Matt Baxter-Reynolds
Windows RT tablets
The iPad
Matthew Miller
Best Argument: The iPad
Audience Favored: Windows RT tablets (84%)
The Rebuttal
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Great Debate Moderator
Mic check: Are my debaters standing by?
I'll be delivering my first question in our live rebuttal phase at 11am ET / 8am PT.
Posted by Steve Ranger
All set
Rarin to go
Matt Baxter-Reynolds
I am for Windows RT tablets
Side B is here, let's see if we can keep the Matt's straight today :)
Matthew Miller
I am for The iPad
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Great Debate Moderator
OK, first question:
Aren’t these both consumer devices? What’s the angle for business here?
Posted by Steve Ranger
BYOD rules
For the business generally, or for employees? For employees the iPad has consistently made fantastic sense for nearly three years operating in BYOD mode.
What we're seeing now is businesses wanting to use the iPad to deliver capability on devices that employees want to have with them anyway.Matt Baxter-Reynolds
I am for Windows RT tablets
Yes, but consumers are bringing more of their gear to the office
The iPad is popular with consumers and Microsoft has primarily showed how the new Surface is fun for kids and trendy people. However, there is some pretty compelling reasons to use the iPad at work, including working with Office documents, accessing files remotely, giving presentations, taking notes, capturing ideas, and much more. Businesses can purchase iPads for much less than a laptop and maintain control with a high level of security even easier than they can with a laptop.
The Surface hasn't yet arrived, but Microsoft already seems to be confusing the business angle by providing a version of Office for Students without a compelling app story. Business people may want to use Surface for the few include apps, but there is not yet thousands of compelling apps for the new ARM-based platform.Matthew Miller
I am for The iPad
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Great Debate Moderator
Aren’t tablets still very niche products for business?
Posted by Steve Ranger
Tablets are taking over
It's niche now, but my view is tablets will become as important as the desktop in a relatively short period of time.
Matt Baxter-Reynolds
I am for Windows RT tablets
Not anymore, usability is improving and people are "getting" it
Last year tablets were niche products and tablets outside the iPad may still be considered niche if we don't count the Amazon Kindle Fire and other ebook focused tablets. However with over 84 million iPads sold in the last 2+ years I would say the iPad is not a niche product in the mobile market. I haven't seen the breakdown in sales for business users, but in my personal experience there are plenty of iPads in the workplace.
Apple has an iPad for business website that has many different profiles and use cases showing some fairly compelling uses of the iPad in business.Matthew Miller
I am for The iPad
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Great Debate Moderator
What’s the stand-out enterprise feature of the iPad/Windows RT device?
Posted by Steve Ranger
Easy for developers
For me, it's easier for people familiar with developing enterprise software for the Windows stack to move into developing for Windows RT compared to developing for iPad.
Matt Baxter-Reynolds
I am for Windows RT tablets
Apps for the iPad, but also iOS familiarity and the closed system
The stand-out feature for the iPad is likely the apps, but the familiarity with iOS and the ease of app deployment may be even more important for the business world. Millions of people have the iPhone so extending that same experience on the iPad is natural and requires little training. There are many custom business apps developed in-house or by 3rd parties and Apple lets companies install these on employees tablets without putting them into the public App Store.
Apple's iOS is also tightly controlled and while the uber geeks don't like that, enterprise customers may. An environment that can be made secure and be controlled by the IT department is attractive for businesses.Matthew Miller
I am for The iPad
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Great Debate Moderator
Tablets live and die by the quality of the apps available.
Which is the winner here – the iPad or Windows RT?
Posted by Steve Ranger
Quality is what matters
Quality vs. quantity? iPad has the edge on quantity. Windows RT enough core apps available for it not to be an embarrassment out of the gate in a business setting. Over time, I don't think we'll see a difference in the quality of apps for business.
Matt Baxter-Reynolds
I am for Windows RT tablets
Clearly the iPad wins here, Microsoft hasn't really even touched the app story yet
There is no contest here that the iPad rules with apps, but that is largely due to the fact that the iPad has been out for more than 2 years. There are over 100,000 apps for the iPad, not counting the custom iPad solutions, and many of them are very high quality ones that help you get work done.
I understand Microsoft is just getting started with Windows RT, but they haven't told us anything about what other apps we can expect.Matthew Miller
I am for The iPad
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Great Debate Moderator
BYOD?
Thanks to BYOD consumers have a big say in which devices enterprises adopt. Which is likely to capture the hearts (and money) of the man in the street?
Posted by Steve Ranger
I'll be honest
iPad. Without doubt.
Matt Baxter-Reynolds
I am for Windows RT tablets
iPad has proven track record, Microsoft has a steep hill to climb and a story to tell
I think it is pretty clear that the iPad has done that so far, but with so many people using Windows computers at the office there is an opportunity for Microsoft to step in here. With the Microsoft focus on showing how the keyboard is so integrated with the Surface, I am not sure consumers will see much of a difference between their Windows laptop and a Surface so there is lots of work to be done to convince buyers.
Apple also has the iPhone association and Windows Phone has not yet shown any ability to gain much marketshare. If WP8 can do well, then I think there is more of a chance for Surface to succeed.Matthew Miller
I am for The iPad
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Great Debate Moderator
Which option do you think would be preferred by the IT department?
Is that different to what the end users would prefer?
Posted by Steve Ranger
Tough question
This one is tricky. We still don't know much about Microsoft's mobile device management (MDM) stuff by virtue of the fact that no one has Windows Phone or Windows RT devices and can't pilot it and try it.
My instinct would be that Microsoft's MDM story will be better coming out of the gate, but they're is already some maturity in this market on the iOS side.Matt Baxter-Reynolds
I am for Windows RT tablets
IT seems to favor Microsoft, but iPad apps are nearly there
My small business IT department head is a major fan of the Windows ecosystem and is already planning next year's laptop updates that will likely be replaced by Windows 8 Pro devices. At this time though, they are not planning to get Surface devices since there are limitations on the engineering apps we run and it isn't clear what apps employees will use with the Surface.
There are plenty of iPhone owners in my company and several iPad owners who use apps for CAD, engineering spreadsheets, and more. So the apps are there now on the iPad, but IT hasn't embraced Apple products so there may be an IT vs. end user debate ahead.Matthew Miller
I am for The iPad
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Great Debate Moderator
Smartphone influence?
How does the existence of iPhones and Windows Phone 8 smartphones change the calculation around which tablets to invest in?
Posted by Steve Ranger
No, No
Not for me, no. For me tablets and smartphones are used very differently. Smartphones are a "glance" device - something you look at to quickly grab information or shoot off an email. Tablets are something you actually work with. I think we'll find people who are happy to mix and match the platforms.
Of course, we already know about the halo effect for Apple. I can see a similar halo effect for Windows - thus is someone is in love with their Windows tablet, they'll be inclined to buy into Windows Phone.Matt Baxter-Reynolds
I am for Windows RT tablets
Application cost savings in iOS, along with familiarity of the UI
I think smartphones associated with tablets are important, especially when Apple lets you purchase apps to use on both the iPad and iPhone that helps save the company money. It currently appears that Windows owners will have to purchase separate apps for Windows 8, Windows RT, and Windows Phone 8.
Windows Phone is still only at around 3% of the smartphone market, even after two years, and it is not clear whether or not WP8 will change that trend. On the other hand, employees continue to buy the iPhone by the millions and this will likely be reflected in the type of tablet they buy for familiarity.Matthew Miller
I am for The iPad
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Great Debate Moderator
Does the excitement around the iPad mini change the calculation at all?
Posted by Steve Ranger
Apple's halo effect
Not for me, no. For me tablets and smartphones are used very differently. Smartphones are a "glance" device - something you look at to quickly grab information or shoot off an email. Tablets are something you actually work with. I think we'll find people who are happy to mix and match the platforms.
Of course, we already know about the halo effect for Apple. I can see a similar halo effect for Windows - thus is someone is in love with their Windows tablet, they'll be inclined to buy into Windows Phone. We'll see about the iPad mini very soon.Matt Baxter-Reynolds
I am for Windows RT tablets
Smaller may work well for field workers, lower price may be attractive for enterprise
If the rumored iPad mini comes in at a very low price, as believed, then I can see companies buying them and deploying them even more than the iPad. If the display is larger than other 7 inch tablets then it may be quite useful with the iPad apps. The smaller size may also make it a more attractive portable solution for workers, especially those field workers who find the full size iPad too large.Matthew Miller
I am for The iPad
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Great Debate Moderator
Windows RT won’t run a lot of legacy apps. Is that going to be a sticking point?
Posted by Steve Ranger
Won't be missed
It'll trip people up, but I don't think it'll be a big problem in business. (It'll lead to returns in consumer-land, and some embarrassment in corporates.)
People will expect a tablet to behave like a tablet. I think it'll be rare that people will have a desire to run Old Windows classic desktop apps on a tablet, even on x86 tablets that can actually do it.Matt Baxter-Reynolds
I am for Windows RT tablets
Yes, and Apple should capitalize on that
I think there is still a lot of confusion about Windows RT and Windows 8 and believe we will see many buyers return RT devices once they realize they cannot run their Windows apps. Microsoft needs to tell the app story around RT if it wants to succeed in the enterprise with this platform. Apple already has thousands of apps that people use in business and should show the stark contrast between the iPad and Windows RT.
Matthew Miller
I am for The iPad
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Great Debate Moderator
Does the keyboard give Surface the edge?
Posted by Steve Ranger
They're clunky
On the face of it, yes. But I personally don't believe in keyboards on tablets. A tablet is designed to transcend traditional usage patterns. But a keyboard on it, it's heavier, and you need a desk to use it. Adrian Kingsley-Hughes wrote a great article on this.
Matt Baxter-Reynolds
I am for Windows RT tablets
May actually take the edge off as people view it as just another laptop
The keyboard looks like a good idea, but I haven't yet used one to see how functional it is. Companies like ZAGG have been refining iPad keyboards for a couple of years and their current generation is fantastic. I don't think there is much of an edge with plenty of keyboard solutions available for the iPad.
The keyboard may actually deter from the Surface a bit and give people the impression that it is a laptop replacement, when it clearly is not.Matthew Miller
I am for The iPad
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Great Debate Moderator
Familiar with Windows?
Enterprises are familiar with supporting and developing for Windows. Isn’t that a big selling point for RT based devices, especially from a cost point of view?
Posted by Steve Ranger
Look at Microsoft's track record
Yes, presuming the tools end up fitting what the market needs. To be fair, that's something Microsoft usually gets right, especially in the enterprise space.
Matt Baxter-Reynolds
I am for Windows RT tablets
May be helpful thanks to core similarity in Windows 8 and Windows Phone 8
Not in my opinion. Windows RT is a bit different beast and will require development efforts to get apps on Surface devices. I understand that core behind Windows 8, Windows RT, and Windows Phone 8 is the same which should help all platforms in the long run, but developers are going to have to see success by Microsoft with RT. After over two years of the iPad in the market, we see plenty of examples of companies developing and rolling out apps for the tablet.Matthew Miller
I am for The iPad
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Great Debate Moderator
OK, 2 more questions...quickly...
Plenty of enterprises have already invested in the iPad. Is that a factor to consider here?
Posted by Steve Ranger
That's my biggest fear
Yes. That's my main concern about the Windows tablets. Has the iPad got past a tipping point where it becomes the de facto standard and enterprises will "look weird" for deploying Windows rather than iPad as their tablet strategy.
Matt Baxter-Reynolds
I am for Windows RT tablets
Yes, two years of investment is nothing to shake a stick at
Yes, the iPad is a proven product and enterprise customers can trust that Apple will continue to develop the iPad and support it for years. Microsoft doesn't necessarily have a proven track record in the mobile space and has shown they can kill a project quickly if they want.
Matthew Miller
I am for The iPad
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Great Debate Moderator
Last question:
Surface RT is being aimed at the consumer market, lacking elements such as Outlook. Wouldn’t enterprises be better waiting for Surface Pro?
Posted by Steve Ranger
Vote for Windows RT!
Surface Pro, and devices from the other OEM partners that are x86 based are really just laptops with touch capability. There appears to be a "x86 tax", adding about 50% to the weight. (So a 600g unit ends up being nearly 1kg.) That's a big problem for a tablet. They also lose out heavily in that being "normal Windows" they have to be managed in terms of malware, whereas ARM tablets don't.
My advice is that if you really think you need an x86, ultraportable laptop with touch, go ahead and get that sort of device. If you want a tablet-tablet, choose iPad or a Windows RT device.Matt Baxter-Reynolds
I am for Windows RT tablets
Definitely, what's compelling enough about RT not to wait for Windows 8?
Definitely, when I talk with people the first thing they say is that they cannot wait to run their Windows apps on a high powered tablet with long battery life and new form factor. I haven't yet seen a compelling reason why a business customer would purchase a Surface RT device over a Surface Pro and Microsoft isn't helping by telling a confusing story about Office on Surface RT. Also, the commercial we have seen so far shows younger people dancing around with the Surface, not working on it doing anything productive.Matthew Miller
I am for The iPad
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Great Debate Moderator
Thanks for a Great Debate, Matt and Matt!
And readers, be sure to check back here tomorrow for the two Matts' closing arguments and Thursday for my final verdict.
Posted by Steve Ranger
Thanks Steve and Matt
It is an interesting time as people start to fit in tablets to their work and home environments. There is a long way to go and I look forward to the competition.
Matthew Miller
I am for The iPad
Talkback
RT is the future
YOur confused
Actually, Windows RT does support the Windows desktop ...
The lack of compatibility is the biggest challenge for Windows notebook users who use the iPad as an auxiliary device.
Nope
And as it is now a business, you don't need anything else than MS Office. Every game, every third party application are OUT. They are not needed, or wanted.
Windows 8 RT + MS Office + Physical keyboard is the business tool. But only idiot buys Windows 8 RT tablet then, as notebook is MUCH better choice right away from that point, especially if you need MS Office for typing instead just presentations.
But why do I need MS-Office....
But what about Win8 apps>
Actually, Windows RT does support the Windows desktop
The lack of compatibility is the biggest challenge for Windows notebook users who use the iPad as an auxiliary device.
yes
yes but
that's the thing, you don't want your developers to learn/buy new stuff, etc, etc.
ozinanoypi, What are you suggesting?
Do you think businesses are going to decide, well since there is some learning, we might as well jump into cocoa and objective-C and buy Macs for the whole place?