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Hardware 2.0

Adrian Kingsley-Hughes

NVIDIA accuses AMD of Catalyst driver "questionable optimizations" to improve benchmark results

By | November 22, 2010, 5:55am PST

Summary: NVIDIA is accusing AMD of carrying out “questionable optimizations” to its Catalyst drivers in order to gain an unfair advantage over GeForce hardware in benchmark testing.

NVIDIA is accusing AMD of carrying out “questionable optimizations” to its Catalyst drivers in order to gain an unfair advantage over GeForce hardware in benchmark testing.

NVIDIA’s Technical Marketing Director Nick Stam explains in a blog post:

Important Benchmarking Issues and Questionable Optimizations
We are writing this blog post to bring broader attention to some very important image quality findings uncovered recently by top technology Web sites including ComputerBase, PC Games Hardware, Tweak PC, and 3DCenter.org. They all found that changes introduced in AMD’s Catalyst 10.10 default driver settings caused an increase in performance and a decrease in image quality. These changes in AMD’s default settings do not permit a fair apples-to-apples comparison to NVIDIA default driver settings. NVIDIA GPUs provide higher image quality at default driver settings, which means comparative AMD vs. NVIDIA testing methods need to be adjusted to compensate for the image quality differences.

So what’s going on here? Well, the accusation is that AMD has lowered the image quality of the “Quality” setting to the point that users have to select the “High” setting in the Catalyst AI texture filtering options in order to get an image quality close to that offered by the default setting for NVIDIA’s drivers.

The affect on performance of this change seems to add up to seems to mean a 10% advantage to AMD, which is far from insignificant.

This issue affects Catalyst drivers 10.10 and 10.11 (the last two releases) and the 5800- and 6000-series GPUs.

TweakPC has posted some videos (it helps if you translate the page or can read German …) showing the difference between the two setting and on AMD and NVIDIA hardware, and the difference is noticeable. Initial testing that I’ve carried out also supports the findings.

Currently awaiting response from AMD. Will update you as soon as I have more.

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Adrian Kingsley-Hughes is an internationally published technology author who has devoted over a decade to helping users get the most from technology.

Disclosure

Adrian Kingsley-Hughes

All opinions expressed on Hardware 2.0 are those of Adrian Kingsley-Hughes. Every effort is made to ensure that the information posted is accurate. If you have any comments, queries or corrections, please contact Adrian via the email link here. Any possible conflicts of interest will be posted below. [Updated: February 23, 2010] - Adrian Kingsley-Hughes has no business relationships, affiliations, investments, or other actual/potential conflicts of interest relating to the content posted so far on this blog.

Biography

Adrian Kingsley-Hughes

Adrian Kingsley-Hughes is an internationally published technology author who has devoted over a decade to helping users get the most from technology -- whether that be by learning to program, building a PC from a pile of parts, or helping them get the most from their new MP3 player or digital camera.

Adrian has authored/co-authored technical books on a variety of topics, ranging from programming to building and maintaining PCs. His most recent books include "Build the Ultimate Custom PC", "Beginning Programming" and "The PC Doctor's Fix It Yourself Guide". He has also written training manuals that have been used by a number of Fortune 500 companies.

Adrian also runs a popular blog under the name The PC Doctor, where he covers a range of computer-related topics -- from security to repairing and upgrading.

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RE: NVIDIA accuses AMD of Catalyst driver
xinterix 26th Nov 2010
I highly doubt that General Motors would accuse Ford of tweaking the fuel injectors in their new model mustang so that it out performs better then one of chevy's cars. All they would be doing is hurting themselves by making thew public more aware that AMD scores better benchmarks. Rather then wining and crying about the whole thing, perhaps Nvidia needs to go back to the drawing board and do some tweaking of their own. IT'S CALLED COMPETITION. GET USED TO IT NVIDIA!!!
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Pot calling kettle? (nt)
Economister 22nd Nov 2010
nt
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@Economister Just what I was thinking. NVidia used to do the exact same thing on a regular basis when a new benchmark hit the streets.
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RE: NVIDIA accuses AMD of Catalyst driver
j-mccurdy@... Updated - 22nd Nov 2010
@LeeC
Used to is not the same as doing it now. When Nvidia did it they got called on it. AMD is no better, what should they get a break because they're AMD? And not those meanies from Nvidia.
Also ATI did it first with a Quake benchmark and game.
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@LeeC Yep, they used to do it all the time. And they sill often rig benchmarks by only sending cards to reviewers they know to be bias towards them.
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RE: NVIDIA accuses AMD of Catalyst driver
j-mccurdy@... 22nd Nov 2010
@Economister
If AMD is doing it and Nvidia isn't, then that's hardly a case of the pot calling the kettle black. AMD- FTL
If Nvidia was doing it too, they wouldn't be saying anything.
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OH Shame....you poor lttle Nvidia...don't the other kids want top play with you anymore?
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who does the testing? the testing entities should have this discrepency covered. if not, then they are lame.
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RE: NVIDIA accuses AMD of Catalyst driver
luckyducky7@... 22nd Nov 2010
Well- if you're reading a graphics card review nowdays, you aren't just looking at 3Dmark scores. You're looking at real-world gaming performance.

Do we get to accuse you of stacking these benchmarks with your "Plays best on Nvidia" games?
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Nvidia: I don't think I really care... I'm going to keep using my Radeon and FireGL cards.
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RE: NVIDIA accuses AMD of Catalyst driver
LeeC Updated - 22nd Nov 2010
LOL, you point out that NVidia did this in the past, and some "sucker of the male genetalia" flags the comment as Spam... butthurt NVidia fanboys much.

http://www.geek.com/articles/games/futuremark-confirms-nvidia-is-cheating-in-benchmark-20030523/
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@LeeC That was over 7 years ago.. I think alot has changed since then.
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@Simba7
We have a saying in India - "After eating a 100 rats the cat is going to Haj for pilgrimage".
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Be very wary of all benchmark results!
I am Gorby 22nd Nov 2010
It's been going on for as long as there have been benchmarks!

If your marketing relies on you being the fastest, etc, then you will do anything to make it the "fastest". Fastest does not mean the best performer in real life situations.

Many products have been "optimized" for benchmark use. Oracle databases ran differently (and quite a bit faster) when running TPC benchmarks. Internet Explorer 9 runs faster (junk code optimization) in benchmarks. Who else?

If your PR requires winning benchmarks, then you will do so. I rarely trust standard benchmarks, and definitely not those run by the vendor.
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There is a reason that testers use several benchmarks and games to test a graphics card, to do away with this optimization. And Nvidia is as guilty as AMD in doing this, funny they point to testers that use a select few software and games to testn the cards, I will take the word of Tom's Hardware and Extreme Tech before I trust these places for a review of products.
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RE: NVIDIA accuses AMD of Catalyst driver
j-mccurdy@... 22nd Nov 2010
@Rndmacts
Extreme Tech, is a joke
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RE: NVIDIA accuses AMD of Catalyst driver
j-mccurdy@... 22nd Nov 2010
AMD needs to cheat, they sure as hell can't consistently make good reliable drivers. Both company's are capable of a bad driver but, AMD drivers are far worse.
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@j-mccurdy@...

I agree with you entirely !!!! Have had nothing but trouble with them. Apart from this their chip sets suck big time.
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RE: NVIDIA accuses AMD of Catalyst driver
j-mccurdy@... 22nd Nov 2010
@pmshah@... I have Nvidia chipset motherboard, unfortunately their chipsets sucked too. I like SLI though so I had to have it. haven't moved up to X58 yet. I still haven't got all my use out of my Q9550 and my 780i yet.
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I still remember the move nVidia made when the first F.E.A.R. game was in production. I'm quite sure (but without any proof) they paid the producers to reduce FPS on ATI cards. Simply by renaming the executable, you could gain an extra 20FPS with an ATI card. A well documented phenomenon. Those nVidia folks are scumbags. If this whole thing is just a game to them, then this certainly isn't "the way it's meant to be played".
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I highly doubt that General Motors would accuse Ford of tweaking the fuel injectors in their new model mustang so that it out performs better then one of chevy's cars. All they would be doing is hurting themselves by making thew public more aware that AMD scores better benchmarks. Rather then wining and crying about the whole thing, perhaps Nvidia needs to go back to the drawing board and do some tweaking of their own. IT'S CALLED COMPETITION. GET USED TO IT NVIDIA!!!

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