and let him have it. Besides, all this 72-year old retired securities trader does with his PC besides email is use Scottrade to watch the market, use Picasa, and play fantasy football on the web.

In hindsight, this was a bad idea.

I log in only to find that the pre-loaded virus scanner, Norton Internet Security 2007, had expired. Apparently, a few months ago, when it prompted my father-in-law to renew his trial subscription, he decided that $59.00 was too much money.  He also apparently decided not to let Windows do any updates to his system. So it was now riddled with viruses and spyware, and in a completely unpatched state.

I then proceeded to clean out all the spyware, junk and viruses, by installing and running Advanced SystemCare 3 Free Editon, CCLeaner.com, Spybot Search & Destroy, un-installing the expired Norton and replacing it with Avast! Home Edition. Once the computer was verified clean, I accepted the Microsoft Updates which included Vista SP1 and a number of post-SP1 fixes. Total time investment to clean up the mess? We arrived at 1PM, it was now 5:30. Four and a half hours had now passed. I verify that mom can log into the box, and then proceed upstairs to hook up the new MFD on her Lenovo.

Generally speaking I like HP’s printers and scanners — they have solid inkjet technology and very good output quality. However, I have to say that after this last Sunday’s experience, their software integration stack for the MFDs with Vista is awful. Bloated, buggy, and horrible.

Hooking up the printer itself was simple — I unboxed it, pulled all the packing materials off, inserted the new cartridges, connected it up to the USB port with her old USB cable (the device doesn’t come with one included) and powered it on. Vista recognized the device, and prompted me to insert the HP driver CD. I heard the characteristic “plonk” sound of the device being recognized, and Vista reported the hardware was working. I then installed all 500+ MB of HP’s included MFD management software, which includes the scanning wizard, OCR, fax management, et cetera.

After about a half an hour of scripted software installs, I clicked on the HP Solution Center icon — a few seconds later, I get a dialog box that tells me that no HP devices have been detected, HP Solution Center will close now.”

Huh? But Vista just told me the device was operational!

So I sent a manual test fax directly from the unit. Works. I checked Vista’s printer configuration, the device is set as default printer. I send a test print and print out a few documents. No problem. But how do we scan if HP Solution Center is busted?

It then occured to me that the J4580 was probably TWAIN compatible. So what do I do? I install the Open Source GIMP For Windows, do an Acquire -> Scanner/Camera, pick the HP device, and perform a scan. Seconds later I have a high resolution image from mom’s holiday calendar on her desktop.

Screw you, HP, and take your buggy software with you. Have a nice @#$%^ing day.

After instructing my Mother-in-law in how to perform scans with GIMP, I look at my watch, it’s 7PM. I’m now starving and extremely punchy, having worked through the entire afternoon and the evening to get all this junk running. I check my BlackBerry, which is blinking wildly. My heart sinks — someone at work needs me to stay up late and work on a Visio diagram of a VMWare environment for an important customer for Monday.

So much for going out for dinner with the in-laws. Chinese delivery at home, here I come.

Does my Sunday sound anything like one of yours? Talk Back and Let Me Know.

Kick off your day with ZDNet's daily e-mail newsletter. It's the freshest tech news and opinion, served hot. Get it.

Jason Perlow, Sr. Technology Editor at ZDNet, is a technologist with over two decades of experience integrating large heterogeneous multi-vendor computing environments in Fortune 500 companies.

Disclosure

Jason Perlow

My Full-Time Employer is IBM. I write as a freelancer for ZDNet.

Disclaimer: The postings and opinions on this blog are my own and don't necessarily represent IBM's positions, strategies or opinions.

I own no investments or direct financial instruments in the companies I write about.

Biography

Jason Perlow

Jason Perlow, Sr. Technology Editor at ZDNet is a technologist with over two decades of experience with integrating large heterogeneous multi-vendor computing environments in Fortune 500 companies. A long-time computer enthusiast starting the age of 13 with his first Apple ][ personal computer, he began his freelance writing career starting at ZD Sm@rt Reseller in 1996 and has since authored numerous guest columns for ZDNet Enterprise and Ziff-Davis Internet. Jason was previously Senior Technology Editor for Linux Magazine, where he wrote about Open Source issues from 1999 to 2008.

In his spare time, Jason is an avid amateur chef and food writer, where his work reviewing New Jersey restaurants has appeared in The New York Times. He is also the founder of the popular food web site eGullet and blogs about restaurants and cooking at OffTheBroiler.com.

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How Is This Vista's Fault???
plasticframedglasses 14th Feb 2009
Whose fault was it not to install the updates? Whose
fault was it not to install AV software? Definitely
not Vista... so how the hell did Vista exactly ruin
your perfectly good Sunday??? It didn't.

Look, if my car dies out on me in the middle of the
road because I didn't have it serviced when I was
supposed to, the car's not to blame.

Bashing Vista for your problems is so played out.
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I'm not a shill
voyager529 17th Dec 2008
but I will say that I have had wonderful experiences with Canon hardware. I owned an ip6600D that lasted me many years, then I gave it to a friend and purchased an MP970. In both cases, using the vanilla flavored Windows Driver Installation wizard, then directing it to the folder on the CD with XP drivers (it had them for 98SE, 2000, Vista, and OSX as well), the printer, scanner, and card reader all came up under Printers, Imaging Devices, and Disk Drives in Device Manager respectively. Installation took about 90 seconds, and I could choose to install all bundled software, selected titles, or none at all. Additionally, the drivers also install color spaces for Photoshop which greatly add to the accuracy of the things that I print from Photoshop. While the individual ink vs. integrated tri-color cartridge debate will go on for eternity, the Canon 8 series cartridges have some of the lowest cost-per-mL of ink I've seen in recent memory. The Canon machines do cost more, but it is well worth it. While the HP machines are generally good ones, the drivers for them have, for many years, been unnecessarily large, required a lengthy install process, and in many cases have been the root of other issues with the system.

As for the virus issue, two features of Avast that have been lifesavers are that it can be installed in safe mode (MSI installers and many installshield packages cannot), and upon installation you can schedule a boot-time scan, which will scan for and remove viruses before Windows loads. On a badly infected machine, I boot into safe mode w/networking, download/install/update avast, then reboot. Some machines have required passes with Spybot/Adaware thereafter, but in most cases Avast left the system clean enough to boot into normal mode and remove the rest. Also, when removing Symantec products, google the Norton Removal Tool instead of simply uninstalling. the NRT does a more thorough job of removing the Symantec crap, but I'd still recommend a registry scan thereafter to get rid of some of the tentacles still lying around.

Joey
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I have an MP600...
Sleeper Service 17th Dec 2008
...same thing. It installed perfectly.

I used to use Lexmark printers. Ugh.
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Why keep bashing Vista?
jonc2011 Updated - 22nd Dec 2008
I have a couple of Vista machines and so far no problem installing ANY peripheral. On one machine I have around 30 printers installed including 3 or 4 multifunction machines. Though I did once have trouble finding a printer connected to a networked XP machine. I suggest that you blame HP, read the instructions, don't leave your in-laws without support for 12 months and especially don't blame Vista for every little problem you have.

PS: Meant to post this further down the blog, sorry - but on reflection this doesn't seem such a bad place for it!
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blame where blame is due
waltmaine 23rd Dec 2008
True - the HP mess should be blamed FULLY on HP. That's not a vista issue... And I think he DID put the blame on HP for that part...

However: there is a bigger issue. Vista should COME WITH a replaceable AV solution out of the box. It comes with a web browser, firewall, and media player, WHY NOT include AV? Frankly, it's needed. Linux even comes with AV software that mainly protects other windows machines! Come on MS - after all these years of malware, it's time to add this VITAL bit of security which will MASSIVELY reduce the botnets out there. Basic AV / spyware protection needs to be included with windows.
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Be careful what you ask for.
zclayton2 23rd Dec 2008
You might get it. Isn't demands like this the reason we are stuck with Word, IE, Outlook, ad nauseum? they got inculded as "free" applications and the good ones that worked went out of business.
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What!...
Bob_BLC 23rd Dec 2008
Are you kidding me? If someone isn't smart enough to put virus protection on a computer, then they deserve every virus they get.

There are dozens of good AV products on the market, I don't want Microsoft or anyone else forcing one on me. Let me pick my own!
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WTF?
NPGMBR 13th Feb 2009
I walked away from ZDnet a few years ago and returned only last year. Now I see the title of this article suggesting that your day was ruined by Vista when it fact; it wasn't. Simply put...Tech bloggers are full of it.
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VISTA
schapman@... 23rd Dec 2008
Wait until the day you log in and Vista says you have no rights to access any peripheral attached to your PC. What fun when you cannot use your DVD player because even as an administrator Vista says you do not have the rights to access it! You no longer can plug in cameras, USB devices or access anything except your hard drive because you no longer have rights for anything. NO resolution so far on any forum or blog so you either have to pony up a $100 to Microsoft to fix this problem because you were dumb enough to think you were smarter than Vista.
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re: VISTA
Badgered 23rd Dec 2008
Wait until the day you log in and Vista says you have no rights to access any peripheral attached to your PC. What fun when you cannot use your DVD player because even as an administrator Vista says you do not have the rights to access it! You no longer can plug in cameras, USB devices or access anything except your hard drive because you no longer have rights for anything.

Um... did your PC happen to tell you that your copy of Vista was invalid or something?

We'd need a little more info to help you.
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I can help you out with that...
07palman@... 31st Dec 2008
There's this little thing called activating windows, it works wonders you know. It's been included with all versions of windows and good job it has been too. You may need to cough up some dough, but maybe you should of thought of activating it earlier, or actually buying the thing. I did get that, but i downloaded a trial. What did I do? I went out and bought it, problem solved.
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Vista bashing
ratfret 23rd Dec 2008
Vista is a good operating system and I really don't understand all the complaints. I have had three printers hooked up to Vista with no problems. My Canon MP610 works like a charm and was easy to install.
Have a Merry Christmas.
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HP printers suck
superhobo 22nd Dec 2008
Or more accurately, their drivers and programs really
suck. I've had problems with all the HP printers I've
used.

Canon for imaging!
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Actually it's Canon MFDs that suck!
simul8guy 23rd Dec 2008
First, I was a diehard Canon fan and have purchased many Canon printers and MFDs over the years. However, I've had two Canon multi-function devices that crapped out on me shortly after the warranty expired. This compared to the still functioning BJC 4550 that I bought in 1996. I complained to Canon but was basically told to take a hike. So, a year ago I purchased an HP C7180. Hardware-wise, so far so good but the story about a ruined Sunday afternoon rang true with me. The Vista drivers for this MFD are a real joke. I installed the driver on my HP notebook which connects wirelessly to my network. Not only did the driver not work it also screwed up the network connection. Even after uninstalling the driver I still can't copy files across the network. I tried everything in Vista to get the connection functioning again, no dice. I'll probably have to do a system restore on the notebook but I don't have a Sunday afternoon to waste.....
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Or.....
Joe.Smetona 24th Dec 2008
"As for the virus issue, two features of Avast that have been lifesavers are that it can be installed in safe mode (MSI installers and many installshield packages cannot), and upon installation you can schedule a boot-time scan, which will scan for and remove viruses before Windows loads. On a badly infected machine, I boot into safe mode w/networking, download/install/update avast, then reboot. Some machines have required passes with Spybot/Adaware thereafter, but in most cases Avast left the system clean enough to boot into normal mode and remove the rest. Also, when removing Symantec products, google the Norton Removal Tool instead of simply uninstalling. the NRT does a more thorough job of removing the Symantec crap, but I'd still recommend a registry scan thereafter to get rid of some of the tentacles still lying around."

Or, you could just use Linux (linuxmint.com), not install any virus protection, get no virus infections. and just relax and enjoy using the coumputer.
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Malware removal tools
fireyouritguys 26th Dec 2008
I prefer the "load and go" MWAV scanner from MWTI.NET, for cleaning out viruses, and follow up with Malwarebytes, both of which run nicely in safe mode.

I used to use Spybot and Ad-Aware years ago, but find they take a long while and don't catch everything.

If there's anything still remaining after the MWAV/Malwarebytes cocktail, then SuperAntiSpyware will generally finish the job, with Hijack This (Now from Trend Micro), to clean out stubborn BHOs. Frankly an OS reload is faster in most cases, but leaves you with having to patch all over again, and reinstall all applications.
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Sounds like a lot of effort.
Joe.Smetona 26th Dec 2008
If you switch to Linux (linux Mint 6, linuxmint.com). all that work and worry disappears. You would enjoy using the computer a lot more.
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Sounds more like
mdemuth 17th Dec 2008
ruining your day with HP then Vista, but I suppose this will get you more page hits...

A good place to start is the firewall. My HP all-in-one (I don't know the model off hand) wouldn't scan until I config'ed the firewall to allow access.

Which is exactly how it should work.
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exactly
coffeeshark 17th Dec 2008
It's a bad day with HP, which happens to be the only problem I've ever had with Vista - 3rd party drivers.

As for your Pops, there's no way he's getting that much spyware and virii from Scottrade and fantasy football. Maybe you need a parental filter?
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ftw!
eggmanbubbagee@... 17th Dec 2008
"As for your Pops, there's no way he's getting that much spyware and virii from Scottrade and fantasy football. Maybe you need a parental filter?"
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lol!!
Pembo 22nd Dec 2008
Instead of NetNanny we need ParentPatrol and SeniorSpy!!!
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A major reason
Crestview 22nd Dec 2008
I like ZoneAlarm. Everything right at your finger tips, configure as you go.
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Agreed!
Pembo 22nd Dec 2008
Sounds like hardware.

I have to allow my multifunction ricoh through the windows firewall as well. (since the security update in August)

Read the instructions. They didn't print +150 pages for that thing just to use it as packing materials.

And for all the mac fanboys that are going to jump on this, I dont care. I read my instructions, do maintenance when I'm supposed to, dont click on dum stuff or unknown emails and WOW! my machine works great!
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I totally agree!
gerardhsd@... Updated - 22nd Dec 2008
I totally agree with your comment. The computer is like a car, if you take care of it it will take care of you. I am sick and tired of hearing all of the Mac stuff about how much better they are. I have had a number of friends with Macs who have also run into problems and had to reformat their computers or otherwise wasted a Sunday afternoon. Computers require maintenance and care that is all there is to it. When you get frustrated, take a deep breath and find the help you need. I find Vista to be my most enjoyable computer experience over all other Windows versions and I have used them all.
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Computers require maintenance
tfarquhar@... 23rd Dec 2008
So true about lost Sunday's and it isn't limited to Vista. Perhaps if people went through a "Computer Ed" class before buying a computer... I agree that computers (like cars) tend to run well and usually for a long time when regularly maintained; however, unlike owning a car, you are not required to know how to drive a computer before you buy one. Nor are you required to know when or how to change your oil, rotate your tires, etc. "Regular" computer people are also not expected to know how important using an A/V solution. I will be using two tips I got from this article to get my HP AIO scanner working agin. Thanks!
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What??
use_what_works_4_U 23rd Dec 2008
Are you saying that a firewall should prevent access to an
imaging (not networking) device connected directly to a
PC? If that's so, then what do I do when I want to add a
digital camera? video camera? blu-ray drive? flash drive?
etc...

The HP software was already installed and failing. If this
was a firewall setting than GIMP shouldn't have worked
either. Or are you suggesting that Vista should force us to
use open source generic utilities over the ones that are
actually designed for the specific device?
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wrong title
pupkin_z 17th Dec 2008
The problems the author encountered have nothing to do with Vista. "How to ruin a perfectly good Sunday fixing your folks' computer problems" would fit much better.
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you'll see that a lot
reverseswing 17th Dec 2008
would you have read this story if it said HP instead of Vista? It's easier this way to grab everyone's attention and get some clicks.
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Exactly!
cdmsr 26th Dec 2008
My HP laptop came with Vista preloaded and I am very happy with it. It is easy to use and functions great.

The bad rap/rep on Vista is due to tripe like this post's title and MS Haters and Mac/Linux fanboys who want the rest of us limited to their lame world views.
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How well I know this
Crestview 22nd Dec 2008
Other peoples systems which are WAY beyond maintained will kill your day, or even days.
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I second that (nt)
tikigawd 22nd Dec 2008
nt
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I'll guarantee...
fairportfan 22nd Dec 2008
...that that HP would work fine with XP, likely with 2000, and maybe even with 98.

So, whether it's HP's fault or MS's, it's still a Vista problem.
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Blote ware
mjolnar@... 22nd Dec 2008
I have a Photosmart C6280, it has great color and features. The software is huge and slow. This printer will spool before printing, and one page can take 3-5 minutes to start printing at times.

I dual boot Ubuntu and Vista, the software package isn't available for Ubuntu, so I just load it in cups. When I hit control-P, I count out 3 seconds and I hear the printer setting up to print. It doesn't make any difference how large a picture I print, it starts in about 3 seconds.

I had an HP 5550 that served me will for about 5 years, the software on that one was manageable. These new ones just have to give you too many options.
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Mine didn't work
Northlite 22nd Dec 2008
My HP All In One 6100 series didn't scan into XP with the HP provided software I always had to use a photo program to bring scans in. When I went to Vista, HP said buy a new all in one or use the generic drivers they gave to MS, turns out it was just a simple driver set and I didn't loose any functions and gained disk space, I used the photo program to bring the scans in fine. Oddly my daughter who had the same all in one on Windows XP could scan into her computer with the button on it something I was never able to do.
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Logic?
boberuski 24th Dec 2008
That seems like faulty logic to me...If I give you the framework to build on and you can't code for it is it my fault or your fault? Crappy coding is a highlight of HP...it took a while when XP came out to get drivers to work with it...how quickly people forget the 98 to XP conversion. happy

HP has a major issue w/ bloated drivers 500+ MB for a print driver...seriously?
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Excuse me but blame is not the issue
seannj427 22nd Dec 2008
My wife has an HP multifunction scanner/printer and the Vista drivers provided by HP (along with the absolutely bloated and ANNOYING HP-Ware). This sofwtare has re-installed itself 100000000 times. The system continually detects 'more than one' printer though there is only ONE PRINTER. So, the HP sofwtare sees more than one, and you have to click the right one on the left..... HP update tells her there is an update, but then UAC blocks the update, and even though she clicks 'allow' on the UAC button sometimes the update installs and sometimes it does not.
This MFC scanner/printer/copier works great on an older HP laptop BUT DOES NOT WORK WELL on vista. When it works it works fine but it is GETTING IT TO WORK that is the issue....
So, who's fault is it? Does it matter?
Well it's the usual Vendor shuffle between HP and Microsoft....... Microsoft will say that HP did not write their drivers to comply with the latest vista sdk programming standard blah blah blah and HP will come back and whine about Vista being 'so different from XP, blah blah blah' so in reality Vista had a lot to do with this, this is a miscue. An unfortunate carriage of IT justice.
I have spent MANY AN AFTERNOON working at my parent's house on their PC but have ALWAYS MADE TIME FOR DINNER.... So shame on you dude for not guilting your Mom into making you your favorite meal, at least to take on the road!
BTW The magic config that seems to work @ my parents house (for now) is XP SP3, AVG Free edition and a custom script that logs everyone out and runs a manual defrag once a month, along with a job that backs up their email to a safe location every evening.
I am cringing at the day when they will need a new pc, and will be a vista pc, and....GRRRR oh the learning curve will be steep..... I dare not give them ubuntu, although I love it. Again the learnin curve is far too steep for them.

I like vista on my Quad core 8GB RAM box. I like it on my new 3GB dual core company laptop.But in the wrong hands, Vista can be a nightmare...

L8r
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re automating
bruce88 Updated - 22nd Dec 2008
That sounds like a good way to set them up - automating some of the essentials. And I too wish for ways to make HP multifunction devices work without the (seeming) dozens of apps, directories and who-knows thousands of files and registry entries to be installed. I like their devices, not so much the SW.
I have similar in some ways scenario with ext family.
seannj427, Would you be willing to share the script that you use for the logout/defrag/backup process?
Or a pointer link if it is on the web.
Thx.
Well, while I can sympathize... The virus and spyware problems could have been prevented... thereby saving you 4 hours.

Your real problems were with HP's drivers. Just curious, did the quick setup instructions tell you to install the CD software before plugging in the Printer? If I remember correctly, that's how HP's stuff works and might have prevented your HP problems as well.
"CAUTION: Do not connect the USB cable until prompted to do so during software installation. HP recommends using a USB cable that is less than 3 m (10 feet) long."

http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/document?docname=c01525530&lc=en&dlc=en&cc=us&product=3645100&rule=37684&lang=en
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Contributr
No, I did not
jperlow Updated - 18th Dec 2008
... and how many people who buy a printer would even think to do that? Where on the unboxing is there a insert sheet with a big warning advisory not to hook up a cable first? Nowhere.

This is ONLY a problem on Vista. If you install the drivers on XP after the fact, this doesn't happen.
...connecting the USB cable. The fact others may not read the instructions in no way negates that it was your mistake that most likely led to the problem. I suspect it would have been better for your parents to install the AIO because they most likely would have followed the instructions.

And yes, HP makes this particular step prominent. The last AIO I installed made it so obvious I noticed it. It's not buried deep in the manual somewhere. I suspect it was on the set up poster that is included with the printer.

As for this being a problem unique to Vista and not XP how do you know? The installation instructions are the same for both. Did you install this on an XP system?

Regardless this is an HP/user issue. Not Vista. You should change the title to "How to ruin a perfectly good Sunday by not reading instructions" but somehow I doubt you'll do that.
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I FULLY agree with this.
jacobjohnn 30th Dec 2008
You should have captioned as above!

I run Vista Business N on my Fujitsu T4215 (4GB, 320GB) for 9 months now without facing any problems. In fact I face problems with Vista only when I install some sharewares, freewares (NO pirated software) etc and other software for experiments. Yes, I use McAfee, Spywareblaster, Spybot S&D, Windows Malware Detection tool and update them regularly and scan periodically. Without doing any of these and preventing the automatic upgrade, how can it be the OS problem? No software in the world is free from bugs, loopholes and backdoors.
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Doesn't Happen sometimes
DevGuy_z 18th Dec 2008
Whether XP or Vista, hardware vendors generally ask you to install the software first then attach the device. Doing so prevents Windows from installing a less optimal driver which you then may have to clean up.
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that's how it always is
coffeeshark 18th Dec 2008
Every single piece of USB-connected hardware is the same - install the software, then insert the USB cable, which will trigger the drivers.

Other than a few mice drivers, which will explicitly tell you when to connect the mouse first, this has been the same since XP.

You don't need a big colorful insert to tell you that if you're a halfway normal techie.
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re: No, I did not
Badgered 18th Dec 2008
No, I did not.. and how many people who buy a printer would even think to do that? Where on the unboxing is there a insert sheet with a big warning advisory not to hook up a cable first? Nowhere.

Even if it wasn't there, or you missed it, You're going to blame Vista for it? You are kidding right?
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Classic Perlow
WookieFan 18th Dec 2008
You all should check out his virtualization solution to a PC migration...

The fault here is totally with HP drivers, some of which (INCLUDING Win2K and XP drivers) are so bloated as to be ineffective. Half a gigabyte for a MF driver? Please. I work with XP PCs all day and I groan every time there's an HP printer involved with a service call.

This has been a universal problem with HP anything. If we want to redirect from the pop culture Vista-blaming to the deserved HP bloat blaming, please see how much crapware HP includes on their PCs and laptops. Their printers and MFs frequently have driver problems of all sorts, and can we all agree that making the cheapest choice is almost never the best choice?

Incredible that Vista was even a part of this headline.
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Hahah, Virtual Migration Article!
mikefarinha 18th Dec 2008
Heheh, I remember that boondoggle of an article! That was such a lame migration plan.
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It's usually a no brainer
devlin_X 18th Dec 2008
The way HP (and often other brands) pack their printers, when you first open the box the very first thing you see is a fold out step by step instructions, visually and textually showing you how and in what order to perform the set up. If you follow this you have no choice but doing it in the right order.



Its basic RTFM...
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And thats all good....
storm14k 18th Dec 2008
...except when the instructions don't work. I have an HP all in one that would not work on XP with plug and play and the driver disk would just hang on install....on any XP machine I tried. Maybe RTFM doesn't always work.
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Quoting Mr. Perlow's reply to reading instructions:
"No, I did not

... and how many people who buy a printer would even think to do that? Where on the unboxing is there a insert sheet with a big warning advisory not to hook up a cable first? Nowhere."


He mentioned there was no where that stated not to hook up the printer first., My reply was that if he followed the step by step poster size fold out set up instructions that you must remove from the box before you can remove anything else, he'd have seen in what order to do things in.

I wasn't saying it always worked but it is best to try the manufactures instructions FIRST.
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How Is This Vista's Fault???
plasticframedglasses 14th Feb 2009
Whose fault was it not to install the updates? Whose
fault was it not to install AV software? Definitely
not Vista... so how the hell did Vista exactly ruin
your perfectly good Sunday??? It didn't.

Look, if my car dies out on me in the middle of the
road because I didn't have it serviced when I was
supposed to, the car's not to blame.

Bashing Vista for your problems is so played out.

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